Antique Tractor Fuel Efficiency

[JLMissouri]

I am in the market for a new to me tractor. I want something with good parts availability and fuel efficiency. Live PTO and hydraulics are a plus, but I am currently using my 8N for everything from running the baler to the pull behind combine. That said it would be nice to have live PTO and a little more power, but it is not mandatory. The reason I am buying is to have a back up should the 8N ever go down for an extended period of time. I don't want to miss a good planting time or have $1,000's worth of hay rained on. So I am looking for a backup. I can spend around $3,000, but cheaper is better.

I wanted a MF 35 diesel but cannot find one worth the price in my area. I then considered a MF 65, but can only find gas ones and I do not like the idea of the wet sleeves. I am now leaning towards a WD 45 or WD but the fuel consumption seems very high. My brother has a D-17 backhoe/loader and it burns about 2 gallons or more an hour doing light loader work. That kind of fuel consumption is something I want to avoid. My 8N is very fuel efficient.

I would like opinions on the WD, WD-45, D14, D15 and other small tractors of that vintage, especially in regards to fuel efficiency. I can pickup a WD45 for the same price as an 8N ($800-$1500), but I am also considering buying a second 8N. I am wondering if it makes any since to go with a WD45 if it uses twice the fuel of an 8N to do the same work, or would it be competitive?

Shame you're not closer . I have an 800 Ford in very good condition that I would sell for about the price you want to pay .

[Phil V.]

Look on www.tractorhouse.com They have ford tractors in your price range. The 800 series fords have live pto and are in the 40 - 50 hp. range and come with gas or diesel engines.

[simi-steading]

I can't say what the tractors you are asking about use, but I know I run through about 5 to 6 gallons of gas running my Ford 2000 to mow my fields.. It takes me about 2 to two and a half hours.. It's a 35hp, and that's running at 1800 RPM for the bushhog..

[COWS]

All gas farm tractors use a lot of fuel under load. The late 1960s 3 cylinder Ford gas tractors are probably as good as you will get.

Don't get a 4 cylinder 800 series Ford diesel, even if you can find one. They were not very good engines. Don't get a Ford with Selectospeed, they gave problems and few people are around who know how to work on them.

I don't know what kind of combine you are pulling with an 8n, but it must be small. Yes, live power is better. I have pulled a combine with no live power tractor but it wasn't as satisfactory as pulling one with independent pto.

8n and other tractors of that era had hydraulic pump working off the pto shaft. Push clutch in, hydraulics quit working. On tractor with live pto, like the MF 35 and later, the hydraulics work off the pto shaft which is in constant engagement inside the transmission housing, so you have constant hydraulics. Other tractors have hydraulic pump working off the engine flywheel, or the timing gears, or the front of the crankshaft, and so have constant hydraulics.

Live pto as in the MF 35 and many other: pto has been engaged and machine is running; push clutch pedal half way in and forward motion of tractor stops, pto keeps running. Push pedal to floor, pto also stops. Independent pto: pto engaged by separate lever and machine is running. move the pto lever, tractor keeps going, machine stops. Push clutch pedal in to stop tractor. Common example of this system is late 60s Ford 3 cyl 4000, but the 4000s can have both systems.

A tractor which will give you the most satisfaction will be a diesel tractor with live or independent pto, remote hydraulics, and power steering. There are aftermarket kits to add power steering to Ford 3000 and 4000s fairly inexpensively, but none for MF 35, 135.

Besides convenience, live or independent pto is safer. If you pull a rotary mower with your 8n and push the clutch in, the flwheel effect of the big blades and blade carrier will keep the tractor rolling. Not good if you are heading toward a tree or a bank.

Hope this helps.

COWS

[Phil V.]

I don't what kind of experience you had with the old ford diesels or select-o-speeds. I had a 1960 ford 801 with both and it performed just fine for me. I used a 9' haybine with it doing a 40 acre field of hay that had canary grass in it. Also ran a baler doing the same field with no breakdowns. I had a 8' disc that was a 3 point hitch that I did gardens with. The reason that I sold it is because somebody offered me double what I paid for it. The guy that bought it uses it in his landscaping business everyday and had a lick of trouble with. Like the old saying that I've heard around where I live is; It will only run as well as you take care of it.

[FarmboyBill]

Id stay away from the WD, or WD 45 UNLESS you know the hand clutch works find. Also, They tend to work loose in the front end. I know, I have one I gave to my boy.

Id check out 50s models JD, OR IHC.

[COWS]

Never personally had a Ford, yet. Cousin had one. It worked fine for a long time. Repairs didn't work too well. On old 4 cyl Ford diesels, Crankshaft bearings are much smaller in the 4 cyl. Dealer mechanic took a 4 cylinder main bearing and passed it THROUGH the 3 cylinder bearing. Agree that how you use it makes a difference.

COWS

[FarmboyBill]

Id look for a old tractor that had been restored, and NOT wore out. youll pay more, but youll have better success, and it will be worth more than you paid for it in 10yrs if you take care of it.

[sammyd]

You may use a gallon an hour more with a WD45 working hard but you'll be making over 10 more HP.
The hand clutch allows you to have a rudimentary live power and live hydraulics.


tractordata.com has test results from most older tractors which include HP and fuel consumption.

[ksfarmer]

You might look around for a MF-180 Diesel. Runs forever on a tank of diesel fuel. About a 65 or 70 horse tractor, has the 2 stage clutch COWS mentioned for pto, has 3 pt and hydraulics. I loved that old tractor, it did everything on my farm for several years till I upgraded. Wish I hadn't traded it in.

