Stray range cattle and little range wars

[Cygnet]

I live in a tiny community with about seven full time residents, around 24 homes (including vacation homes), and about 160 acres of land total between all the owners. It's entirely surrounded by national forest. The community is a real eclectic mix of vacation homes, a small farm with horses, a small vineyard, etc. We (my father, stepmother, and I) have goats, a garden, and pretty much a little piece of paradise here.

To make a long story short, the community is responsible for maintaining about 2,000 feet of range fence to keep the range cattle out, and the rest of the fence is the rancher's LEGAL responsibility.

(A brief explanation for those who want it -- the community is on the border between two sections. The rancher needs to maintain the actual border between sections, or "pastures" as they're called locally. We maintain the fence between the privately owned land and the range pasture on the west side.)

All told, it's about a mile of fence over some very rough terrain. My father and several other owners got the forest service permits, paid for the materials, and put up the community's part of the fence about six years ago. This involved driving t-posts into limestone in some pretty rugged country ... They've maintained it really well since. As far as we know, we've had no cattle get through "our" fence -- we've kept it tight, we walk it regularly, cut down fallen trees, fix wash-outs, etc.

The rancher ... not so much. It's been an ongoing problem, for years. It takes them days to get them to respond when their fence is down, and to come get their cattle out of the community. (Fixing the rancher's fence if it were just one spot wouldn't be a huge issue but rounding up range cattle without horses or dogs is. And his entire fence line needs to be reworked, so it's not just one spot. It's sagging, trees over it, washed out, etc..)

My father's complained to the forest service regarding the poorly maintained fence, and the rancher's foreman tells the forest service that "we" left a gate open or didn't maintain "our" fence and that's why cows got through. Untrue, but the forest service seems to side with the rancher most of the time. It's a local-politics thing. You kinda have to deal with politics in an area like this to understand ... there's the truth, and then there's the good ol' boy network, and the two are sometimes incompatible.

Today was the final straw, as far as I'm concerned -- the rancher's foreman told my father that he couldn't find some cattle that were in the community. They were in plain sight -- he didn't actually drive in to look for them, he just SAID he looked for them. So my father raised heck with him, and got the foreman to come back, and showed the foreman where the cows were ... in plain sight lying down in somebody's front yard.

My father also told the foreman that he would call the livestock commission and report the cattle as strays if they didn't start responding IMMEDIATELY rather than a few days later when cows got loose. By state law, they ARE considered strays as soon as they leave their range pasture.

The foreman's response? If my father did that, he would cut the fence and drive ALL the cattle into the community.

Two hours later, I go to get the mail, which is a mile away. The foreman's truck and horse trailer was down at the rancher's sorting pens so I knew he was still in the area. The sorting pens are right across the road from our mailboxes. I decided to drive around the community to see if the foreman was still chasing cows through our back yards (he wasn't) and to make sure the gates were closed if he was gone.

I find a big Angus bull is hanging out on our neighbor's lawn in plain sight, chewing his cud. No sign of the foreman. My father calls the foreman, and he hangs up on my dad. My father calls the rancher, has a chat with him, and the rancher says he'll call the foreman and tell him to go get the bull.

Figuring the foreman might be nicer to me, since I'm female, I volunteered to drive down to the sorting pen to make sure the foreman got the bull before he left. He's been a real jerk to any man from our community who's talked to him. (I think it's a local culture thing -- the good ol' boys around here tend to be jerks to other men, but if a woman asks them nicely, they'll take care of it.)

As I pulled up on my quad to the sorting pen, the foreman was loading his horse and dogs up to leave. The conversation went something like this:

"Hey! I'm Cygnet, I live up here. I know you're looking for a bull. Did your boss get ahold of you?"

"Ayup."

"Did you get the bull out?"

"Couldn't find 'im." (Note that it's a mile from my house to the sorting pens, so in the time it took me to drive an ATV a mile on dirt roads, he spoke to his boss, searched for the bull, couldn't find the bull, and got back to the sorting pen. His little horse sure can move!)

"Oh! Well, I can make life easy on you. He's in S.B's front yard."

"I don't know where S.B.'s front yard is."

"Well, follow me, I'll show you."

