So I am going to grow wheat organically?

farmerDale · #1 11/22/14, 03:23 PM

Tell me how. Yield target is 70 bushels an acre. It is a heritage wheat called Thatcher.

Please help me with seeding rates?

How to apply the N P K S that is required, and how much to supply the crop?

What about the micro-nutrients?

How should I control weeds?

Prevent wheat midge, wireworms, cutworms?

What should I do to prevent bunt, smut, ergot, leaf and stem rust?

I will be seeding it on 440 acres.

Previous crop was organic grass hay.

So what do I do?

Thanks,

Dale

bellcow · #2 11/22/14, 04:01 PM

File chapter 11 now.

Bellcow

farmerDale · #3 11/22/14, 04:08 PM

You don't think it can be done?

elkhound · #4 11/22/14, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmerDale

You don't think it can be done?

yes..but with an outside the box radical mind/thinking and probably looking to the past and blend a bit of now along with forward/future thinking.

elkhound · #5 11/22/14, 04:20 PM

i dont have anything to offer dale as my family stopped growing wheat about the time i was born.i have a copy of this book on my bookshelf and i have found some very interesting info in it about various activities...maybe you can glean something here about this.

http://books.google.com/books/about/...d=xdIXAAAAIAAJ

farmerDale · #6 11/22/14, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhound

yes..but with an outside the box radical mind/thinking and probably looking to the past and blend a bit of now along with forward/future thinking.

Pretty vague, with respect. Looking for agronomic details kind of thing. It seems there is quite an expectation among consumers and many on here, and I want to know how I should meet my goals, and keep up to conventional farming yields. Or even better!

Trouble is in the past, no one got 70 bushels of wheat on an acre, so blending in the past farming practices is gunna be a tough one to get me to do, you know? My grandpa had weedy messes, and he mined the soil, along with everyone else in those days.

elkhound · #7 11/22/14, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by farmerDale

Pretty vague, with respect. Looking for agronomic details kind of thing. It seems there is quite an expectation among consumers and many on here, and I want to know how I should meet my goals, and keep up to conventional farming yields. Or even better!

Trouble is in the past, no one got 70 bushels of wheat on an acre, so blending in the past farming practices is gunna be a tough one to get me to do, you know? My grandpa had weedy messes, and he mined the soil, along with everyone else in those days.

i get ya......why not contact a grower or a co-op and ask them for name and number of a farmer already doing this very thing?

FarmboyBill · #8 11/22/14, 04:37 PM

Plow your ground, disc it double, harrow it, and sow. I don't remember the right amount of lbs per acre anymore, BUT your drill should have a scale that you can get into the middle of. Don't worry about weeds. I can find out the amount of seed per acre. Be back with that.

elkhound · #9 11/22/14, 04:37 PM

here ya go contact Arnold Schmidtin in Maple Creek,Saskatchewan

http://www.onedegreeorganics.com/schmidt

Arnold Schmidt

Mr. Schmidt was born on in Maple Creek, Saskatchewan and grew up at the family farm just north of it. Since 1960 he is farming here on the farm which has been homesteaded by his grandmother since 1917.
From 1980 on, Mr. Schmidt devoted his life to organic farming. In 1984 he developed a unique highly efficient flour mill, which he now manufactures for and sells from his farm. His organic farming system produces consistently good yields and high quality in an area with light soils and limited rain fall. His versatile milling operation provides flour from organic grains, legumes and spices to customers across Canada.
Mr. Schmidt is proud to be able to be part of an alternative food system which offers health conscious people high quality, unaltered and unadulterated food with its full nutritional value.

p.s.hope this helps

farmerDale · #10 11/22/14, 05:00 PM

Hmmm. Maple creek is the driest area in the province. We are the wettest. 70 bushel wheat down there would just never happen.

I know you are trying to help, but bear with me.

This thread is a bit of an experiment, truth be known. I want for those who say I am farming all wrong, to come and address the questions of the opening post. People rant and rave about how today's farming is killing the soil, how organic can yield as well as conventional. How organic is healthier and better for the environment:

Honestly, if they think conventional farming is all wrong, I would like some answers as to how to approach my conventional yields. How to burn less fuel than I do currently. How to avoid soil killing tillage. How to control weeds which in wheat farming, if not controlled, can steal up to 40% of the yield. How to control wheat midge, and diseases. How to supply nutrients to the soil and crop is not starving.

