What to do about foxes and/or coyotes?

Vernitta · #1 05/21/14, 10:43 AM

Last week I looked out the window to see a red fox taking off with one of our ducklings. Of course it had to be my son's favorite. Later that day we went to put the 10 pullets away and could only find 2. I kept hoping the others ran off to hide, but I can only believe the fox got them too. We fixed the ducklings fence. They had escaped through a hole on the bottom. We kept the remaining two chickens locked up until a pen could be built. A few days later my neighbor told me a fox got two of her adult runner ducks and scared one of them to death. The day after our attack I saw a fox (it could've been the same one, but who knows) heading her way with something in it's mouth. I let her know to keep an eye out.

I said all this to ask: Would just beefing up security and, of course, killing the predator upon sight, be enough. Or, should we hunt it down? She has seen coyotes on her place a couple of months ago. So, it could've been coyotes that got her ducks and/or my chickens. Would the presence of a dog (about 30-35 lbs) be enough of a deterrent for a fox? Probably not coyotes.

Wolf mom · #2 05/21/14, 11:16 AM

You'll get a lot of opinions about killing fox and coyotes.

We have a lot of coyotes here along with hawks, etc. I say live with them and make sure your fences are strong. They kill rodents - rats and other animals that will eventually cause more problems for you.

Remember, they will go after the easiest prey. If you make it difficult to get their dinner, they will go some place else.

We have a neighbor that kills coyotes and now we are overrun with rabbits. Just more of my time and energy keeping them out of my garden thanks to him.

Vernitta · #3 05/21/14, 11:44 AM

Thank you for your input. As long as they leave me and mine alone I have no problem with them. I have no interest in decimating the population of predators in our area. We have pesky rodents that I would appreciate them eating instead of my livestock. I've been thinking that we should get another dog. I'm curious if we should stick to a LGD or if a mix of a shepherd and lgd would be ok.

farmerstac · #4 05/21/14, 11:54 AM

Since the Fox found easy dinners he won't stop till you stop him or he eats everything. I agree with wolf mom about the balance issue. A LGD trained to poultry is invaluable for us that try to live with heavy predator loads.

TripleD · #5 05/21/14, 12:02 PM

A 30 to 35 pound dog wont do much good on a pack of coyotes. We lose 2 or 3 dogs on the farm every year. They were mostly small yapper dogs that just let us know when somethings not right. We never lose a large breed dog 60 to 80lbs.

Awnry Abe · #6 05/21/14, 12:03 PM

I deter, but don't hunt them down.

cntrywmnkw · #7 05/21/14, 12:23 PM

I have lost chickens to dogs, foxes & coyotes . My suggestion would be to first of all fortify your coop/run. Put 1/2" hardware cloth all the way around & make about a 2' apron out on all sides, that way if they try & dig, they'll get confused because they hit the wire. Secondly, put up electric hot wires. 1 about 6" from ground, another about 1/2 way up & third at top. Make sure the charger is strong enough to change their minds about getting into your pen. This should deter foxes, coyotes & stray dogs.

Bamacrazy · #8 05/21/14, 01:29 PM

Wish we had more fox around here. I've read that they are coyotes only natural predator.

Vernitta · #9 05/21/14, 02:23 PM

We have built them a new, more secure pen. They are locked up securely at night. The pullets were free ranging when it happened, but are no longer allowed to do that. They have a secure pen, also. I can't use hot wired fencing around the pens, because we have small children. The dog isn't a yappy little thing. She's half australian cattle dog, half german shepherd. She's just on the small side. I know she can't do anything against a pack of coyotes. My question was would her presence be a deterrent for a fox. We do plan on getting another dog that's bigger, though.

PrettyPaisley · #10 05/21/14, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bamacrazy

Wish we had more fox around here. I've read that they are coyotes only natural predator.

Wow ! We have many fox but I don't see too many coyotes. Do they eat the young? To me a little fox would seem to have an issue taking down a coyote. But they are supposed to be sly so who knows ?

||Downhome|| · #11 05/21/14, 02:51 PM

Fox prefer early morning to hunt, and sometimes evening depending on how breakfast went...

The only time I loose anything is if I don't put them up.

Theres enough wild food stuff to keep them busy, but a Ducks just to easy and profitable a opportunity.

I do thin them down come trapping season though.

