Air in water lines

fellini123 · #1 02/01/05, 09:28 AM

I posted this in the "Shop Talk" forum also, but I thought maybe someone here might have some ideas!!
About 6 months ago we started to get air in our water lines. They would spit and spurt whenever you turned them on. We finally got a plumber to come out and he checked the pressure tank, said that was fine. He then started talking about how it is a closed system and the only way air could be getting in is because we have a leak in one of the pipes outside.
He says we have to trench and relay all of the pipes going into the house, the kennel, garage and bar!
Is this reasonable?? I have never seen a leak, or any indication of a leak, but then we have clay soil and maybe I wouldn't. Plumber said it would be between 1300 and 2000 to fix!!! Gulp!!

Alice in Virginia

agmantoo · #2 02/01/05, 11:00 AM

Alice, your plumber is wrong to start with unless you have the pump in the basement and a check valve between the pump and the storage tank! His area of expertise is the delivery of water and the transport of waste plus a little on venting. You have a well problem and it will not costs mega bucks for us to fix it. I do however need some additional info. Is your pump a submersible one or is it above ground? Is your tank a bladder type tank? If you do not know if it is a bladder tank, does it have any info on a data plate or what color is the tank? Any idea as to how deep the well is and what is the depth of the water table in your area? Do you know if there is a checkvalve in the plumbing from the pump to the pressure tank? I want you to turn a spigot on to where the pump turns on, watch the gauge and tell me the PSI at turn on. With all spigots OFF, let the pump run until the pump cycles off, tell me the pressure reading at the time the pump turns off. Now turn the power off to the pump and open a valve and CATCH all the water that comes out UNTIL the switch that controls the pumps CLICKS, tell me how much water you collected. With the power ON to the pump and all spigots OFF in the home will the pump cycle back on with NO water Drawn? I know I have asked a lot of questions but some work must be doen to earn $1300 plus.

Little Quacker in OR · #3 02/01/05, 02:15 PM

I am absolutely no expert here but I did have the same symptoms here.

I have a well also of course, with a submerged pump and a fairly new pressure tank(I think that is what you call it? Has a "bladder" in it?).

I had never taken off the cover over the well, it's just a little dog house looking thing, and it was all overgrown with flower vines.

Well, I got it cleaned off and noticed that the roof was all wet and rotting, so got the little "house" off of the Well and what do you know..there was a jet of water..very fine..shooting out of the top of the pipes and stuff there.

I called a plumber out and all he had to do was to replace that little fixture that had developed a pin hole in it. Cost to me..75 cents plus the visit.

I hope that your solution is this simple. It's a pretty confusing thing with that machinery and hidden pipes and electricity too! LOL

good luck with it.................LQ

Timber · #4 02/01/05, 07:05 PM

I think your plumber is kind of clueless. As he didn't mention "loop" in the middle of "closed system" I believe you has a pressure system. Pressure inside of the pipe is greater than outside of pipes, the only way air will get in the pressure has to drop to zero or trickle. Sounds like your system? Then it's possible. .
If your air is coming from the hot water side only, it could be your hot water tank heater A rapid raise of water temp will steam. Maybe an electric element has gone bad.

If both did he check your water table level in well? The draw down?
What kind of pumping do you have?

Timber

Valmai · #5 02/02/05, 07:34 AM

If it is air in the pipes here is what I did, and it worked. Turn off the pressure pump, run all the cold taps until the water stops flowing. Then pick a tap that has a mixer and put your thumb over the spout and turn the hot water on. Somehow this seems to move the air bubble out of the pipes. I hope Ive remembered correctly how I did it, if not, someone who knows about such things will correct me.

fellini123 · #6 02/02/05, 10:33 AM

Thank you everyone.
Agmantoo, I will print out your note and have hubby check all the tings. Truthfully I think the plumber is clueless too!! LOL Yes we have a submersible pump. Dont know officially how deep it is, but it is DEEP, well over 60 ft. We have been through a few drought seasons here, we use alot of water to clean kennel runs, etc and never run out of water. The flow rate seems fine, never been slow or short or anything, just this spitting stuff.
Tank is realtively new, about 6 years old and it is a bladder one, blue...
We have looked for a check value but have never found one.
I am going to assume that the check value will give you the PSI readings>> Am I right?? If so we dont seem to have one!! LOL But maybe it is on our tank???

If you fix it the 1300 is in the mail!!!!! And if you beleive that I also have a bridgie you might be interested in!!!
thanks I will get back to everyone on the results of the tests....
Alice in Virginia

fellini123 · #7 02/02/05, 10:34 AM

Oh P.S. it spits with either the hot or cold water on. In fact I think it does it a bit more with the cold water than the hot..
Alice in Virginia

agmantoo · #8 02/02/05, 05:12 PM

I feel comfortable that we can fix the problem. Just get the info back to me. After you gave me the tidbit of info above I now mainly need to know how frequently the pump runs WITHOUT you having any spigots open and I need to know if there is a checkvalve from the incoming line from the pump to the blue tank. While you are gathering this also tell me if the plumbing going to the pump is roll tubing (usually black) or is it something else? You have a wellXtrol tank most likely. That tank is warranteed for no more than 5 years. I have an opinion already of where the problems is but will reserve that until you respond with the info requested.