[grasser]

I've got my Dad's WD-45 and use it almost daily on the farm.
The Power-Crater engine is awesome when the governor kicks in under heavy load, but...yes it'll burn through a 5 gallon can in short order pulling a 10' double gang disk, or moldboard plow.

[FarmboyBill]

KS, If he finds one of those for $3000, Hes getting somebodies headache. They ought to go for 5
Grasser, this WD is a 49. Its supposed to be upgraded to 40hp. Boy lives in town and has never used it. Took off the hood to paint it, and has never brought it back in 3yrs.

[ksfarmer]

Originally Posted by FarmboyBill

KS, If he finds one of those for $3000, Hes getting somebodies headache. They ought to go for 5
Grasser, this WD is a 49. Its supposed to be upgraded to 40hp. Boy lives in town and has never used it. Took off the hood to paint it, and has never brought it back in 3yrs.

Might be worth $5ooo to a dealer, saw one go for $2800 at a farm auction. A lot depends on where you're at. Still was a good ol tractor, but then I thought that about the JD B.

[plowhand]

Raised on a 801 Ford powermaster, gas. Brother still has it and M JD. I'm using a D15 Allis. It'll outpull the Ford, and is about the same HP. I pull a allcrop 72 with no problem. I've owned and used a 420 JD, 574and 674 IH, 485 IH, 460 Long, 1010 JD,and drove many others.

The old 420 was the toughest, strongest, and most fuel efficent for it's size. You can adjust the carb for load real easier cutting back on fuel for jobs that don't need as much power. The IH 485,574,and 674 were diesel and good on fuel. I could rake 25 acres of hay with around 5 gallons of fuel...that changed went I went to a pto powered rake. I like the D15, but nearly all D15 s will slip out of third gear. They ealry models like mine have 26" tires, and around here they are $1200 a pair...28" are half that. I can go to Napa and get most of my parts. I don't like JD parts prices.

I went back to gas, because I seem to have developed an Allergy to diesel fumes. Just about as cheap for me to buy gas as pay extra medical bills.

I've pulled 3 16" bottom plows, subsoiler, 72 Allcrop combine, cultivators, planters, blades, 20 blade lift disc, disc plow, pulled a bogged down extended cab longbed #/4 ton chevy and 3 axle trailer with the tractor at almost a 90 degree angle with a trycle D15.....didn't hardly rare up at all. I'm using a 1962 D15 wd front, power steering at this time. It takes regular 30 weight oil in the motor,transmision, and the hydraulics. A kit to change the single hydraulics to a regular set up runs about 300. It holds around 13 gallons in the tank, and I can double disc with a 7' disc about 10 to 12 acres on a tank. It probably takes about a gallon an acre to plow, and very little to cultivate. It's the only tractor I've never needed to put weights on the front when I was turning land, to keep the front end down. I put a homemade 3 point hitch on , instead of the snap couple.
I'd like to try a D17....neighbor had one...I've been looking at WD 45's...the fact that the motor is on rails...well I've seen several repowered with different motors....easier to do with the rails...and the prices aren't too bad.

[FarmboyBill]

I adjust the gas useage on my tractors by the revs I turn the on/off guage at the fuel bowl. My H Farmall will do al light work on 3/4ths a turn. I plow in 2 turns. CC Case takes more, but it has more power, and weight to move around.

[rambler]

Originally Posted by Phil V.

Look on www.tractorhouse.com They have ford tractors in your price range. The 800 series fords have live pto and are in the 40 - 50 hp. range and come with gas or diesel engines.

Technically, there is no ford tractor called an 800.

The different models are 820, 840, 850, 860. Also the slightly newer 841, 851, 861, 871, 881. I believe they did not make all those in the 800/801 series so I'm not 100% right either.... But ford started using the first digit for the size of the tractor - 6xx was small engine, low. 7xx was small engine, row crop taller. 8xx was bigger engine, low. 9xx was bigger engine, row crop taller.

Anyhow, the middle digit is important to figure out what options your for 800 tractor has.

X2x models are pretty bare from the factory, not even 3pt.

X4x is a four speed tranny without live pto.

X5x is a five speed without live pto.

X6x is the good 5 speed with the live pto because it has a double clutch in it.

X71 and x81 models have the SoS automatic transmission, which was a good idea but at this age tend to be temperamental and very expensive to fix... Tho they are live pto they are the 801 series, not the 800 series....

So, if you have a 860 Ford tractor, then yes it has a live pto.

Otherwise it does not.

If you are advertising a Ford to sell, it is always good to look up the serial stamping a on the cast iron below the air cleaner, and say exactly what it is, such as 860, rather than the generic 800 series.

Paul

[Bret4207]

Originally Posted by FarmboyBill

I adjust the gas useage on my tractors by the revs I turn the on/off guage at the fuel bowl. My H Farmall will do al light work on 3/4ths a turn. I plow in 2 turns. CC Case takes more, but it has more power, and weight to move around.

All you're adjusting is gross flow to carb, The bowl still fills and the same amount of gas is being delivered to the jets. If it isn't your engine should die.You can lean the jets out for light work at the carb, but you aren't doing a thing back at the sediment bowl except cutting gross delivery to the carb.

[FarmboyBill]

Whatever you think. What I KNOW, is I cant plow with the H with the fuel valve at 1/2 turn. I do adjust the CC Case at the carb, and open it up at the fuel valve.

[coolrunnin]

Brets point is You aren't increasing/decreasing fuel usage by adjusting the fuel to the carb your only changing what is available to the carb hence the starving your H when the fuel is turned down. But you arent using any less when you try to turn it down.