Whose job is it to clear the fenceline?

[Laura Workman]

Ok, here's the situation. We bought some property about an hour and a half from where we live. The north 300 feet of it borders on an old dairy farm where there are currently no cattle. They've been haying the fields for at least the last 10 years. On our side of that 300-foot fenceline is woods. In some places, it's very dense woods. There are also some areas along the fenceline that are soggy much of the year. We haven't paid any attention to the fenceline for the past five years we owned the property. After all, we don't have any animals back there. I'm betting the old drunk who lived there for at least a decade before us never touched the fenceline either.

Anyway, at some point, some trees fell over the fence, like maybe 3 or four trees. They were over the fence when we bought the place five years ago. Some undergrowth has naturally grown up under and around the fallen trees. Our neighbors to the north kept cutting hay right along, just cutting around the growing underbrush.

Well, this year, they've decided to put some cattle on the land, and for that they need a working fence. Tonight we got a phone call in which they asked us to clear the brush out of their pasture so the guy they've hired to fix their fence can access the fence. They also want us to clear a space on our side of the fenceline to be sure nothing touches the fence. They'd like us to do this in the next few weeks. They think it's our responsibility to keep the property line clear. I'm thinking that if we were mighty nice and had lots of time and money to spend on being neighborly, we could maybe give them a hand clearing the line. But I don't think we're under any obligation whatsoever to do so.

My thinking is this. We will probably want a working fence on the north property line, but it is in no way a priority. I think if they want their pasture cleared, they should clear it. If they want a working fence, they should build one. If that requires cutting trees that have fallen onto their land, they should cut some trees, back to their property line. I'm just not feeling any obligation to spend time and money clearing their pasture or making sure none of the vegetation on my land touches their new fence. To tell the truth, it made me kind of angry that she implied it was my responsibility to clear the fenceline and keep it cleared. Am I messed up?

I mean, we've got several hundred feet of fence where we live (different property than the one with dairy neighbors), and if plants come across from the neighbor's place, we cut them back. A tree fell on the neighbor's property and lifted our fence off the ground, ripping a post up. We cut the root and fixed the fence. Not the neighbor's problem, since they have no interest in having the fence there. What do you guys think?

[MAC]

1. You are right in that you don't have to do anything about the fence.
2. The day will come when you'll wish you had done something about it.

It's not prudent to upset established neighbors. Believe me, I know!

[texican]

If they need a fence now, let them build it. If you want one later, you might want to help out with wire and a little help.

I've got several miles of fence. Part of it's maintained, as it has cows and goats on my side of the property. But about half is on forested land...and it's very rare that any of my pine trees stray... The fences with cattle on each side get repaired regularly, esp. after strong winds...either my uncle or myself will walk the fences...whichever has more time available... The ancient falling down fences around the pine plantation get walked maybe once a year.

You might have some obligations if you have large trees near the fenceline, and they're falling over... haven't ever been asked to cut brush out of the neighbors pasture...that's a 'good one'...hope you don't fall for it.

in the end remember the old saw about good fence make good neighbors......

[GREEN_ALIEN]

How do Laura,

With part of your post, be careful. It has been long established here in WA that if your tree falls on an ajecent property you are the party responsible for removal. That more or less applies even if the tree fell prior to your purchase.

As for the rest, their problem.

GA (Ted)

[GRHE]

Laura, I would say that you are responsible for the down trees, not any brush under the tree. As for clearing your side of the fence line, it depends on where the property line is and the relationship of the property line to the fence. It would sound like they are planning to put up electric fence and don't want brush into it. If the brush/trees are on your side and reach over in a way that would interfere, you should probably clear it. If it is on their side, their problem. If they simply want it to be easier for them to work the fence, then either tell them no, or if you would like the fence, give them permission to clear the line, but they must do it.

P.S. fencing is expensive, so if they are looking at putting it in and it would help you too, then try not to be offensive about any not helping, but it's not up to you to use your time, money, and efforts because they want something. Even though I would say the downed trees may be your's, they've lived with it for years, you have no need to ask how high just because they shout JUMP!

[bare]

It's pretty well "Code of the West" here that a fence between neighbors is shared. I believe they are being pretty reasonable to ask you to clear your fallen trees from their side of the fence and to clear your side just a bit. It doesn't take all that much to do it either. About as fast as you can walk with a chainsaw. As you are going along you can keep an eye out for dead trees that are going to fall in the next couple years and take care of them too. It helps to have two people, one to saw and another to toss brush, but you can cover a lot of ground in a hurry.