So I showed the foreman where the bull was. He assures me the bull is a big pet, wouldn't hurt anyone, then he throws a loop over the bull's head, and leads him off towards the gate. The bull is apparently halter broke and easy to handle. So it wasn't like he was avoiding a rodeo with some man-killing monster of a wild range bull. Seriously? How hard would it have been to just go get the dang bull rather than make a huge production out of it! Yeah, he probably had to ride a mile on horseback in 90 degree weather to get the bull where he was supposed to be, but tough noogies, it's his JOB.

(And I don't care how nice the bull is, I don't trust bulls. Though after watching the foreman handle him, I may just see if I can lead him where he belongs the next time he shows up. He's halter broke, and I don't want the neighborhood kids who come up almost every weekend getting clobbered. Alternately, rather than leading him back to his range, I might just be evil and put him in a pen and call the authorities to come get him as a stray. Probably depends on what kind of a mood I'm in that day ...)

Annnyway ... sorry for the long story. Guess this was a bit of a vent.

The rancher is in the wrong -- they're not maintaining fences. It is an ongoing issue that they clearly don't take seriously. There are KIDS in the community. I don't care how easy the bull is to handle, he's a bull.

I suspect we will be involving the livestock commission because the rancher's just not going to change anything. He's had years to shape up. I know they WILL impound strays that cross the range fence, and it'll cost him $$ to get them back. And the foreman's threatened to take revenge if we do. (I suggested to my father that he start recording conversations when he talks to the guy.)

Did I mention the rancher is a well known car salesman who owns a couple very big dealerships? He views ranching as a 'fun hobby' and has said as much.

I have a feeling it's going to be an interesting summer.

Too bad we don't have freezer space for about 1500 pounds of beef ...

[Cygnet]

ETA: The issue with keeping the cattle out of the community is partly a safety thing -- cattle are dangerous -- and partly because they're destructive to property, and partly an issue with the cattle tearing up the creeks. We have two permanently running creeks that pass through the community. The forest service has a pilot program to reintroduce some very endangered frogs to the forest, and they sent up a fenced sanctuary on forest service land. There frogs have started to move from the sanctuary to our creeks and repopulate here. There's also trout in the creeks.

The cows come in and destroy everything. I kid you not, exactly at the fence line, the creek turns from a trout stream to mud -- not even running water, just mud.

[unregistered353870]

Start sending the rancher bills for grazing fees. And yes, start having the strays impounded. You've done your best to be good neighbors and they've walked all over you.

[LisaInN.Idaho]

Originally Posted by Cygnet

The cows come in and destroy everything. I kid you not, exactly at the fence line, the creek turns from a trout stream to mud -- not even running water, just mud.

That could be an EPA issue.

This is not an open range area?

[bluemoonluck]

Well, here's one option:

Document everything - pics and video of YOUR community-maintained section of the fence, pictures and video of the rancher's fence. Take pics/video and write down dates/times that his cattle break thru, and if possible take a pic of the place in the rancher's fence that was busted down allowing his cattle to escape.

Tape record all future conversations with the rancher or his foreman (check to see if your state is a single-party consent state for this, to cover yourself legally).

Video tape and photograph the animals sitting in people's yards.

Gather as much evidence as you can to show that this is the rancher's negligence and not your community's.

Then go above the local people's heads and send all your documentation to their bosses. Explain what you've done to try to get this resolved and what has resulted (or rather, NOT resulted) from this.

There are kids here that could be hurt, or a cow could walk into the street and cause an accident. The rancher needs to get off his duff and fix his fence.....

The alternative option - and honestly, the one I'd follow if I were in your shoes - is to stop all communications with the rancher and his foreman. By now he knows there's a problem with his fence, and he's still choosing to ignore it and be a jerk about it. So as far as I'm concerned, you just need to approach this a different way.

Every single time a cow gets loose, just catch it up and report it as a stray, turning it over to the authorities. If the rancher is dumb enough to cut off his nose to spite his face by deliberately sending ALL his cattle into your community, that's his loss . Eventually when he realizes that he's losing his cattle (and his $$$$$) because of the fence, and that y'all aren't going to be his unpaid ranch hands anymore, he'll fix the fence.

[Wolfy-hound]

I'd call on every stray that showed up. You guys all tried to play nice for a long time. It's time to teach them the golden rule.

[oneokie]

Familirize yourself with AZ livestock laws, and do move your complaints up a level or two in management.

