Health Insurance = No Homesteaders & No Freedom

[cedarvalley]

It seems to me with the high cost of health care and health insurance, that is impossible to make a true self sustainable living on one's own small farm, especially with a family. If you take the risk of going without insurance you risk losing your farm and every thing youve worked for. If you decide to work in town at a job for insurance, then your giving up your Freedom to make your sole living off the land. My view is that we have really no true Freedom of choice anymore as we are slaves to the system. What say you?

[plowjockey]

Not sure why "homesteaders", are any different than anyone else, when it comes to protecting your family.

Not everyone that has a job, has health insurance.

Either you have insurance, or you pay medical bills yourself, which have always been relatively high.

If your homestead does not produce enough food, to feed your family, will you let them starve? No, more that likely you will do what you need to do to care their needs.

[fffarmergirl]

I think it will give more people the freedom to homestead. Right now a lot of people are stuck working jobs they don't want to work because they need the benefits package for the insurance. Now they can quit their jobs and still get the insurance because, without the income, they'll get the subsidized insurance. So they can make the choice to make less money and be more self sustaining.

[LadyJane]

Life has always been full of risks. People can still lose all they have even if they do have medical insurance.

[MO_cows]

"subsidized" by the taxpayers isn't exactly "self sustaining"! If you can come up with a cash flow from your homestead, you can buy your own policy. Or you can practice "homestead medicine" and use all natural remedies. Hard choices, welcome to life!

[fffarmergirl]

MO Cows - our health system's costs are way jacked up and the costs of policies are artificially inflated and it's unfair to expect anybody to pay full price for any health insurance. Since the whole system is so messed up anyway, a person might as well be able to live the lifestyle of their choice without our health care system getting in the way of it.

And we dont' have the CHOICE to practice homestead medicine! People get their kids taken away for that, you know. We have the government telling us what we are and are not allowed to do with our bodies, what herbs we are and are not allowed to use. You can't use any natural pain relief medications because they're all illegal so if you want pain relief you're forced to pay tremendous bills for it and undergo testing you don't even want to undergo. You can't make your own pain meds and you can't go to the dr. and say "Listen - I just want pain relief, I do not want a CT and an MRI and exploratory surgery."

We can't even make the choice to die at home without the good old American healthcare system getting involved. As soon as you're sick enough you're declared incompetent and forced into a hospital or nursing home and then they take all of your money and all of your possessions.

ETA: I'm a taxpayer and I sure as heck won't qualify for any subsidies. Besides - the question was how it will affect our ability to make the decision to homestead. We will be able to make that decision more easily now, regardless of whether the new healthcare laws are right or wrong, fair or unfair. The law does benefit people who don't make much $ and by choosing to homestead a person is choosing not to make much $.

[cedarvalley]

I dont want this to become a debate about the new health care law, rather about those who truly our Real Homesteaders without corporate relied upon earnings, and their solution to health care cost and insurance.

[julieq]

What say I? DH is disabled and on Medicare. DD's and I gave up our health insurance in 2002.

Besides one time when DD#3 had a compound fracture from being bucked off a horse (20,000.00 in medical bills), I think in 2005, we have kept well clear of doctors offices and hospitals. No way we could have afforded to keep the 600.00 plus per month of BXBS up all these years, nor have we needed it (thank God!)

I do remember being depressed and frightened when we had to give up our health insurance as a family. But quite frankly, we've needed that money in multiple other areas and looking back we've saved a fortune in the past ten years.

[geo in mi]

A homesteader may have to check out Health Savings Accounts and catastrophic coverage insurance policies. I worked 32 years for a large major manufacturing corporation(the one that went bankrupt) and I paid into the system.....so I have Medicare (for a monthly fee) and I purchase a Medicare advantage policy as well. But I do have to get quotes for some meds to track the "total drug costs" figure because of the donut hole. Walmart is not the cheapest..... and some pharmacies have free meds and antibiotics....

I don't know of any way to do the homesteading lifestyle on the cheap........ before someone goes into it, they have to take all those factors into account. It's the same way for electricity, gasoline, fire insurance, building codes, tools and equipment, animals and feed, fertilizers, water systems.......... All my docs get a laugh whenever I ask them if they take chickens or potatoes for payment.....

geo

[ErinP]

rather about those who truly our Real Homesteaders without corporate relied upon earnings, and their solution to health care cost and insurance.

Personally, I rallied for the Obamacare.

We've never had a job that came with health insurance, consequently DH and I have purchased our own self-pay insurance for nearly 20 years. Fortunately, we've also never had a pre-existing condition that denied anyone in our family coverage, either. If we did, we'd be screwed, pure and simple.

[cedarvalley]

With the price of Beef now, my DOCTOR might decide to take one of my BEEVES on trade.......

