Story on California organic struggles

[rambler]

http://www.salon.com/2015/02/10/what...make_a_living/

I am always troubled by the barbs being thrown back and forth between truck farming on small scale that supply local seasonal table vegetables, and Midwest grain farmers that supply livestock, ethanol, and export markets. I feel they could share a common bond of love of the land, and have such different sales markets there is no need to hate on each other. We are different in scale and who we sell to, but so much the same in our hopes, dreams, love of the land, pride in our work....

So some of her comments bother me along those lines, but in general she has an interesting story on how her small farm or homestead is struggling with a 10 acre organic farmers market operation.

Realistically, she could be writing the very same story about a 1000 acre corn and soybean farm in the Midwest, as we struggle with the same love of the land, the same economic issues, the same indifference from the public at large, the same optimistic worry.

Dreams and realities. Farmers with dirt under their fingernails have experienced this, and struggled the same the world over it seems.

Paul

[farmerDale]

It is a tough way to make a living. It is a struggle at almost every turn. Weather, inputs costs, machinery costs: So much is out of our control.

But it is still the life we want. Farms rarely stay stagnant and they change and adapt to live on. For us this means more animals longer term to avoid weather woes, machinery costs, and input costs that come with the grain side, which is getting way too risky.

We have been building equity, but frustration comes when cash flow is short or scarce, or hard to control because of railway delays, etc.

You are right, Paul, that article could be interchanged with most any kind of farm. The struggles are still there, even if you look "rich" because you control a lot of land, or "own" a bunch of depreciating machinery.

[watcher]

I didn't read the story but I do want to say that farming is going the way of most everything else in the economic system.

You either have a bigger operation which allows you to produce more with fewer people allowing you to survive on a smaller profit per item produced or you have a small operation supplying a niche market that is willing to pay more allowing you to have large profit per item.

The middle size guy, e.g. the classic "family farm" or "Mom & Pop store", isn't going to be able to survive because he has a high cost of production but is trying to sell in the open market.

Plus when the big guys realize there's money to be made in the niche they will move in. Can a little organic market compete price wise with Whole Foods store? Could Whole Foods compete if Wal Mart seriously got into the competition? Will that wipe out the niche? Of course not but it will make it harder for the little guys to survive.

[Horseyrider]

I'm all for the niche market guy. I so admire the creativity and diligence that most folks in this spot demonstrate. And I LOVE buying local!

I know a guy who is by nature a hard worker and very detail oriented. He bought five acres in the country with a nice house, but not much else. He worked all day off the farm, put up some Morton buildings at home, and started producing hogs in his time off. He educated himself about showing, breeding, and feeding, and refined his operation to an elite farrow to finish operation. He sells direct to restaurants almost exclusively. A couple of years ago he quit his day job, travels all over the country to the biggest shows and wins. The pork is exquisite, both to look at, and to eat.

It can be done, with determination, hard work, and skill.

[YamahaRick]

The title of the story tells me she is a very ignorant person: ~everyone~ tells me there is no money in farming! :-)

Paint an accurate image of the author folks: lives in Northern CA, writes for Salon.com, and isn't married, but has a "partner." She is the kind that expects someone else to bail her out of the situation.

Another dose of reality for whom I refer to as "designer farmers:" you will not feed the world; you care barely feed yourself and the folks that can afford to buy your stuff. The reality of today's world is only the monster operations can eek a dollar or two from farming. For example, one study I read on dairy farming said the only way to make a living from it is to have a minimum sized herd of 2,000 cows - and you need to already have the land to support them, free of debt. Good luck with that, Mr. or Ms. Beginning Farmer.

[Johnny Dolittle]

Yep ... she is full of bulloney !!!

They work (6) 12 hour days per week ... that is 72 hours per week

She works upward of 60 hours per week during the busy times.

She works part time as a baker and Ryan as a carpenter.

They farm 10 acres organically growing their own fertility... which probably means 1/2 to 2/3's of the acreage is in cover/green manure/legume crops. They also make compost. So they are intensively truck farming three to five acres in a climate where you can probably farm 12 months of the year.... which means you can double or tripple crop the land easily.