I am sorry to have not come right out and said why I am after, what it is I say am after. I figure this idea for a thread may have backfired a bit, and thought I should come clean now.

But answers, honest answers, are still very much sought out. Answers by those who insist organic production can compete with conventional. I just would like answers by those who hate how I farm. If they hate how modern farming occurs, and think there is a better way, they obviously have answers as to the how.

I am hoping that some may recognize the impossibility of it all.

So, manure? Rock Phosphate? Till the heck out of the soil? Live with the yield robbing weeds?

I want 70 bushel organic wheat, and I simply ask, specifically how?

Dale

Sorry about not being more up front; I thought the answers would be different...

Molly Mckee · #11 11/22/14, 05:05 PM

You can't meet those requirements. 70 bu/acre is going to require weed control, fertilizer, and pest control.
I guess you could start with a good sized heard of dairy cows, so you would have fertilizer....

wr · #12 11/22/14, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FarmboyBill

Plow your ground, disc it double, harrow it, and sow. I don't remember the right amount of lbs per acre anymore, BUT your drill should have a scale that you can get into the middle of. Don't worry about weeds. I can find out the amount of seed per acre. Be back with that.

Do you feel that heavy tillage will increase yields or just increase soil erosion.

farmerDale · #13 11/22/14, 05:10 PM

Ok, Molly, but most everyone says it can be done. Organic yields as good as conventional after all, according to mother earth studies.

farmerDale · #14 11/22/14, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FarmboyBill

Plow your ground, disc it double, harrow it, and sow. I don't remember the right amount of lbs per acre anymore, BUT your drill should have a scale that you can get into the middle of. Don't worry about weeds. I can find out the amount of seed per acre. Be back with that.

Don't worry about weeds? But I have grass regrowing, I have wild oats, cleavers, lambs quarters, wild mustard, green foxtail, stinkweed, and on and on. If I do not control them, I lose lots of yield. How do I control them after the wheat is seeded?

I do not own a plow, or a disc.

For seed rate, I would think 150 lbs an acre would be ok.

wally · #15 11/22/14, 05:31 PM

I like the post..I would also like to see the suggestions...do you really need the crop to produce a profit ? Maybe you could plant the 440 to feed the bees and other insects ? Then what crop is left you could sell as organic wheat to the people who would use fossil fuel and man made cars to drive to your farm to get their organic wheat...

wr · #16 11/22/14, 05:38 PM

I think it's a great opportunity for those that know how to do this to teach the rest of us how.

farmerDale · #17 11/22/14, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wally

I like the post..I would also like to see the suggestions...do you really need the crop to produce a profit ? Maybe you could plant the 440 to feed the bees and other insects ? Then what crop is left you could sell as organic wheat to the people who would use fossil fuel and man made cars to drive to your farm to get their organic wheat...

Foot traffic pick up only...

rambler · #18 11/22/14, 05:51 PM

Do the organic markets have a protein requirement as well now, or just the regular three - test weight, moisture, and foreign matter?

For those not so familiar with grai. Sales, the load of grain you bring in gets a couple lb sample of grain pulled out of it, and they test it. If it is too wet (will mold if stored) or too light weight (means poor quality usually) or has too much foreign matter in it (bits of straw, grasshoppers, weed seeds) a person gets paid less for your crop.

Maybe 20 years ago they added a protein test, if the wheat doesn't have enough protein you can get a big dockage on that as well.

I believe there is even another test, I forget the name of it, some sort of soak test, where kernel damage shows up. Groat test I think it is, again if the kernels are too chipped or hair line cracked you get a discount.

Do the organic markets use all of these tests as well?

Paul

farmerDale · #19 11/22/14, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wr

I think it's a great opportunity for those that know how to do this to teach the rest of us how.

I do too! I hope they explain how soon.

FarmboyBill · #20 11/22/14, 06:21 PM

Anywhere from 60 in Why to 180lbs in Minn.

You control all that you have mentioned by plowing them UNDER. THEN discing the plowed ground, then harrowing it. The wheat will emerge before the stuff you've plowed under can surface, and will be thick enough that the stuff you plowed down dies for lack of sun and water.

Get yourself a plow and disc.