ram pump

[snettrecker]

hey all, we are the proud new owners of 37 acres here in north central "ish" tn. I have a very nice creek on the edge of my property that we would like to use. We are wanting to eventually add a pond to the property, and we have the idea that we could use a ram pump to get water from the creek up to a large tank using the overflow from that for watering the animals that we are gonna have and also have some runoff go into the pond for keeping it full.

We have about 650' of creek on our property, it looks to be about 15'-20' of fall over that distance. We would be pumping the water up about 100' over around 1000' distance. I've calculated that the creek is flowing about 230 gpm right now. It's a year round spring fed creek. I'm sure the volume will go down some in the dry months, but the neighbors have told me that it stays flowing pretty good.

The challenge is because there is only 15-20 feet of fall, (I've not measured exactly yet) I want the pump in as low a place as possible. But that places it right in the stream bed and when rain comes it would be submersed/washed away. Anybody have any experience with placing a pump in a stream bed? The stream bed is solid rock so I could bolt the pump straight to the rock.

I calculated that if I only use 60 gpm of the water flow. I'll be getting close to 6 gpm up at the top. That's 8640 gallons per day. That's a lot of water....... It would more than keep a pond full.......

Anyway any ideas? suggestions? I'm new to the homesteading thing. We've been researching and desiring for years, just bought our place last month and there's lots of work to do for sure.

Thanks

[Harry Chickpea]

First, you are in Tennessee. You need to verify that you actually have riparian rights to do any modification of the stream or creek. You may not, even though it flows through your property. Alabama laws are different and more relaxed, but in Tennessee you have both the state laws and TVA working against you. We just "sip" from our creek once every week or two, and the creek is so close to headwater as not to be an issue, and we don't even use a weir, so we fly under the radar.

What you describe for a creek is very similar to what we have, so I speak from some experience. Unless you spend the money on a quality RAM pump from England (and they can be pricey) you may find them more trouble than they are worth. I tried making one out of PVC (which won't last anyway, but is OK for testing) and wasn't anywhere near satisfied with results. Quality counts, and quality costs. You won't get 6 GPM with that rise and run in any event. Come September, you might be lucky to have 1 GPM. During the spring flooding and washes, you may be more comfortable removing the pump. Trees, rocks, and even a telephone pole have come down our creek. A tree will take out most any pump in the main current.

You don't want to be pumping water during flood stage anyway. The muck will clog pipes, damage pumps and seals, and make water undrinkable until it settles.

What works for us is an electric sump or trash pump in a protected eddy area, which then immediately feeds a harbor freight 3/4hp clear water pump to pump into a cistern.

Your winter temps are going to be lower than ours, so you can expect freezing issues unless you bury the pipe. Burying 1000' of pipe is a major project in itself, and costly.

PM me if you need more info.

[agmantoo]

snettrecker

Is it feasible for you to go at the beginning of your property where the water starts and to divert some of the water to a holding pond (small). Then put a pipe into the holding pond and then run a pipe to a point down the hill to where you want to put the ram. Set the ram off to the side of the creek also. I know you will lose some of the head but you would be outside the creek bed and out of the way of flooding. You can use the suction from a vacuum cleaner at the ram/pump location to get a siphon started. I did this in the mountains of western NC for a lady that had gravity water that had to go over a rise (solid rock) to get water from a spring. The water ran year round so there was no issues with freezing.

[snettrecker]

We have a well for drinking water. We are wanting to use the water from the Creek mainly for watering the gardens, animals, and for the pond. Our property is way back in the boonies and we are less than a mile from the spring where the Creek starts. I will research riparian rights, but I really doubt anyone would say anything about us using some water. Even if we only get 1 or even a half gallon per minute it's still free water and it adds up over time. I think we might be able to put the pump to the side of the creek bed. There isn't a way to divert the water because the Creek runs in a low area between the Hills. We've got a lot of work to do to get to the place where we are ready for this. I'll keep you all informed as we go.

[doomas]

How about a spirol pump?

[Yvonne's hubby]

A quick and easy way to determine the fall in your creek bed is a topo map from the usgs website. Locate your property and see how many elevation lines run across your property. With only six feet of fall in six hundred, I doubt you will get much water pumped with a ram pump. They depend upon the inertia of the water flow which isnt much over that much distance. If you had a small waterfall, where the water dropped 6 feet all at once, you would have a better chance of pumping a little water out of the lower pool up into a pond. You might be able to create one, if you can divert a good head of water at the upper edge of your property, run it through a flume to the lowest point on your property and let it drop to your pump at that point. Building the flume to grade would be your largest obstacle. It would have to be almost perfectly level, with only a foot or so of fall to the discharge point, a couple inches per hundred feet!