Barn Building: Lessons learned?

[Climber]

Hey guys and gals,
I would like your help and opinions on my barn idea. Here is the scenario:

We are planning on building a barn on some land near our house. The intent is to have a barn that will house my tractor, other toys and have a small living area that will be used on the weekends. The barn will be used in this manner for about 4 or 5 years until we build our permanent home out there. No animals until the permanent move.

My perceived "needs":
- stalls for 3 horses (I doubt we ever get more than 2)
- Monitor style barn
- size: 36 x 48? This would give us 4 stalls 12' x 12' with a 12' aisle and 12' open area for tack room and storage
- upstairs loft area used for living area
- concrete slab with root cellar
- budget: Under 50K. I will do all the interior finish work and electrical but have my builder put it up, rough in plumbing and electric and dig foundation/ lay slab.

So, my two questions are:
1) Does this sound realistic?
2) What is your favorite barn "thing" (time saver, built in feature, etc..) and what would you do differently?

Thanks in advance!

[Alice In TX/MO]

Build twice as big as you think you need, if you can afford it.

[Vickie44]

Would you be putting in a bathroom ? Will you have room for a cross-tie / tackroom area. Might you want to have a chicken area ? Having your living area upstairs will be hot in the summer. Just some thoughts

[Beeman]

Security for when you're not there.

[silverbackMP]

I'd put all on one level; its probably not much more expensive by the the time you figure in the extra cost of attic trusses. Especially if your never going to move; I don't want stairs when I'm in my 60s, 70s, 80s. I'd look into security systems and cameras (but I'm a bit paranoid). If were me, I'd make two buildings one for the livestock and another for the tractor/shop/mancave and insulate the living heck out of it; I would also have it 14' minimum and have high windows--1) to prevent breakins and 2) to open and have a draw effect combined with an open door to move heat out in the Summer (if your not going to go w/AC).

[English Oliver]

I am getting ready to build a barn similar to this. It will be a pole type 32X48 with a 32X60 slab, the barn will have a 12X32 covered area on one end. It will have 14" side walls and two 12' high overhead doors in the center of one long side. There will be a 12X32 workshop on one end and a 12X32 kitchen and bathroom on the other end. The workshop and kitchen sections will have a loft for storage over them accessible from the drive in bays. I am getting it put up and utilities roughed in and I will do all the interior work. I think your 50K is very reasonable.

"O"

[time]

I wouldn't use concrete in a stall for horses. Even with thick bedding it will wear out shoes/hooves and be slippery for them. You could put stall matts over the concrete but urine will pool under it unless there is very good drainage, even then it will not dry under the mats. Very stinky.

[TooManyHobbies!]

Check the codes where you live first. They may not allow "living quarters" in a building meant for animal housing. You may need to do this under the radar. Some places also don't allow RV's, campers, or tents to be used as housing, even in rural areas. You'll need to look into what is legal there.

If RV's and campers are legal, but the barn dwelling isn't, then move in a cheap RV and park it right up next to the camper, with a carport over it and a door opening to the barn. No one has to know where you REALLY sleep, etc. If this is the situation, then you might have to do some things a bit different, like not installing an "official" kitchen, but rather using a modified kitchen (hot plates, portable oven, etc.)

You may want to add a laundry area to your plan, either way.

[TooManyHobbies!]

Additional thought: install the equivalent of a floor level mop sink. I have often wished for one, at every place where I've ever lived. They are great for washing off muck covered boots, tools, etc. without getting crud everywhere. Personally, I'd have a washer & dryer, with a double tub laundry sink next to them, and a mop sink in the same area for really dirty stuff.

[motdaugrnds]

I would not create living quarters above a barn as heat and smell rises; instead, I would create a loft for housing baled hay for winter use. I

I would create the concrete slab (or at least hardened area prepared of graduated rock) for the tractor and garden tools; but would not put a root cellar under it.

I would place the barn near where I will be creating a garden so as to make use of used bedding and there would be a root cellar. (I would extend the root cellar so that it can be used as housing because it would be cool in the summer and warm in winter months.)

I love TMH's idea of a "floor level mop sink" as washing off mud here would save your ceptic tank. I would also consider one of those toilets that does not need to be connected to a ceptic system (forgot what they're called). And I would add an "out-door" shower area.

[rambler]

You are mixing oil & gas fumes with livestock fumes with living quarters. I realize you said no livestock until the house is up tho, but....

Here in my climate mixing livestock and machinery in the same building rusts the heck out of the machinery. the humidity and salt from the livestock just does a number on metal over the years. I would want 2 buildings, one for metal stuff, one for critters. 'Here' a combo building ends up very corrosive to the machinery.

Size matters, you can't ever have too big a building. That needs to be balanced with what one can afford of course. But bigger is better. If you have a tractor, you'll have implements to use with it - where will they fit? Will you be able to pull the tractor & implement in behind it, or will something be sticking out the door getting rained on....

