Acetic Acid in Vinegar?

[Post Carbon]

Hi all,

Now here's a puzzle: If TSHTF and we couldn't go to the store to buy vinegar, how could we be sure that the vinegar we make has enough acetic acid in it to be safe to can pickles or salsa or the other myriad foods that homesteaders use vinegar for to put food by?

I've looked up how to test vinegar, and everything I've found is a complicated chemistry experiment with formulas a mile long, and specialized equipment. Yikes !

The recipes I've used are based on a 5% solution of vinegar. We would not want to put our families at risk for botulism just because our vinegar wasn't strong enough.

What I am hoping for is a folk method that will tell me that my vinegar is definitely strong enough, whether it's white or cider vinegar. For example, it will curl a hair in 10 seconds, or curdle egg white in 30, or dissolve a bean in 3 minutes. None of those are true, but you get the idea. Something along the lines of "a skillet is hot enough for pancakes when you flick water drops at it and they skitter across and then turn to steam."

Anyone have this kind of wisdom?

PCP

[Old Vet]

Read the label It will have the percentage their. Of course that would be taking their word for it but most manufactures are honest.

[goatlady]

It's my understanding and experience making my own vinegars, what you buy in the stores is already diluted down to that 5%. Made from scratch is much, much more acidic, as least mine is to taste and usage.

[Rick]

PH test?

[texican]

Originally Posted by goatlady

It's my understanding and experience making my own vinegars, what you buy in the stores is already diluted down to that 5%. Made from scratch is much, much more acidic, as least mine is to taste and usage.

That's what I was thinking... you're home brew vinegar would probably be stronger than your use to. I'd do a taste test, and probably go full strength, if I were home brewing.

I'm thinking, in a post shtf world, pickles and salsas would be low on the list of foods to be putting up... at least the first post shtf 'season'... I'd concentrate on the highest caloric foods I could grow (grains, corn, beans, etc.)

I keep several years worth of vinegar on hand... just in case. Have recipes for home brew... if one of my favorite foods was dependent upon vinegar, reckon I'd practice more... as it is, it's dirt cheap (in gallons anyway).

[Post Carbon]

Goatlady, thanks, that's interesting. I haven't made vinegar yet, ever, so knowing home-made vinegars are stronger helps. I had read somewhere that they are weaker, and not to use them in canning, so I was wondering.

Texican, yes, I can see you'd want higher caloric food, but on the other hand, if you are already homesteading, I'm assuming you're on the road to being pretty self-sustaining already in terms of food. For example, this was my first year growing potatoes, and I have enough to feed us all winter and up to the next harvest. Same for meat as long as I can keep the freezer going, and that's what solar cells are for.

No, what I was wondering about is all those canning recipes that call for ingredients that require us to go to the store. This year sometimes I would go in for apple cider vinegar and the store would be out. That and mustard seed. I get a bit irritated at people talking about being self-sufficient, when so much of their home-made stuff is reliant on purchased raw materials, even for something so innocuous as vinegar.

I realize I can't be fully self-sufficient, but anytime I purchase something at the store, I do wonder, "could I make this? Or could it be made by someone around here?"

I bought at least five gallons of apple cider vinegar for canning this fall. It's cheap, yes, but with our banner apple year here, it just made me wonder.

[Astrid]

Supposedly you can float an egg in strong vinegar.

"Vinegar has a density greater than that of the egg. So by Archimedes's principle, the egg floats on it.

The bubbling is due to the action of the acid in vinegar, acetic acid on the shell of the egg which contains CaCO3. The reaction is
2CH3COOH + CaCO3 ----------> (CH3COO)2Ca + H2O + CO2.
The carbon dioxide released leads to the bubbling."

[Pony]

I have a wonderful large crock of vinegar going right now. SO easy to do, especially when you have a lot of apple trees.

We made pear vinegar last year. Wow! That stuff took off!

You can use test paper from a brewing supply to test the pH. I'd like to try the floating egg trick. Is it like when you're making lye: if it floats, it's good?

Don't know what you folks consider "dirt cheap" for vinegar, but 'round here, it's close to $3 a gallon. I think that's steep.


Work of caution when buying apple cider vinegar: The HyVee chain carries apple cider FLAVORED vinegar, and charges dearly for it.

[JohnL751]

I have been believing that good home made vinegar was stronger than 5%. Now I am going to have to investigate and find out. I buy the little glass bottle of name brand for the table and the biggest and cheapist container for cleaning. I even wash my pinto beans with a little vinegar in the water for a cleaning agent.

