Rant - I HATE Plumbing

YuccaFlatsRanch · #1 05/17/12, 12:59 PM

2 days of digging up junctions on a long water line because the booster pump was cavitating / sucking part air and part water only to find out that the cause was most likely a stuck one way back flow valve. GRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!! I had figured a junction was pulled apart do to it being so dry last year and quite wet this year. We just had about 6 inches of rain so I figured the swelling ground had done it's trick. I have a good sunburn and a really sore and swollen right wrist from digging. You would think (I obviously did) that it would be pretty hard to clog up a back Flow valve in a closed 1 inch diameter water system. Anyway, when I cut it out of the system I got much better flow out of the pipe. Off to Home Depot for a new Chinese piece of carp to put back in the ground. I will buy 2 as well as a few extra ball valves to keep around here - just in case. I figure backup PVC valves, pipe, glue, etc will be pretty valuable when the SHTF. Probably won't be a Home Depot or Lowes to run to.

Bret · #2 05/17/12, 01:09 PM

Good work. It's all worth it. Right ? Won't you be glad when the feeling of satisfaction kicks in and sustains you part way to the next job?

Speacking of POC--I bought a multi-style replacement valve kit for a hydrant for about $20.00 just for one (of 3 types) of rubber seals and through away the box of everything else knowing that I would never have use any of it.

I thought about posting on HT offering to send it to anyone that could use it. It would have been more satisfying.

Hollowdweller · #3 05/17/12, 04:25 PM

I feel your pain.

Whenever I am crammed under my house with a pipe wrench or inhaling PVC glue or digging up sections of the line to the barn I often call my friend with no running water and tell her she may have it right

YuccaFlatsRanch · #4 05/17/12, 05:15 PM

And to add insult to injury some Rocket Scientist at Home Depot where stocking decisions are made has decided that with regard to one way pvc check valves, no one wants the slip/slip valves that are glued in the system - nope everyone wants the threaded ones and that is all they carry now. Other than hose faucets I NEVER use threaded PVC fittings - NEVER.

unregistered5595 · #5 05/17/12, 06:17 PM

Here's the upside.
Plumbing problems are really expensive and you have the skills to fix them yourself.
I have a little story.
I had 2 and 1/2 feet of water in the basement because the water table rose and raised the pressure tank on the well and broke the well pipe, filling the basement with water.
One of my HT friends drove out through the flood waters in the state and completely re-plumbed the well system.
At the time, plumbers were robbing my neighbors blind, $800 to put in a sump pump, something that would cost less than $100. When you are surrounded by flood waters and basements filled with water, plumbers can make a killing. The demand for plumbers was so high they could charge any ridiculous amount. I'm not against them making money, but taking advantage of people during an emergency seems ridiculous.
So I'm glad you know how to take care of your plumbing problems. You probably saved yourself thousands of dollars, good job.

HeelSpur · #6 05/17/12, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feather In The Breeze

I'm not against them making money, but taking advantage of people during an emergency seems ridiculous.

I said the exact same thing the last time I took my dog to the Vet on a saturday.

Then I looked up on the hilltop and saw the mansion she was building.
No wonder I got took.

unregistered5595 · #7 05/17/12, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeelSpur

I said the exact same thing the last time I took my dog to the Vet on a saturday.

Then I looked up on the hilltop and saw the mansion she was building.
No wonder I got took.

One time, I had a dentist tell me he was going to use experimental procedures probably not covered by insurance on my children. In the next sentence he told me how he had two children going to college and it was very expensive. He asked me to agree to these experimental procedures not covered by insurance. I answered him, NO, in writing. It's all kind of ridiculous.

I think it's really great that the OP has these skills in plumbing and can use them.

Harry Chickpea · #8 05/17/12, 07:46 PM

Most of the time I find plumbing relaxing. My primary objections are the objections of my body having to get into contorted positions because every other craft thinks - "Plumbing? PLUMBING? Pfft! They don't need no plumbing OR room for a plumber or pipes."

The plumbers retaliate with a professional "plumber's crack" whenever possible...

TnAndy · #9 05/17/12, 07:52 PM

I hate it too......and my wife hates it even more since I always cuss up a storm.

No matter what, it's ALWAYS 3 trips to town to get the stuff to fix the most simple problem.

ryanthomas · #10 05/17/12, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TnAndy

I hate it too......and my wife hates it even more since I always cuss up a storm.

No matter what, it's ALWAYS 3 trips to town to get the stuff to fix the most simple problem.

I had that problem until I bought up the entire plumbing parts stock of a hardware store going out of business auction...now I manage to do most jobs with only 2 trips to town.

duckidaho · #11 05/17/12, 10:17 PM

I hate plumbing too. On my summer project list is a bathroom overhaul and laying a line to the barn. Maybe I should start cussing now to get into practice.