For machinery, you want a tall building. You need it 12 feet high, so you can put a 10-11 foot door on it. Whatever tractor you have, you'll end up with a bigger one. You'll end up with a backhoe, they stick up in back. You'll have a cab on a tractor. You'll have a sickler mower, folded up they can be just over 8 feet tall. Whatever, you'll regret having less than a 10 foot high door some day. You didn't mention height at all, and it is very important.

Plan for the switch - it sounds like the living quarters will be abandoned and turned into 'shed' over time. 1st or 2nd floor, either way, what will that area be useful for? Hay/ straw storage, tool area, what? Have enough headroom, or large enough 'rooms' or easy to knock down walls to make this area useable after you get a real house. Would be a bummer to find out you have a roofed area you can't use well because the stairs are too narrow to get anything there, or roof a foot too low, or some such.

--->Paul

[oregon woodsmok]

If you will have horses, have at least 12 X12 with concrete flooring and a good large drain. Cover the concrete with rubber stall mat and that's your wash rack and grooming area. Hot and cold water mixing faucets at the wash rack are a very appreciated luxury.

Also water and sink in the tack room for washing tack, making mash, and working with medications.

[Kyan Myst Farm]

I love your idea! I wish I had an 'apartment' in the loft of my barn. I'd live there in a minute. I've threatened to live in the tack room. As it is, I live about 5 miles away from the property and while that's not far, sometimes it's a pain.

I have a cousin in Tennessee who has his barn setup like you're talking about. It's beautiful! I believe it's 30' x 40', with 2 bedrooms and 2 baths. To me his stalls aren't big enough but he doesn't keep his horses in much. Nobody lives there at the moment but when I go up for a visit he lets me stay there.

I agree with whoever said to build more than you'll think you need. My barn is 40' x 60' with 8-12' x 14' stalls and a 14' x 16' tack room. Everybody told me I was nuts for building it that big since I only had 3 horses at the time. I still only have 3 horses but I have a donkey, goats, cows and I let my son-in-law keep his pigs there so we've pretty much run out of room already. I also wish I'd put outside doors on all my stalls. Currently I only have 4 stalls with doors that lead out to a lot. A wash rack is also a good idea. We did all the building ourselves except for putting the tin on the roof. I'm not sure how much I spent exactly but I'd say $15,000 to $20,000 all together.

Good luck!

[Climber]

Thanks for the feedback yall! Please keep the ideas coming.

I'm not too concerned about animal smells in the apartment. I have a friend and his daughter lives in the loft above his barn. Provided you have good insulation and good airflow, smells don't seem to be a problem. Further, we will not have the horses in there full time and I plan on building them a shed to keep them out of the weather.

[djberg]

Just my opinion, but it's a bad idea to have living quarters in a horse barn. Building codes may allow that, but most state's health codes require a distance of 75', 100' or more between living space and animal housing. Most people and many building inspectors don't know that, but insurance companies do. I've heard of many instances where the insurance company wouldn't pay fire damage claims because "house barns" were illegal structures.

And, there are a bunch of reasons why health departments require the distance and why insurance companies don't like to insure house barns.

I know that you're planning to move out before the horses move in, but plans change. You may be building a structure that reduces the value of your property.

As said before, you'll do better to build two structures. Build a small pole barn for your horses and a little cabin that can expand into your dream home. Plan well and you might do it within your budget and have a head start on that home you're planning.

Don

Today's Plans

[SFM in KY]

If I were to do it again, I would never have anything except one of the 'Cover-all" type barns. We have one ... plus several smaller 'raftered' shelters with that kind of roof ... and I am absolutely sold on them.

I would simply use one end/corner of the barn to park a travel trailer for living space.

[Jolly]

A few years ago, we had a deer lease in NE Lousiana. For sleeping quarters, we pulled an older travel trailer up into an old barn on the property.

It was out of sight and we could lock the barn doors when we weren't there. Never had anything go missing...

[FarmboyBill]

I had a neighbor and we built him a monitor type barn. I tried to talk him out of it, Tried to talk him into one storie. Couldnt. So, now hes got a loft for bailed hay, and ya know what? he loves round bales, and hes never used it,
I can tell you that it takes way more time and some more material to build a monitor style roof than a standard V shaped one.

[FarmboyBill]

Im sposeing u got the idee of haveing a root celler in the barn from some old Eric Sloan barn book. Good enough idea I guess, If you could put it on the S side of the barn.

[Jalopy]

If you are thinking of a monitor barn have you considered "Socket Sytem" ? It is a nice concept that relates to post and beam but uses steel joints where post and beams intersect.
Also if you want the living quarters in the loft area think about a hinged stairway so that when you are not going up or down it lifts back up and blocks air movement and allows useable space on the lower level on a temporary basis.
In our neighborhood there was a large dairy barn built in 1908 that was 60 by 120 and it had a two bedroom living quartes in one end ofthe loft for the milking help. It was demolished in a tornado in 1989 but it was a landmark in the area. So the concept of living over the livestock is not new. Good Luck