60s -70s Ford tractors

[farmerbrian]

Hi Guys,

Been slowly shopping for a general purpose utility tractor for our new place.
Im becoming more focused on the older Ford lines and have a few questions.

Industrial vs Ag front end.... Ind = fixed heavy duty solid axle and Ag allows adjustments, thats the basic idea right? Some industrials dont have PTO and 3PT? Why would I need to adjust the front end on a tractor?

2000, 3000, 3400,4000....are these all basically the same tractor but different sizes? 3400 is industrial only? but I have seen 3000 and 4000 with both industrial and ag frontends. Some yellow, some blue, some all rust...how do these fit together as a series. ( I know x000 line reused model numbers from earlier fords, just to keep things confusing)

Here are four I have my eye on. Havent looked at any of them yet...what do you think for price and appearance?

#1 3400 with loader and brushhog: $6500

#2 3400 with loader mower: $4700

#3 4000 with loader: $5500

#4 3000 tractor only : $4500

I'm only half heartedly interested in #4 since a loader is big plus.

Thanks!

Brian

[Old Vet]

One thing is with a loader is what are you going to do with it. If you pick up a load it will lessen the weight on the back end and you may not be able to move with it. This is where the 4 wheel drive comes on handy. If you are going to push with it or pick up light loads 2 wheel drive is OK but if you are going to pick up large loads 4 wheel drive is best.

[foxtrapper]

Hadn't heard it claimed that an industrial tractor had a heavier front axle. Have seen many industrial tractors that have no 3-point hitch or pto.

A loader wears the heck out of the front end of a tractor. They are a bear to steer, especially when you have a full load in the bucket. Counterweights are frequently necessary.

[uncle Will in In.]

A loader on a tractor makes a much better all around tool around a homestead. You will find that the loader will get more useage than all the other tools you have for the tractor. With 2 wheel drive, the heavier the tractor, the better the results with the loader. All thing being equal, the 4000 would be way better than the smaller cheaper tractor without a loader. Be sure you get the three point hitch.

[farmerbrian]

Old vet: 4WD would be nice but from what I've seen it just wont be in my price range for the size machines I'm looking at.

Fox: You are right about many industrials not having PTO or 3-point....But lots still seem to have them... For the ones that DO have the PTO...whats the difference vs an Ag model then? And yes I will only be purchasing a tractor with power steering

Uncle Will: Yup the loader is high on the list....Im curious what the hydraulics specs on TractorData for the 3400 (classified as industrial) vs the 4000 will mean for loader performance:
3400
Hydraulics:
Type: -unknown-
Capacity: 6.15 gal [23.3 L]
Pressure: -unknown-
Valves: 0 to 2
Total flow: 13.7 gpm [51.9 lpm]
19.1 gpm [72.3 lpm] (optional)

4000
Hydraulics:
Type: open
Capacity: 8.4 gal [31.8 L] (transmission PTO)
8.1 gal [30.7 L] (independent PTO)
Pressure: 2500 psi [172.4 bar]
Valve flow: 5 gpm [18.9 lpm]
5.5 gpm [20.8 lpm]
Steering flow: 4.5 gpm [17.0 lpm]
Steering press.: 800 psi [55.2 bar]

[Beeman]

A loader is nice buy basically none of those tractors were well designed for a loader. I have a 2600 2wd diesel with a loader. If it wasn't a quick release loader it would really be a PIA. I have to take it off to do any tractor work. Between it being in the way and messing up your turning radius it takes so much weight off of the rear tires you lose traction. Most are also no set up from the factory with hydraulics you can just connect to. Mine has a "block" under the seat whre you tap into the existing hydraulics. I have to connect the 2 lines together when I remove my loader so my 3pt will work. There is a block with a valve that would eliminate this but it's pricey and this setup came with the tractor.
I'm seriously thinking about trading to a smaller 4wd with a loader. I'm tired of getting stuck if you face downhill and try to back up.

[rancher1913]

you need to tell us what the tractor will be doing. 3000 nice small farm or large garden worker but to light for serious field work. 4000 bit big for tight spots but will do miedium disking and allaround field work.

[fordson major]

usually the industrial loaders had their own high gallon pump that could also run a back hoe were the farm tractors ran the loader off the internal hydraulic pump. i would not keep a gas as a main tractor!! to much money for the horse power!

[plowjockey]

I'm still kicking myself for letting a 3400/loader get away at an auction. Ran like new and was built like a tank.