[Alice In TX/MO]

You do have the freedom to make whatever job and healthcare decisions work for you and your family.

The Constitution and homesteader philosophy do not guarantee health insurance. The freedom you have is the freedom to choose.

Pioneers (those we emulate with our "back to the land" beliefs) had no health insurance.

[samm]

not all jobs offer insurance, a lot of companys work you just
enough hours to keep you from benefits aka insurance. so some
times it's not about not wanting to work to have availability
to insurance. and with out enough hours it's hard to pay
premiums that are almost what you make in a month. not very much
of a choice for some
samm

Samm

[ErinP]

Pioneers (those we emulate with our "back to the land" beliefs) had no health insurance.

And they paid their doctor's bills in eggs, or simply died because they didn't call him anyway. I'm not sure this is the comparison we're going for here...

[TedH71]

Work for Target part or full time. Everyone gets health insurance regardless of the number of hours worked.

[highlands]

Originally Posted by cedarvalley

My view is that we have really no true Freedom of choice anymore as we are slaves to the system. What say you?

No different than it ever was. People didn't have health insurance for centuries. Also not just a homesteader issue. If you're self employed in any venue it is the same.

You're only as much of a slave as you choose to be. Make choices.

Also, hospitals don't come and take your home. They work out payment schedules over time. They want to be paid.

[whodunit]

Originally Posted by julieq

What say I? DH is disabled and on Medicare. DD's and I gave up our health insurance in 2002.

Besides one time when DD#3 had a compound fracture from being bucked off a horse (20,000.00 in medical bills), I think in 2005, we have kept well clear of doctors offices and hospitals. No way we could have afforded to keep the 600.00 plus per month of BXBS up all these years, nor have we needed it (thank God!)

I do remember being depressed and frightened when we had to give up our health insurance as a family. But quite frankly, we've needed that money in multiple other areas and looking back we've saved a fortune in the past ten years.

Thanks for the perspective. We are barely making it in part due to health insurance costs for DW and kids ($440 a month with a $1600 family deductible). My biggest bills are food, mortgage and health insurance in that order. I'm seriously considering dropping it, but I keep thinking of the "what if".

Of course when you really think about it, the choice is actually between going broke slowly paying for insurance that we rarely use or going broke in one feel swoop it disaster strikes. The only difference is the element of time.

[HermitJohn]

Originally Posted by highlands

Also, hospitals don't come and take your home. They work out payment schedules over time. They want to be paid.

They no longer take token $5 monthly payments. You arent going to live long enough to pay off even small bills that way. If you cant work out a realistic payment plan that will actually pay off the WHOLE bill in reasonable time, then they will go after any bank accounts and assets they discover until you get a clue and go to a bankruptcy lawyer to protect your modest home and other protectable assets/income. Dont do anything and they will legally strip you naked. Or if you have marginal income like a SS check only, they sell the debt to collection agencies for pennies and write most of it off. Sure it varies hospital by hospital, but they are not necessarily nice charitable folk.

You will get a free ride IF its something like a car accident or a gunshot or other trama. They are required by law to STABILIZE you. Trama victims need lot stabilizing. If you have no assets then you just have to fend off collection agency people. They are not required to give you cancer treatments or other expensive long term treatments. Just stabilize you and with cancer, you will be pretty stable at any point up until the end when you will be admitted and given pain meds as you die.

[jwal10]

I farmed and only had catastophic health insurance for years. I worked in town with full benefits and payed more for the deductable than my premium was on the farm. I am now retired with a catastophic policy and a rider from SAIF for injuries suffered on the job due to negligence on the employer. So basically I am self insured with a high deductable policy if I had a big health problem. Seems today people think they need full insurance to cover every little thing, all because they live paycheck to paycheck. This is why insurance is so high. I only have the state minimum on my vehicle since it is payed for. If I wreck it and it is my fault I pay, my insurance pays for the other vehicle, uninsureds fault, my policy pays, other persons insurance pays if they are at fault. I pay a very low $19.00 a month.

You never get something for nothing, Obama care puts everyone in the same pot, YOU HAVE TO JOIN. Knowing this insurance is betting against YOU. Their price is so high, they will win either way. I will take the bet that I will win, take my chances IF I lose. All of this with 3 huge on the job injuries, one major off the job injury with benefits AND I had polio too....James

[mary,tx]

DH and I haven't had health insurance for ten years, since the last company he worked for went bankrupt. He has since been self-employed. He makes too much money to qualify for government subsidized insurance, but we do not qualify for a group plan.

We have just been paying our own way with medicine, and the local clinic gives us a self-pay discount, since they don't have to file insurance.

Obamacare can only hurt us, by fining us for not buying insurance.

I think most people who homestead have work they do away from the farm for a paycheck. You can't pay taxes with beans and tomatoes.