Windmill Generator questions

[mountaingirl]

I am thinking now of asking the landlord of the house I propose to rent for a windmill generator, I found this info on the net:

Also available are smaller windmills, costing from $500 to $1,000, which produce from 100 to 400 watts. They are also ideal to provide electricity to an outdoor shed or cabin. Often, they are mounted on boats to provide electricity and keep the batteries fully charged.

18/11 gowth cycle: Could look at flourescents but do they provide as much 'sunlight' as a 250w growbulb? and could I run pc/tv while on?

washing machine specs: elec supply: 240v ac 50hz. Motor: 600w. Pump: 34w.

TV 105w.

PC: dont know, its a normal box with a 17 inch monitor.

Sattelite System dont know at mo.

thanks........

What windmill gen would I need?


I'll do without a fridge and buy a propane one eventually. Can I convert my fridge to propane?

[mightybooboo]

I think a sat only draws something like 35 watts.Interesting,it draws that same power whether its on or turned off.So unplug the thing if its on a battery 12 volt DC to 120 AC volt inverter.Of course,turn off the inverter too,they draw power even when not providing electric for use.I will let the folks who actually use wind answer the question real world,but Ive HEARD that getting good power from a windmill like the air400 requires a pretty serious/consistent wind.

BooBoo

[mightybooboo]

Originally Posted by mountaingirl

I'll do without a fridge and buy a propane one eventually. Can I convert my fridge to propane?

No,but the answer was already given I think.Find a used propane/120volt RV refer,best bang for the buck for a purchase I would imagine.

BooBoo

[mightybooboo]

Originally Posted by mountaingirl

TV 105w.

Tv will need a quick burst of higher wattage to start.They do an automatic degauss (Just accept it, lol!) at start-up.

Basically,you need about 2000 watts to do what you want,be it from the utility,the generator or inverter.Using the numbers you have given in postings to this point.

Anyone care to comment if Im wrong? 2000 just sounds sufficient to me.

BooBoo

[WisJim]

Originally Posted by mountaingirl

I am thinking now of asking the landlord of the house I propose to rent for a windmill generator, I found this info on the net:

Also available are smaller windmills, costing from $500 to $1,000, which produce from 100 to 400 watts. They are also ideal to provide electricity to an outdoor shed or cabin. Often, they are mounted on boats to provide electricity and keep the batteries fully charged.

What windmill gen would I need?

I'll do without a fridge and buy a propane one eventually. Can I convert my fridge to propane?

A $1000 wind generator would provide enough power for some lights and occassional use of your radio, depending of course on the wind.
You need to do some basic research into wind and solar energy, figure out what your actual loads are, and check with some dealers of the equipment for prices of complete systems, which should be specifically designed for your situation, considering both the site and your lifestyle.

Jim

[wy_white_wolf]

The wind generator is only a small prtion of the cost. You will also need batteries, charge controller, inverter just to name a few. A complete system using an air-x (new 403) can easily run $5000.

I'd look at cutting the power consumption as much as possible. I just bought an 11" LCD tv that only requires 13 watts to start and 9 watts to run. every dollar spent on reducing the load is equal to about $4 system cost.

One thing I'd look at is taking the laundry to town once a week or so. that saves not only the power of running the washer but also pumping the water for it.

[gilberte]

I've asked this before but got no responses. I understand that in some areas if you have a wind generator you can hook into the power supplied by the electric company. When the wind is blowing and you are generating more power than you are using, your meter runs backward (the electric company is buying your power) and when there is no wind, you use the electric company power. Anyone have any experience with this?

[wy_white_wolf]

Originally Posted by gilberte

I've asked this before but got no responses. I understand that in some areas if you have a wind generator you can hook into the power supplied by the electric company. When the wind is blowing and you are generating more power than you are using, your meter runs backward (the electric company is buying your power) and when there is no wind, you use the electric company power. Anyone have any experience with this?

Yes that can be done. Check out the net metering laws for you state. I haven't done that but you need to meet the safety requirements for you electric company. You wouldn't want to electricute some guy working on the line when the power is out.