Every tractor that has a loader, needs add-on rear weights to function properly, whether 2WD or 4WD. There is a lot of weight teetering up there and you need something to hold the back down.

I wondered how these old tractors managed to get around just fine, with only 2WD - for over 50 years.

A utility tractor without a loader, loses about 50% of it's usefulness, IMO,

I vote for #1. Get wheel weights for it.

[farmerbrian]

Uses I see for the tractor on our 40 acres, ~13 cleared, gentle slopes:

Immediate (this year and beyond)
general loader work moving loose material around: gravel, mulch, dirt, compost, manure etc.
Maintaining ~1200 ft of gravel driveway
Maintaining woods roads and walking trails
Post hole digger for fencing and planting trees
Assisting with snow removal
plowing 1/2 acre or so for initial garden creation (may ask a neighbor for help with this one time task)
Getting firewood out of the woods

Medium term
Stationary implements maybe: chipper, splitter,
Extra attachments for the loader, pallet forks, brush grapple

Long term
Haying my own fields

I dont plan on using this in the gardens once they are established. I have a old BCS 2 wheel tractor with a few attachments that I plan on using in there. And I dont have any plans for general field work like plowing, discing etc but who knows what the future holds.

I've been thinking about the gas vs diesel from a fuel efficiency stand point too...yet another factor to consider. I also am looking at an AC 160 diesel with loader and brush hog for $6000.

So with these tasks in mind am I looking at the right line of tractors? I want to stay around 6K with a loader.

[Old Vet]

If you buy a front end loader on a 2 wheel drive you need water in the back tires and wheel weights also. I have both a 2 wheel drive and a 4 wheel drive. The 2 wheel drive has ballast and wheel weights on the back end and does a good job of going forward but if you want to go in reverse you have to be careful if you are pulling anything because the rear tires will slip. I have trouble backing up a hill anytime. With 4 wheel drive just engage the front end and go most anywhere. That is why most with front end loaders have the back wheels reversed. You can then go backwards but slip going forward. It is what you are going to use it for that counts.

[taylorlambert]

THe Industrial lines were made for loader work matched with a certain series of loader. I have a 3550 TLB It was made from 73 to 75. THe 2000 3000, 3400, 3500, 3550, 4000, 4500, 5000,5500 were all matched to a loader, hoe and industrial 3 point.

My 3550 was a TLB version with a 731 loader attachment. The Industrial versions with the straight fron axle didnt have the drop spindles that the AG versions had. The Industrial set a little lower and the spndles were centered on the axle with King pins. THe hubs were also a bit stouter. The transmissions were either shuttle shift with a gear range on the floor with forward and reverse on the collumn. The Semi shuttle shift that my 3550 has has a the floor shifter that has a reverse behind the first 2 forward speeds out of the 3 then it has a hi low range like the ag version.


Also the rearends were a bit beefier with bigger brakes. Mine hasnt got the lift but a friend has one that does. Mine doesnt have the internal transmission pump for a 3 point but has provsions for one to be added and all the places to put the levers and lift parts. Mine doesnt have the pto either. THe hoe is quick tach and could be equiped with a counterweight for loader only duty, large industrial power down 3 point for blade work.

My loader has the fron crank driven pump and the loader is fast on it. Most of the industrial loader Ford made would fir the Ag counter parts but some of the bucket specs wouldnt match because of the dropped spindles and tire choices. They mostly had the same castings and holes to mount the loader on. But in doing heavy loader work or especially on rough terrain the lag spindles would bend or crack. Also the Industrials usually had larger steering boxes with Power assist cylinders on the linkage. I ave my 3550 at work along side of the 4000 Ag that belongs there Ill try to get some pictures of the axle differences.

On 2wd If I have to take the hoe off I will put on my homemade counter weight or load the tires. On one with a 3 point if you load the rear tires and add the wheel weights you can get alot done. M y friend with a 3550 loader and boxblade tractor gardens with one row equipment and raises a garden with his.

[Williams farm]

Some industrials have different trannies with rather steep gearing for road travel, but most are just yellow painted ag tractors with or without the PTO and 3pth and theheavier front axle. The heavier front axle can be a plus or minus, its lower profile and unadjustable. If you row crop you may want to shift your axle spacing, or sometimes it makes for a better loader tracotr spaced as you need. I suspect there are more aftermarket parts for ag front ends.