[Cygnet]

To clarify a point -- It's semi-open range. The forest is divided into sections, or "pastures." The ranchers are responsible for maintaining the fences around their pastures. Our community borders this guy's leased range land, and it's that fence that he's not maintaining well.

We have video documentation of the cattle pushing the rancher's fence down, etc. and video of cattle in our yard. It hasn't gotten us very far.

[unregistered353870]

Too bad you can't just claim the abandoned property. Anything else left on your property for that long you might be able to, but livestock laws are goofy and outdated.

[Hidden Hills]

I think you had the right idea, big freezer and a cattle trailor to haul em to the butcher shop.

[Cygnet]

Originally Posted by LisaInN.Idaho

That could be an EPA issue.

You'd think it would be, but the forest service claims that cows help the land and keep the fire danger down. That's a whole 'nother argument.

I think I'll get a picture of the fence line and the creek inside and outside the fence. I don't mind ranching, but this land is being really badly overgrazed. It's really sad.

[unregistered168043]

I'd call the commission on every single stray. I wouldn't even bother telling the foreman or the rancher. If that doesn't solve the issue I'd start using his cattle for archery practice. When he gets his cattle back with 3 or 4 arrows in their rump every time, he'll get the message.

[fishhead]

Yeah overgraze it just so he can tell his buddies he's a rancher.

I'd start calling on every animal that gets past his fence. It's time that he starts acting like a real rancher and owns up to all that goes with it.

[FarmboyBill]

Id find somebody that can butcher in your town. Then get the men to help out and kill cut and cover the cows with freezers all over town. IF he cant find the cows in plain sight. He isn't going to find you butchering one if your careful about it. Say, one every other month.

I also think you all need to watch Sam Elliot in Conniger. He worked for a rancher nearly by himself against band of rancher rustlers. Well, sounds like you've got the numbers and the rancher don't. Id start intimidating the foreman. IF hes put between the hard place of suiting his boss, and dealing with a belligerent bunch of people, Id think hed start doing his job better. IF he threatens to cut your wire, threaten to cut him, yup, down there. You've got to be pro active. you cant be like the towns in westerns that are cowered by some big rancher or bully, and the townsfolk looking for a hired gun to do their work for them.

[farminghandyman]

most western states are open range, and my guess is the cattle have more rights than the people,

on most open range, if you do not want cattle on YOUR land you have to fence them out.

I do not know how many feet that the rancher fence is but would a eclectic fence a few feet on your side be worth the effort,

(my guess is one time in history his family grazed that area, and in his mind these out sliders come in and took his meadow).

and I would make sure the law is on your side before any of his critters disappear or end up in the freezer.

what ever you do I would not suggest any threats? Unless you can back them up legally and the "law" is on your side.

I border a guy who (at one time there was road between our pastures) he talked the county in to closing the road, there was two fences, his and mine, he stopped maintaining his side, and now we have one fence MINE, he will not lift a finger to help maintain the fence. this spring I had some help and we replaced at least 50 posts on that fence line, (in all planted 100 posts and ran out) any way the best way I have found is to go fix the fence and keep good relations, not start a fight,

(and I have another neighbor who will fix a bad spot on the fence I border with him, I put some new posts in and did not have wood post insulators for eletricfing a wire, he went and bought the insulators and put them on, and powers that wire, for some reason my fencer was not doing a good job)

what I am suggestion is to go fix his fence, it may be the best solution to the problem. (I know it my not be your responsibility, Who knows may be the rancher would hire your guys or pay a sum to fix his fence), sounds like to me the problem is more between the foreman and not necessary the rancher, (could be wise to call the "Law" and ask if there would be any problme with fixing his fence first before doing it, last thing you need is to be acused of damaging his properity, take lost of photos of before and after).

even if you did not get payed, most likely the cattle problem would be solved.

[CIW]

You should check Arizona State law on this first.
I believe that way in all western states, its fence out land. At least its that way in Utah, Nevada, Wyoming, Colorado, Idaho, and Oregon. You don't want animals on your ground, it may be your responsibility to keep them out. These laws are all grandfathered in. Its the reason that pictures of the old farmsteads all had fences around them.
Take a moment and make some phone calls to the Forest Service and/or the BLM.
I know that you are distressed. Some immediate relief would be to call the brand inspector the next time this happens. Thats what they get paid to take care of. Doing so also starts a paper trail of neglegence and indifference to the problem.