There are no weeds !!!!!! yep that's what she said !!!!

They have a greenhouse and they irrigate crops.

And she also is a writer !

Sooooooo they do all of this work for about $100 per week !!!!!!!!!

Yep .......... the writer is full of bulloney. $5000 net profit off of 3-5 acres of irrigated land in a great growing climate where you might double and tripple crop the land !!!!!

Organic produce in California .... should bring a decent return !!!! They get $1000 per multi-cropped acre for high value organic truck crops ???

you can grow on an acre:

4-5,000 tomato plants
12,000 pepper plants
20,000 head lettuce plants

Irrigated crops in California climate should produce high yields

Consider 5000 tomato plants per acre .... and you only net $1000 net per acre.... then you only netted $.20 per plant ??? Organic tomato plant yields 10-20 lbs of organic tomatoes and you only get 20 cents for planting cultivating and harvesting each plant !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

She is full of bulloney !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!

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Then there is this also in California .... a backyard farm on 1/10 acre

and they make a decent profit on what they do not consume themselves

YouTube

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[Johnny Dolittle]

It's time for this pair to give up and shut up

[Dixie Bee Acres]

I agree with Johnny. I have never figured up how much actual cash I have made after buying seed and gas for the tiller on my own half acre garden when I sell at the farmers market, but I bet it would be at least 1/4 of what that writer claims to make from her 10 acres.
The article states she made an income of only $2600 or so last year... Possibly, after housing, rent, utilities, fuel, etc. I have noticed a lot of small operations tend to quote their income by how much they have left after paying all of their operational and living expenses.

It may be cliche, but, if she is only making $260 per acre per year, she is doing something wrong. Last summer I had 15 rows of green beans, each row about 24 foot long. After canning 80+ quarts, freezing several quarts, eating a lot fresh, giving some to family, giving all bad beans to pigs and chickens, I still sold at least 350-400 pounds at $1.50 a pound. Then add in pumpkins, tomatoes, peppers, cucumbers, etc....

[Johnny Dolittle]

Well I drifted off from the original intent of Rambler's post but it was because these "wanna be farmers" need to learn to farm before they complain about how impossible it is to make a living by farming.

[Awnry Abe]

Not even 1 goat?

[Johnny Dolittle]

Originally Posted by Dixie Bee Acres

I agree with Johnny. I have never figured up how much actual cash I have made after buying seed and gas for the tiller on my own half acre garden when I sell at the farmers market, but I bet it would be at least 1/4 of what that writer claims to make from her 10 acres.
The article states she made an income of only $2600 or so last year... Possibly, after housing, rent, utilities, fuel, etc. I have noticed a lot of small operations tend to quote their income by how much they have left after paying all of their operational and living expenses.

It may be cliche, but, if she is only making $260 per acre per year, she is doing something wrong. Last summer I had 15 rows of green beans, each row about 24 foot long. After canning 80+ quarts, freezing several quarts, eating a lot fresh, giving some to family, giving all bad beans to pigs and chickens, I still sold at least 350-400 pounds at $1.50 a pound. Then add in pumpkins, tomatoes, peppers, cucumbers, etc....

OK this is believable ... as long as you do not brag that you have no weeds !

[Dixie Bee Acres]

Originally Posted by Johnny Dolittle

OK this is believable ... as long as you do not brag that you have no weeds !

You will never see a single weed in my garden




As long as you are blindfolded

[rambler]

Originally Posted by Johnny Dolittle

Well I drifted off from the original intent of Rambler's post but it was because these "wanna be farmers" need to learn to farm before they complain about how impossible it is to make a living by farming.

Well actually I was thinking along those same lines, but I wanted to play nice and just offer the idea up there and see where you all ran with it.

Thanks.

Paul

[Johnny Dolittle]

OH OH OH

....maybe they should buy crop insurance

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Minimum wage in California has been increased to $15 per hour by year 2018

... at least this will help them on their part time off the farm jobs.

... but if they hire labor !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Two people working 72 hours per week and making $100 between them .... that is less than $1 per hour .... yep they must love farming !!!!