[rambler]

Ford did very well in these years of selling fleets of tractors to road maintenence county hwy depts.

These were ordered how the county wanted them, very specific to what that county wanted to use it for. Could get a cheap tractor if you left the 3pt and pto off, for example.

So, shop with that in mind. What was left off of the Industrial model????

And what pump was added to run hydraulics? The ag standard pump was about 5 gal per minute, which runs a loader kinda slow but works. The industrials might have 12-20 gallon pumps to run a lot more hydraulic stuff a lot faster.

Adjustable ag front end is important if you grow corn or other row crop and need to adjust the wheels to fit the row width of corn to cultivate it. As well, plowing is easier if you can adjust the tractor wheels to line up the plow more easily.


Be careful of tranny types. Ford had the automatic - the SoS tranny during those years. while it actually worked well, it is now very old and likely needs an overhaul or at the least adjusting. These SoS trannys have 3x as many parts in them, and so - are more expensive to fix than the tractor costs. Be aware of what you are getting.....

They also made 4 speeds which are lacking gears to choose from. Good enough if that is what you want.

The 5-speed was good, and the 8 speed even better.

For what you want 2wd of these models will do you just fine, a little weight on back will work out great, these tractors will balance out better than the compact 4wd little tractors with short whealbases. The scardest I've ever been was on a compact diesel with loader without weight on the rear end, yikes. And I come from a narrow front end loader tractor that is supposed to be dangerous, but never ever scared myself like that un-weighted 4wd tractor. You won't have a problem with any of these 2wd tractors and a loader.

Could be 100 different ideas or opinions, sometime you just gotta jump in and buy, learn, and if you need to resell it for something else, you probably can re-sell it for about what you paid for it, so not out anything by jumping in and buying something.

--->Paul

[Micheal]

Just to toss in my 2 cents, as a pass owner of a Ford 3000. I owned one from 1974 to 2008; bought it new for $12,000 and got $5,000 as a trade-in.
I did all the growing (garden) stuff with it, plowing, discing, etc.
I did haying with it, mowing, raking, baling, pulling a wagon, etc. Although I couldn't bale and pull a wagon together - my fields were just to hilly. So the bales were dropped on the ground and picked up later.
I used it in the woods when doing firewood and some minor logging.
I used it with a back-blade and snowblower (and tire chains) to keep my 450+ foot driveway open during the winter, along with sometimes letting the neighbor use it for the same reason.
I used it, a backblade, the 2 bottom plow and a brushhog to do landscaping and pasture clearing.
My neighbor (different one) used it when his tractor broke and needed a tractor to run the blower to put corn into his silo.
There were most likely a ton of other things I forgot I used it for.
All in all I thought it to be a very good tractor. The only reason it was "traded in" was that the 3 point hitch was starting to slip and the engine was starting to lose compression - a BIG repair bill to say the least.
Anyway I hardly ever needed a loader and when I did I rented a bobcat for a day to do anything I needed done.
Just my point of view as to the Ford 3000........ without a loader..

[Ross]

Luv the Fords of that era and the basic line continued into the 90's with improvements in steering and hydraulics. They just made good even better. I would add the Ford 5000 and 6600 to your list. My hp but a stronger tractor all round in the thickness of steel and drive line, steering etc. Nothing wrong with a 3 or 4000 but you can get more for about the same money .

[Ross]

Oh you definately want a diesel, you get twice the use for the same amount of fuel and IMO the diesels need much less repairs. At this point there are so many after market parts for a 1000 series Ford even diesel parts are cheap.

[Beeman]

Diesel is the way to go but.. Ford diesels of that era never had a reputation of being easy to start when cold. Worn out Ford diesels of that era are onery to start cold and have usually been etered to death. If you have a block heater and patience they start just fine, few have the patience and forethought to plug them in so they crank them to death and spray ether to start them.

[farmerbrian]

Thanks for the great info as always.

Could be 100 different ideas or opinions, sometime you just gotta jump in and buy, learn, and if you need to resell it for something else, you probably can re-sell it for about what you paid for it, so not out anything by jumping in and buying something.

You are right on that one Paul! I have been shopping for a tractor for about 4 years now, but didnt have a legit need for one until a few months ago. So at this point I want to make a purchase partially to just get it over with!

[fordson major]

the other thing to watch for on any older gas tractor is they were made to run on leaded gas. you can get vale seats that work with the new gas blend but if they have not been run with treated gas it can be a problem!+