[Cygnet]

I've already researched the laws for myself, and my dad has found out which sections the rancher has leased this year. The rancher is responsible for keeping the cows inside his leased rangeland, which is on the east side of the community, including maintaining the fence, per forest service regulations. If you lease the land for grazing, you're responsible for fencing it!

By not maintaining his fence, he's not only letting the cattle into our community, but the cows are also getting into a pasture he doesn't have rights to, to the west of his lease. That pasture/allotment/section -- whatever you want to call it -- is closed to grazing this year, so his cows shouldn't be in there at all (they are).

(The fence the community put up is between our little island of private land and that allotment on the western side. There's no problems with cattle getting through our fence. It's the fence the rancher is supposed to be maintaining, and isn't, that's in question.)

And yeah, the foreman is a good ol' boy whose family has been here for generations. He has entitlement issues. And he gets away with it because, well, good ol' boy network. And his boss is wealthy and politically connected.

Just for reference, here are the relevant laws and policies:

Arizona law:

http://asci.uvm.edu/equine/law/fence/az_fnc.htm

3-1401. Stray animal defined
"Stray animal" as used in this article means livestock, bison or ratites whose owner is unknown or cannot be located, or any such animal whose owner is known but permits the animal to roam at large on the streets, alleys, roads, range or premises of another without permission.

3-1402. Holding and sale of stray livestock; repossession before and after sale; nonliability of state
A. When a livestock officer or inspector finds a stray animal he shall attempt to locate the owner and, if located, notify him where the animal may be found. If the owner does not take immediate possession of the animal, or if the owner or claimant thereof is unknown or cannot be located, the livestock officer or inspector shall hold the stray animal for at least fourteen days and sell it at public auction to the highest bidder for cash, after giving at least five days' notice of the sale.

3-1426. Lawful fence defined
A. A fence shall be deemed a lawful fence when it is constructed and maintained with good and substantial posts firmly placed in the ground at intervals of not more than thirty feet, upon which posts are strung and fastened at least four barbed wires of the usual type tightly stretched and secured to the posts and spaced so that the top wire is fifty inches above the ground and the other wires at intervals below the top wire of twelve, twenty-two, and thirty-two inches. If the posts are set more than one rod apart, the wires shall be supported by stays placed not more than seven and one-half feet from each other or from the posts, extending from the top wire of the fence to the ground, and each wire of the fence securely fastened thereto. B. All fences constructed other than as provided in subsection A, or of other materials equally as strong and otherwise effective to turn livestock as the fences described in subsection A, shall also be deemed lawful fences within the meaning of this section.

Forest service policy:

www.fs.fed.us/im/directives/fsm/2200/2240.doc
2241.14a - Fences

The benefiting activity shall provide funds for fences that are needed to support other activities or that are not identified in an allotment management plan.

The rancher's cattle raising operation is the "benefiting activity" and the local forest service office says he needs to maintain the fence to keep cattle in his allotment.

[Cygnet]

Oh, and an electric fence would not be an option due to extreme fire danger. I use electric fencing on a small scale, carefully, to keep critters out of the garden or goats in, but running a few thousand feet of electric through tinder-dry woods is just asking for trouble.

[PNWest]

I don't believe this is the correct way to handle your problem. There is now documented history that you will, shoot, butcher and or rustle cattle that you do not own. The first time the rancher is missing one stray, he will go snooping on the Internet to find out more information about the people he suspects.

What is he going to find that will not incriminate you.

[Raymond James]

I have pasture to my east that was rented out for years the guys renting it would only do what they absolutely had to do to keep their cattle in. I fixed and maintained their portion and mine. When they started getting out along the road I started rounding them up all right but not putting them back in the correct pasture. I made lots of "mistakes" sometimes putting them in a pasture a mile away.

Those guys would never give me a number to call if any cattle got out or one of the cattle had a problem. Never said thank you for spending two hours getting our cattle off the highway and fixing the fence. After my mistakes they got around to fixing the fence.

Fortunately the owner ( out of state , older person - never met them and could never get a contact for them) sold it to some people who know how to take care of their cattle and check on them all the time. They made repairs and maintain the fence.

If you could get the cattle out of your town and onto someone else's pasture that might do the trick. Remember you were just trying to help and unfortunately made a mistake and got the wrong cow in the wrong pasture.