Technically I believe that they could charge you for half of the materials and labor to put the fence in good repair and actually win in court, so I think I'd reconsider and do some clearing.

Everybody knows that good fences make good neighbors.

[BeesNBunnies]

I'm not sure on the law in your state(check with you local county extension agent to find out)but I'm fairly familiar with the law in Texas. You are responsible for stuff on your side of the fence. Now what is supposed to happen is that neighbors split costs on fixing fence. What actually happens is that the one that gives a dang ends up footing the whole bill. To me a lot would depend on the manner in which they 'asked' you to do it. If it was a demand delivered in a not too nice manner it would tend to get my dander up and I'd dig in my heels. Being a good neighbor works both ways. If they were reasonable and neighborly about it I would probably pitch in whether the law required it or not. Safest bet is to contact someone who knows for sure so you don't end up on the wrong end of a lawsuit.

[mrglock27]

If I was in your situation I would cut up the trees that fell from your property onto their's. Hopefully you own a chainsaw. And throw the wood onto your property. Then go along the fenceline with a handsaw and pruners on your side. You should be able to do it in a weekend, easily. Tell them to clean the underbrush on their side.

[Ken Scharabok]

As noted above check with your local ag agent on what is both the law and what is local customs as far as fences are concerned. For example you might be required to split the cost since both of you benefit. My thinking is to try to reach some compromise with them. For example, you will remove the fallen trees if you can make a couple of brushpiles on their property for later burning. If the old fencing hasn't been maintained for some time, likely it is a case of total removal and replacement. You might offer to let them pretty well clear cut 3-4 feet back of your property line and then be able to maintain it in that condition, with the clear understanding you are not granting them an easement per se. 300' is only the length of a football field.

I strongly recommend you not allow the stapling of fence wire to any of your trees immediately on the property line. They can put a t-post in front or just to the side of it.

[Alice In TX/MO]

In Missouri, if both neighbors have livestock, they are required by law to share the cost of the fence.

If only one has livestock, and his neighbor refuses to share the cost, the following applies -- A landowner building the entire division fence must report the total cost to the associate circuit judge, who will authorize the cost to be recorded on each neighbor's deed. If your neighbor later places livestock against the division fence, then the landowner who built the entire division fence can get reimbursed for one-half the construction costs. See Chapter 272.060.1 and Chapter 272.132 of the new Missouri statute.
Under the prior law, either neighbor could force the other neighbor to pay for half of both the construction and the maintenance of a division fence, regardless of whether the reluctant neighbor had livestock against the fence. This continues to be the fencing law in most Midwestern states.

Sounds like you need to take a deep breath and do some research on the law in your state.

[johnghagen]

In Illinois you are reponsiable for half the cost of the fence and removal of the brush trees ect. That have fallen so all they want is you to clean up the trees then do it .You do not have to maintain your side of the growth and the fence needs to be on there side wire toward your place

[milkstoolcowboy]

You'd have to check the local laws, but around here line fence is shared responsibility of both landowners (The old saying "Meet your neighbor at the middle of the property line, what's to the right is yours to build and maintain.") whether you have any livestock or not.

[Mike in Ohio]

In Ohio, if it is a line fence (there are specific requirements and restrictions) then you are responsible for half the cost of maintaining it. On the other hand, if you have trees that are in a condition that is likely to cause them to damage the fence then you may be responsible for 100% of the cost of repairing the damage.

In practice it gets messy.

If it is their fence (not a line fence) and your falling trees damaged it then you are 100% responsible for the damages. This would be no different than if your neighbors tree fell on your house.

What happens (regarding fences and the law) at your house in an urban or suburban setting really has nothing to do with what the law or custom is in a rural area. You need to check the (agricultural/rural) fence laws for your state.

My suggestion (As others have indicated) that you cut up and remove the trees back to your side of the property line. If a couple weeks is impractical for you then try to figure out a reasonable timeframe. Your neighbor might have given you more notice but that is a different issue.

As far as clearing back the brush on your side of the fence, it would certainly cut back on neighbor problems.

Mike

[Michael W. Smith]

A little friendliness goes a loooooooooong way in making good neighbors!!!! Yes, currently it is a pain for you to have to go to the property, clean up the fallen trees, clean up brush along the property line, etc. But, if you do plan on moving out there sometime, doing this will certainly help in you being "accepted" into the neighborhood. And especially if you do plan on getting animals in the future, they have already agreed to pay and put up 300' of fence that you won't have to!!!!!