YuccaFlatsRanch · #12 05/17/12, 11:42 PM

To add injury, replacing the valves did not solve the problem. I have a tank on one side of the road and a shallow well / surface pump on the other. NORMALLY, the water runs under the road in its pipe by gravity and barometric pressure ending up in the pump on the other side of the road from the tank which is several feet lower than the tank. Well in the last couple of days, Physics has been not doing so well. Somewhere I have a small leak in one of the lines leading to the pump that is apparently letting in some air, ruining the sealed system required for the system to properly work. Problem is finding such a small leak without being able to put significant pressure through the line. It's going to be another LONG day tomorrow!!! I may have to start cutting out joints and replacing them sequentially until the air leak stops and the water runs again. Arrrghhhhh!!!!

Harry Chickpea · #13 05/18/12, 12:06 AM

Wait.

Show some diagrams of what is going on. Something seems odd here.

wharton · #14 05/18/12, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeelSpur

I said the exact same thing the last time I took my dog to the Vet on a saturday.

Then I looked up on the hilltop and saw the mansion she was building.
No wonder I got took.

A few years back a young vet, working for one of the local high volume animal hospitals, decides there is more to life than figuring out how to screw animal owners out of the maximum $ per visit. He headed down the street and sets up shop in a ratty, old ranch house on a busy property. the guy is now busier than a one armed paper hanger in a wind storm. He recently removed a tumor from my old dog's skin. Our original vet did the same surgery, a while back, and charged $1100 (after quoting $6-700). The new guy charged a bit over $400, and removed two additional lumps for free, while the dog was under. The whole industry has drifted in a horrible direction, fueled by greed, and the rural mansion building vets are pretty common here too. It was nice to find an exception.

MushCreek · #15 05/18/12, 05:28 AM

I'd like to know if there's a source for decent plumbing supplies- that don't leak! When I plumbed the bathroom in my barn, I used PEX, and had several leaky joints. I kept having this problem, and finally bought another gauge to check them. The gauge that came with the tool was off! I had to re-do the whole bathroom. Then, I can't buy a drain fitting that doesn't leak. I've replaced them with different brands, yet they all leak. Maybe I need to go to a plumbing supply house instead of Home Cheapo. I'm in the process of building an entire house- can't be dealing with all of these leaks!

Harry Chickpea · #16 05/18/12, 10:08 AM

MushCreek - sounds like those drains need better gasketing. Example: When setting a sink drain, I run a bead of plumber's putty under the flange, even if there is a cheapie gasket.

With threaded PVC, I've found that the thicker pink teflon tape is much better than layers of the thin stuff.

YuccaFlatsRanch · #17 05/18/12, 10:14 AM

Except for a Hose Bib I NEVER use threaded PVC.

#18 05/18/12, 10:21 AM

It could be verse. In the great white north the water lines have to be buried below the frost line, about 5 feet.

I will never use threaded PVC fittings. I hooked up a well pump with them and they leaked after a month. I think the vibration broke the seal. Replaced with galvanized and no problem.

YuccaFlatsRanch · #19 05/18/12, 10:23 AM

OK Harry ---- I have a 2500 gallon tank on one side of my road (near the well). This side of the road is on a little higher hill (about 10 feet higher). Pipe comes out of the tank, runs underground. down the hill to the road where it is sleeved under the road to the other side where the pipe runs up hill for about 60 feet to my booster pump which normally provides pressurized water to my property. Physics says that water in a closed system will seek it's own height, SO water up until 2 days ago was obeying the laws of physics and getting to the pump just fine. Now - not so much, but when I back fill the water line with water I am getting a stream of air bubbles bubbling up in the line, which to me indicates that I am pulling air into the system somewhere. My guess today is that it is being caused where the water is running downhill as that is where it probably has the greatest potential to be pulling a vacuum and pulling the air into the line. Otherwise, I would think that the water being forced in the line by the tank on the high side would be completely filling the line with water and would be providing the only source of pressure thus not allowing air to get into the line, rather, pushing water out of the line under some small pressure

Harry Chickpea · #20 05/18/12, 10:53 AM

The long run of pipe is 1" thickwall black pipe? Or is it white PVC?
You have described an inverted siphon. They can have two basic issues - leak or restriction.

My gut feeling is that somewhere along the way you have a crushed pipe. You might try this:
Buy an electricians tape (semi-stiff steel used to snake wires) and a 3/4" dowel
Sand one end of the dowel down to a rounded tip.
Cut of about 2" with that tip, and make a slot or notch in the other end of that 2" section to securely attach the snake without anything greater in diameter than that 3/4" dowel.
Use black electric tape to make marks every 5' along the electricians snake.
Wax the dowel.

You now have a probe that you can insert into the pipe, where it will fit LOOSELY. If it starts to bind, you will know where the crushed area or obstruction is, so you can save a lot of digging.

If I had to guess, unless the sleeve is iron, the point under the road would be where I would look first.

edit to add - Tractor Supply sells a cheap 3/4" and maybe a 1" black pipe that is not really suitable for direct burial. The walls are so thin that it crushes easily.

Also - on the dowel size - go a little smaller if you have to. Some pipe will distort a little before crushing.