[wy0mn]

Average wind velocity in your area will determine your output too.
My genny achieves 500w output ONLY after hitting a set velocity, the setup can power emergency lights, a portable tv, a micro-fridge, and a few radios. THATS ALL.
It will not carry the house, nor run the microwave not any other major appliance. (460AH of storage)
If you want to do those things you'll need several windmills and some solar (PV) backup.
I'm not trying to be a wet blanket, just truthful.
First off, lose anything that you don't need, really need. ELIMINATE phantom loads.
You have the dream, now plan accordingly...
Read & study...

[Gary in ohio]

Power in and power out. Dont forget, The windmill is just part of the system. Your going to need to put the power you generate somewhere. That means batteries. Now you need to get it out of the batters and into the the device you want to run. If they are 120v items you need an inverter. Again more cost.

Depending on where you live, wind can work. but you have to have a fairly strong wind to start the low end windmills. Check out http://rredc.nrel.gov/wind/pubs/atlas/


yes they use them on boats. Often to keep batteries topped off when they are gone for long periods of time and while under sail.

Originally Posted by mountaingirl

I am thinking now of asking the landlord of the house I propose to rent for a windmill generator, I found this info on the net:

Also available are smaller windmills, costing from $500 to $1,000, which produce from 100 to 400 watts. They are also ideal to provide electricity to an outdoor shed or cabin. Often, they are mounted on boats to provide electricity and keep the batteries fully charged.

18/11 gowth cycle: Could look at flourescents but do they provide as much 'sunlight' as a 250w growbulb? and could I run pc/tv while on?

washing machine specs: elec supply: 240v ac 50hz. Motor: 600w. Pump: 34w.

TV 105w.

PC: dont know, its a normal box with a 17 inch monitor.

Sattelite System dont know at mo.

thanks........

What windmill gen would I need?


I'll do without a fridge and buy a propane one eventually. Can I convert my fridge to propane?

[mountaingirl]

Originally Posted by WisJim

A $1000 generator would provide enough power for some lights and occassional use of your radio, depending of course on the wind.
You need to do some basic research into wind and solar energy, figure out what your actual loads are, and check with some dealers of the equipment for prices of complete systems, which should be specifically designed for your situation, considering both the site and your lifestyle.

Jim

Yep, well I am going to met the owner there on Saturday, they have a genny but what I know not which. I hope its not some really noisy thing and that its affordable to use and efficient for the job.

Im told I need at least 2500/3000 w genn.
someone else said 20kw unit 1800rpm diesel.

Prob is I know naught of these things.

I know a man in the mountains who might be able to help. he sells spare parts from old cars in a field beside his house. I'll ask him to make me a windmill out of old parts. so I'll add that to the genn and buy solar panels when I can

[rambler]

Originally Posted by gilberte

I've asked this before but got no responses. I understand that in some areas if you have a wind generator you can hook into the power supplied by the electric company. When the wind is blowing and you are generating more power than you are using, your meter runs backward (the electric company is buying your power) and when there is no wind, you use the electric company power. Anyone have any experience with this?

Not exactly. you need to negociate a buy-back contract. The power company will _not_ let you just spin the meter backwards. They buy power at wholesale prices, and that is the most you will get - their wholesale cost. So you will have a second meter for reverse flow and get, what, 2/3 or so the cost of what power costs you.

You also need to have failsafe interconnection so power does not flow out the lines if the line goes dead - keeps from frying a lineworker as mentioned.

In Minnesota the utility _must_ offer you this hookup at going wholesale rates. Not every state has such regulations, but most do of some sort.

But, you can't just make the meter run backwards exactly......

--->Paul

[Quint]

I'd bet you could hack that sat box to get it to run on DC.

[mountaingirl]

Originally Posted by farminghandyman

you will need a lot more then a 500 watt generator,

wind generators are rated at there max out put,

and on small ones that could be 45 mph winds, or in some cases more,

and in "normal" winds the small generator, will only be putting out 50 or LESS watts,

another thing you need to realize you normally only have wind in day light hrs, ok that just cut your production by half, and then you will only have wind on some days, and unless your in a good wind zone, that my cut the production in halve again,

and unless you average wind in the 10+ mph it will not be a workable system, first most wind generators will not even start to generate in winds under 10 mph, and will get very noisy when the wind gets over 30, as the blades make turbulence of the air,


and then your battery bank must have the capacity to hold a min of three days of power, IMO, and 5 days better, and that capacity should only be a max of 50% discharge and would be better at 25% discharge,

and i think you were told correctly you would probably be needing a 2500 to 3000 watt system, (but check you wind zone before spending any money to see if it is even feasible).