If however, you don't plan on moving there, then you can simply call them and tell them that the fencing is totally their problem. But you sure won't be making "points" with them.

Did you ever think they were afraid to clear the trees themselves, because of the possibility of you finding out and trying to sue them for damaging your trees, or cutting down trees on your property?

Sorry, Laura, but I think you have a good deal there, and are risking throwing it away and creating problems for in the future! Why not go up for a weekend and throw a "brush cleaning party". Invite the neighbor putting up the fence and have some food & drink. You might actually find out that your neighbor is a good friend!

[BearCreekFarm]

Laura- as others have said, you need to do some research to see what the law is in your state. But, beyond that, in most states, you are absolutely obligated to keep any trees from your property off the neighbors property, whether it is fenced or not, and if your trees fall on the neighbor's fence you are obligated to clear the trees and repair any damage. You should do so willingly- why make it tough on your neighbor to keep up his fences? Just because they haven't needed the fence for the past 5 years doesn't mean it is ok to let your trees fall on them. I'd spend a weekend up there clearing the way for them. Having a good fence in place will add to the value of your property whether you actually use it or not.

I am new to the Midwest and don't like the law here which requires both neighbors to split the cost of the fence- that's ok if both have livestock, but I should not be forced to pay for half of something I have no use for. I think Missouri has the right idea, as Rose posted. I hope for your sake that your state doesn't require you to split the cost. If the law does call for that, then your neighbor is being pretty generous in not asking you to pay up.

[rambler]

You are a little messed up.

You are responible for any trees with the trunk on your property that fell across. you are responsible for cleaning those up. You should be responsible for any damage done to the fence as well. Yes that is difficult to determine if it is an old fallen over fence to start with.... Sounds like the neighbors are being nice & overlooking that part?

In many states, you are responible for the cost of 1/2 the fence. Sounds like the neighbor is being nice & not charging you for that. As soon as you put livestock on your side of this fence, you better walk over to the neighbor with a check & expect to pay 1/2 of what that section cost to build. Anything less is wrong of you.

Now, any growth growing _in_ your neighbors property is not yours, you do not need to clean any of that up.

If someday you want a fence there, you sure have a sour attitude about this. I'd be real careful, if you make poor relations on this today, you will never enjoy living there.

At least live up to your responsibilities on this - clear the fallen trees. Don't be surprised to have to pay for some bit of fencing material from tree damage. Pay for 1/2 the fence when you start using it, if not (legally) sooner.

I'm sure it was all in the presentation & so on. Probably your neighbor didn't have the best tact. And it sounds like they are expecting more cleanup from you than is required. Makes you feel stepped on, just how this was dropped on you.

But you are on the hook for some of this. Own up to it.

--->Paul

[wy_white_wolf]

Originally Posted by Mike in Ohio

...If it is their fence (not a line fence) and your falling trees damaged it then you are 100% responsible for the damages. This would be no different than if your neighbors tree fell on your house...

In Wyoming it may still be there responsibility. The wind blew one of my trees onto the neighbors truck and house. Both mine and his insurance ruled it and act of God and his paid the repair bill on the truck and house and removal of what was on his property. Mine paid for the removal of what was on property and paid me the value of the tree.

I did feel bad about it being that way but it was by the way the law is wrote here. I did use the money from the tree to pay his deductable.

[Ken Scharabok]

I suggest driving up and meeting the neighbors at the fence. Walk the length discussing exactly what they are expecting. As noted, they may just want you cleaning up any trees which have fallen onto their property. As for new growth brush in their field, I suspect that is their responsibility under any circumstances.

#1. Good fences make good neighbors.
#2. Good neighbors make good fences.

[SteveD(TX)]

If it was your trees that damaged the fence, you need to do the right thing and remove the fence and underbrush on your side. If they are offering to pay to fix the fence, they are doing more than theif fair share IMO. I don't think you are obligated though, to remove anything that might touch or fall on the fence in the future. But I would do it anyway if it's an easy fix.

[WisJim]

In Wisconsin, as in many other states, state law says that you are responsible for 1/2 of the fence. The law specifies how to determine which half, too. It is either the left half or right half as you face the neighbors--leaving them with the other half to deal with. The law also specifies the minimum legal requirements for the fence, such as height, number of wires, etc.
Your county agent should know what is required where the land is.

Jim

Jim