The last I bought for " dirt cheap " was $1.29 a gallon. I haven't tasted it but it smells good and cleans great.

[Trisha in WA]

This is a great topic!
Vinegar is a fantastic digestive aid too. So those pickled veggies are really good to have on hand at all times.
I buy my white vinegar at Costco 2 gallons for about $3. Yup that's pretty cheap (I really only use that kind for cleaning), but the apple cider vinegar I buy is much more expensive and I buy it by the 5 gallon bucket (it's cheaper that way and never goes bad).
It's a good thing to know how to make these things....and actually put it in to practice before your life depends on it.

[KIT.S]

We make our own vinegar from apple wine. We use our own apple juice, add yeast and after it's wine, open it up to the air and it becomes vinegar. It's so much tastier than what you can buy in the store that my DD puts 1/4 cup in a glass of water and just drinks it.

As far as acid percentage, I'm very interested in this thread, because I wondered too. Actually, what I remember Dad telling me is to put a real pearl in a dish of vinegar and it will disolve. However, I don't know that I want to donate a pearl each time I need to test the vinegar.

Also, as far as being self sufficient, we can make sourdough bread, but I guess just have to take pot luck for wild yeast for wine making if we couldn't buy it.
Kit

[goatlady]

Be aware also that homemade vinegar WILL have flavor, depending on what you used to make it with. The least flavored I have done was a wheat vinegar and most flavor was elderberry .

[Sonshine]

OK, a bit of a thread drift here, but would anyone be willing to share your recipes for making vinegar? I've never made it. Tried once, but obviously did something wrong. Thanks. Oh, and I do have a couple of apple trees to make apple cider vinegar. What other things do you all make vinegar out of?

[Heritagefarm]

Originally Posted by Rick

PH test?

That is one method of operation. An accurate digital pH meter can be purchased for $50-100, and will tell you the pH of your vinegar. (This would also work to make homemade ash lye soap that did not burn.)

[DaynaJ]

To be careful when consuming to much will encourage gout--anyone else heard this?

[unregistered5595]

There are tests you can make to test your vinegar. The one I used, used red cabbage to test homemade vinegar against vinegar with a known PH (5%-6% acid)--comparing the colors to determine the strength of the homemade vinegar.
If you search around on the internet you can find the red cabbage test. Here is one: http://www.scifun.org/homeexpts/acidbase.html

[ryanthomas]

Originally Posted by DaynaJ

To be careful when consuming to much will encourage gout--anyone else heard this?

Actually, apple cider vinegar with the mother has long been used as a home remedy for gout. It may be that commercial pasteurized vinegar exacerbates gout.

As far as testing strength, you should be able to find enough test strips to last you a lifetime for under $10.

[goatlady]

Homemade vinegar is nothing more than homemade wine that has "gone bad." For me, about 1/2 way through the fermentation process I take the air lock off the jug and let it get contaminated with "wild" yeasts and instead of a nice wine you get a really nice vinegar. Anything you can make wine out of will also make vinegar. I just happer to prefer the fruits, but have done wheat and rubarb - horrible wines, passable vinegars.

[Pony]

Originally Posted by goatlady

Homemade vinegar is nothing more than homemade wine that has "gone bad." For me, about 1/2 way through the fermentation process I take the air lock off the jug and let it get contaminated with "wild" yeasts and instead of a nice wine you get a really nice vinegar. Anything you can make wine out of will also make vinegar. I just happen to prefer the fruits, but have done wheat and rubarb - horrible wines, passable vinegars.

I don't think it's wine gone bad, b/c I've had wine go bad - Ugh! ("When wine goes bad, on the next episode of COPS!" )

Srsly, when I set out to make vinegar, I make vinegar. I have used mother to start, I've used a short sprinkle of wine yeast, and I've just let the vinegar flies do their thing.

I'm way primitive in my production. Don't use airlocks or anything, just toss the peelings and cores and juice and whatevers into the crock, give the wild beasties a chance to get settled in, then cover it with cheesecloth.

Next time I make a batch of wine, though, I think I'll use the must to start some vinegar...

[texican]

Originally Posted by DaynaJ

To be careful when consuming to much will encourage gout--anyone else heard this?

Imho, anyone drinking more than the tiniest amount of vinegar already has some problems... call it gout? I'd call it something else, but grandma said I shouldn't call folks 'such names'. Course, I hear tell, that some folks drink all sorts of flammable liquids...