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[Johnny Dolittle]

Originally Posted by rambler

Well actually I was thinking along those same lines, but I wanted to play nice and just offer the idea up there and see where you all ran with it.

Thanks.

Paul

Yep ... your OP played with my brain

....and it is still playing with my brain

BTW complaining about 60 hours per week during busy times or 72 hours per week .... I have farmed produce.... like 20 irrigated acres with 10 in staked tomatoes and 10 in bell peppers. Had 12 migrant workers. At its worst I was getting up at 4:30 and going to bed at 10 PM but during the night I had an alarm clock set for every 3 hours so I could get up and divert irrigation to another zone (My pump could do 2 acres at once). That was back in late '80's and for it I made $20,000 which back then was not terrible. But I have back issues so since 1992 my farming has been part time if at all.

[Johnny Dolittle]

Originally Posted by rambler

Well actually I was thinking along those same lines, but I wanted to play nice and just offer the idea up there and see where you all ran with it.

Thanks.

Paul

Well I did not want to say you were full of bulloney also .................

But sadly I am seeing a transition .... farmers who love the land being replaced by big over-leveraged operators motivated only to make profit

[rambler]

A couple brain cells finally woke up on me this morning, that California gals story seemed so familiar to me. Finally recalled why, and was able to search out a tidbit on the Internet.

http://www.tpt.org/?a=tptUpdate&id=1695

This is a trailer for a public tv show I saw a year ago here in MN. It is a documentary of a retired fella and family trying to make a small organic truck farm work in Wisconsin.

They kept peddling harder and getting farther behind. It followed them for a couple years.

They downsized from where they were on a few acres to just a small backyard deal in a small greenhouse, and seems it just fizzled away, could not make it work.

Was an interesting story, it started with such hope and optimism and this is going to be great. They had free labor from interns and volunteers. They were so happy for how they were changing the world.

The updates kept getting more somber.

Now any business, big or small, is going to have folks that make it and don't make it.

Anyone wanting to get into it probably should see both sides.

I don't know very many farmers at all - an acre or 1000 acres - that are making a living only on the farm. Usually a factory job, or a trucking job, or a construction job, and farming on the side and the spouse working a full job as well.

Paul

[geo in mi]

Dole and Chiquita led the way with bananas. They showed that "vertical integration" is the name of the agribusiness game. The small player today does not have much leverage and has to deal with leftovers and secondary markets--all the good stuff is locked in. Most fruit farmers around here and in Pa and New York have been market cooperative members for years. Their profits come not so much from sale of their products, but from co-op stock share profits from retail sales of processed juice and sauce products. Welch's(grapes) and Knause Foods(applesauce and juice) are big around here and in NY and Pa. When the majority of food in the US is controlled from sow to sizzle, seed to salad, the small farmer, even the organic farmer, will have to compete in a minor league market to sell products and buy inputs. As an economy tightens up, or the higher paid population shifts toward metropolitan areas, a "niche" market could also dry up and the organic producer could be SOL, especially if he/she is buying all the inputs--and even more so if water has to be pumped or purchased.

The "newbie" thinking on this forum seems to be, "Oh, I'll just buy ten acres or so, and sell my organic veggies and eggs on the end of my driveway or at the local farmers' market during the Summer Saturdays." And I can do it the Amish way(by hand and scythe), or by buying an old Farmall H and some worn out equipment. I would counsel new homesteaders that it isn't that simple, and they should first think about providing food for their own family first--then maybe carefully expanding to outside marketing.

I think most homesteading will have to rely on at least one family member working outside the home to make it. I also believe a homesteader must make a closed loop system of the farming or food production that helps to eliminate outside purchase of inputs, even at the expense of using some of the acreage to grow fertility instead of salable crops. And water is becoming more and more important in an unstable climate period.

And, of course, whining about "the system that's holding me down" is the first sign of defeat due to rose colored glasses kind of thinking.....

geo

[Johnny Dolittle]

Free trade may have opened markets for commodity growers

but imports hurt the speciality growers

And when the processors move out of the country the growers are left with a crop and no market.