I know in my situation I would need a 20,000 watt unit to do what I use now, and that would be min, for me.

IMO I think if you buy a small unit of jsut a few 100 watts you might as well flush you money down a toilet, I think it will do you that much good. If it was jsut to run a raido or some small item it would probly work but your list is more than that,

Thanks Farming :yeeha: handyman, interesting stuff.
Looks like we are talking about my accepting the genny that the owner is offering. I wont know until I get up there on Saturday.

Tell me one thing, does this apply to a fuel genny as well? Does it need to be a 2500 to 3000 watt system?
thanks, mountaingirl

[farminghandyman]

Originally Posted by mountaingirl

Tell me one thing, does this apply to a fuel genny as well? Does it need to be a 2500 to 3000 watt system?
thanks, mountaingirl

a generator is very expensive way of providing power also,
but do able,

we have ran our farm for over 30 days with a 3750 watt generator,

the generator need to have at least twice the wattage of you biggest motor you want to start, starting loads are twice to three times the run loads, and then it need to be at Least as large as the max number of things you need to run at one time, (example, well and washing machine at once),

you can switch things so the other items don't run when your heavy loads are running,

when we had the ice storm we would run the well and pump up the stock tanks and then the pressure tanks, and then shut off the well and then charge the refrigerators up and the freezers, and then unplug them and do some other things, NOt easy but do able,


one thing that would help you out lot if a generator was going to be the main power source, is to add a battery bank of (good deep cycle batteries, golf cart type or better, car and RV batteries are not deep cycle) and when the generator is running charge the batteries up and then use a inverter for much of the day, on light loads,( tv, computer, etc), keep the generator use for heavy loads, and if properly sized it should be able to charge batteries as well,

depending on the fuel economy of the generator, it is going to cost you fuel, and that for a 4000 watt with a briggs on it could be 5 or more gallons a day of gasoline, (depending on you location and things you may be able to apply for a gas tax rebate from the government since it would not be used in a motor car), but Gas is expensive,

that 30 days we used about 300 gallons of gas that month, using that briggs and stration motor powered generator, it was very expensive power,

I now have a 20,000 watt generator (main unit) and can run the farm like I am on the grid, and it is st up for propane, but still it is reserved for emergency use, as it is expensive to operate as well, and want to set up a battery bank and inverter as well, could probably cut the generator time down by 1/2 if not down by 1/4 of run time, as most loads are small and light, and you could get by on a 1000 watts or less, and have the same convince.

if your going generator try for the best quality you can get in the motor, if going gas honda is a good motor,
diesels ar better and more fuel efficient yet,


you are better to have to much generator than not enough,
if to small it will lug and have low voltage and the frequency will fluctuate a lot (depends on motor speed), not good for electrical things, and be hard on the generator and motor of the generator,,

[wy_white_wolf]

Originally Posted by rambler

Not exactly. you need to negociate a buy-back contract. The power company will _not_ let you just spin the meter backwards. They buy power at wholesale prices, and that is the most you will get - their wholesale cost. So you will have a second meter for reverse flow and get, what, 2/3 or so the cost of what power costs you.

You also need to have failsafe interconnection so power does not flow out the lines if the line goes dead - keeps from frying a lineworker as mentioned.

In Minnesota the utility _must_ offer you this hookup at going wholesale rates. Not every state has such regulations, but most do of some sort.

But, you can't just make the meter run backwards exactly......

--->Paul

Your state has already done the negociating for you! It's called the Net metering law. And yes you can run the meter backwards, a second one is not required.

[AlchemyAcres]

Another thing to consider....

Net metering laws do not always apply to electric cooperatives......i've found cooperatives very reluctant to consider any type of intertie or net metering....(coops provide most of the power in my area - north central PA)


It's wise to do plenty of research before considering wind power.....
i'm working on my 3rd home built wind generator....
a good place to start is.....

http://www.scoraigwind.com/





~Martin