Right now , I'll just have to make sure I lock them up.

I usually see ours just about first light and they seem to have their routes scheduled.

Weekends are a bad time to forget to lock up the birds.

I don't know if fire works are legal there but I pop off a few every morning and evening.

A radio is another good discouragement.

The neighbors dog has been going ballistic just after twilight and I know its a vixen its barking at.

The dogs no discouragement. Its in the middle of the field barking like mad and then I see what at first I thought a cat, nope it was foxy heading to his barn...

She owes me a few birds but I can wait...

If you got a vixen then the dogs also around hunting, and maybe even some of last years cubs.

houndlover · #12 05/21/14, 03:22 PM

I have hounds (blood and coon). I don't have foxes, or coyotes, or coons, or big cats. Well, I don't have them anymore, heh heh. Trouble is, dogs like to chase chickens and ducks too. Sometimes you can train it out of them, but not hounds, so during the day, the livestock free ranges and the dogs are kenneled. At night, the livestock is penned and the hounds free range. It's enough that the predators don't bother coming around during the day.

Allen W · #13 05/21/14, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bamacrazy

Wish we had more fox around here. I've read that they are coyotes only natural predator.

No, coyote would be the dominate predator of the two.

Ozarks Tom · #14 05/21/14, 04:36 PM

I believe in belts and suspenders. We have a fenced (hardware cloth) run, with the wire 6' below the ground in 1' of concrete. Plus a hot wire 6" off the ground. Our coop has an up/down slider door (plus a regular door), and they're put up every evening. On top of that, the 3 acre yard is fenced and we have a LGD & a mutt.

If we lose a chicken or a sheep, it will be from a 2 legged predator, and we've got an alarm system to catch them.

fishhead · #15 05/21/14, 05:27 PM

Generally you will have fox OR coyotes because coyotes chase and kill fox whenever possible.

You could put up electric on the pen and only turn it on at night.

Even a small dog should work fine for keeping fox out because a large fox is only 15 lbs.

gila_dog · #16 05/21/14, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vernitta

We have built them a new, more secure pen. They are locked up securely at night. The pullets were free ranging when it happened, but are no longer allowed to do that. They have a secure pen, also. I can't use hot wired fencing around the pens, because we have small children. The dog isn't a yappy little thing. She's half australian cattle dog, half german shepherd. She's just on the small side. I know she can't do anything against a pack of coyotes. My question was would her presence be a deterrent for a fox. We do plan on getting another dog that's bigger, though.

A good pen is the most important protection. I no longer free range my chickens because eventually the predators always get them. Sometimes I let them out of their pen for an hour or so before their bed time just so they can eat some goodies and scratch around a bit. Then they go back in their house and get locked up. Your dog may be more of a deterrent than you realize, but I would keep her penned up at night too, for her own protection. She will mark her territory all around the place, and I think that will discourage foxes and coyotes to some extent, as long as there isn't a lot of fresh chicken smell scattered around the place too. Coyotes can kill dogs, but they really prefer to run away. They can't risk being injured. Nobody is going to take them to the vet, you know. My 40 lb blue heeler (cattle dog) will take off chasing coyotes, and they will run from her. But if she chases them too far I think they could turn on her or gang up on her. So I really discourage that.

Does your cattle dog/German shepherd stay close to home? We had a cattle dog/shepherd cross that was the best dog we've ever had. He stayed home, didn't wander the neighborhood, and was a great watch dog. Same for the cattle dog we have now. And neither of them would threaten the chickens. Those are some big advantages of that breed. I don't want a dog that can run down and kill coyotes. There are dogs that can do that, but I think they would be more trouble than they are worth. All I want my dog to do is stay close to home, keep and eye on things, bark when something isn't right, and I will deal with it.

One final thing, and that is if there are coyotes and foxes around you should make sure your dogs and cats have their rabies shots. We have an outbreak of rabies around here every few years. It's mostly in the foxes, but it's been seen in coyotes and even a mountain lion or two. Rabies shots protect your pets, obviously. But they also protect you and your family. If your dog or cat comes down with rabies, everybody who has been in contact with the animal will have to go thru the treatment.

fireweed farm · #17 05/21/14, 10:53 PM

I've never lost anything to predators in 10+ years with the portable electric mesh type fencing. Under or over. Some hens and turkeys have flown out and can't figure out how to get back in.