Restoring Windows in an Historic house

[fellini123]

Ok, we are looking at purchasing an old house, read 1877. The windows are great looking, but are your typical old house windows. They shake rattle and roll!!

We were planning on taking each one down, removing the glass. Carefully cleaning the paint off, reglazing and putting the glass back in.

Now these are single pane glass, you know the old stuff with the bubbles and wavy glass. We want to keep them. But we would also like the temperature in the house to get above freezing!! LOL So any idea of what would work??

Now I hate the clear plastic that you put on and use a dryer for. Not only do I think it is UGLY, it also would be horribly expensive with the number of windows we have.
So I was thinking about inside storm windows?? But what would you make them out of?? And would that work??

Alice in Virginia

[Aussie Bob]

This is not an attractive option but is very effective .Sheets of bubble wrap plastic ,maybe framed ,attached to the window frames .Very effective !! We certainly don't get your cold winters ,an occassional -5C ,but we put bubblewrap on our large picture windows during cold winter's nights .We only have wood heating so its all hard work and we won't waste the heat.Curtains with thermal lining complete the heat seal .

[Paquebot]

That's what old heavy drapes were for in the past. They were almost like quilts and no cold could get through them. They were about as close to thermopanes as one could get in their time. Opened in the daytime to let in sun and drawn at night to block drafts.

Martin

[Old Vet]

You can get the inside windows made from just about anything. I would get one that is a full pane in other words one or two pain for each window and have it made in aluminum and have it match the interior of the house.In other words the inside storm window would simply only frame the old windows will be their for looks.

[sheepish]

The really important thing is that the inside pane should not let any air leak from the house to the outside pane. If it does, ice will form on the outside pane, because the relatively moist air will condense. That is the problem with heavy draperies. They let the air leak and so the windows will be frosted all winter and then damp from spring to fall. That would cause mold and rot on the window glass and frames.

[7thswan]

Get some Ideas from a glass company. I have seen on TV, where they put glass over Leaded or Stained Glass, but don't know the details.

[Immaculate Sublimity]

Originally Posted by Old Vet

You can get the inside windows made from just about anything. I would get one that is a full pane in other words one or two pain for each window and have it made in aluminum and have it match the interior of the house.In other words the inside storm window would simply only frame the old windows will be their for looks.

Having been in the window business for a couple decades here, I can tell you that if you really want to keep the old windows for asthetics then inside storms are the way to go. you can get them in vinyl that wont conduct the cold like aluminum will.
However... while the look of a single pane of glass is certainly appealing since there are no other things to get in the way of the view... the last thing anyone wants to be doing is crawling through broken glass in the event of a fire. Have storms made up to match the opening of your windows.

[silverbackMP]

Read in Fine Homebuilding several years back that properly maintained single panes are nearly as good as double panes.

[geo in mi]

From my experience with the old glass, hopefully you will have a ready supply of replacements, since your attempts to remove them from the frames will crack and break quite a few of them--they are very brittle and the least amount of stress will damage them....just a thought. Oh, though...DAP makes a latex setting/glazing caulk in a cartridge that works pretty good--has a rectangular point to make the angle you need for the outside glazing. Different from the glazing in a can, worked with a putty blade.

geo

[RosewoodfarmVA]

I do restoration work for a side-living (along with the farm), I would certainly not remove the glass if the sashes are in good condition and the glass is not broken. As stated above you will most likely break many of the panes you try to remove. If the glazing is bad, scrape off the loose glazing, take a razor knife to remove all the 'chalky' glazing leftovers from the wood, apply a wood sealer to the bare wood, then reglaze. As for sealing them, be aware that wood windows will expand and contract with the weather. If you tighten them up so they are sealed in winter, you probably will not be able to open them in summer. The best thing is some good felt weatherstripping applied to the stops where the sashes slide, and at the bottom and top. I would fix the top sash by caulking all around it, if you have both sashes moveable. This helps a lot with weatherproofing as you only have to weatherstrip the lower sash. I do not know if you plan to open the windows often, but if you have central ac and do not plan to use the windows for summer cooling, you can caulk both sashes shut from both the inside and outside. This both seals them from water penetration and does not permit air entry. If this is done the windows will be almost as energy efficient as new replacements, though with only the single pane. The wooden sashes are a much better insulator than both aluminum and vinyl. The main problem with old windows is not the glass, but the seal around the sashes. By good weatherstripping, or caulking them shut, you can keep the aesthetics while also bringing them up to modern ac/heat standards.

[RosewoodfarmVA]

An additional note, if you remove the sashes for any reason, do not confuse which sashes went where! Mark all of them which window and lower or upper, as an old house settles the sashes conform to the house, after 140 years if you try to swap sashes from different openings you will have a very hard time getting them to fit right again!

[paintboy]

I love doing this kind of work. You can use a heat gun to soften the old glazing. Then it will be easier to remove. This will be a time consuming process to make these window look good and operate properly. Please don't try to use the glazing in a tube. It will never look like the real thing.

Also, you are dealing with lead paint. Make a safe work area where you can control the dust. Don't leave the old paint chips laying on the ground. Bag them and off to a dump. Wear a good mask or respirator.

Before you put the glass back in prime the whole sash. This will seal the wood under the glazing and give you a smoother surface to work with.

As for air flow. I hate to say it but storm windows of some kind will fix it.

[TnAndy]

Originally Posted by RosewoodfarmVA

An additional note, if you remove the sashes for any reason, do not confuse which sashes went where! Mark all of them which window and lower or upper, as an old house settles the sashes conform to the house, after 140 years if you try to swap sashes from different openings you will have a very hard time getting them to fit right again!

And most probably, they weren't the same size to start with.....hand built on site, and each of them will vary slightly in size.

[mnn2501]

Restoring Windows in an Historic house

You can tell I'm a computer tech: the first thing I thought of when I saw the title was to put the restore disk in and let it run.

[solidwoods]

We have an 1890 house with original windows.
They haven't been rejuvenated at all yet.
We use the shrink plastic and it isn't expensive.
Done right its hard to see and I don't think it would look anywhere as bad a "indoor storm windows?"

Properly reconditioned the old windows can be made to look very nice and not leak much air.
Don't paint them when your done. I like Outdoor deck preservative because it doesn't melt/harden and glue the windows shut.
jim

[Wolf mom]

If you do break a pane, go to a reputable glazier - they have lots of samples of different types of "restoration" glass.......

[deb]

You should check out the This Old House web site. I did a search for "window' and it came up with lots of good articles and videos.

Here's 4 of the results:

This Old House - How to Repair Sash Windows

This Old House - How to Replace Window Sash Cords

This Old House - How To Trim Out A Window (traditional window trim)

This Old House - Troubleshooting Wood Windows

deb
in wi

[clovis]

I've restored more than a few historic windows in my life, and so far, you've gotten some GREAT advice.

Have you also thought about having exterior storm windows made that have wood frames and are historically accurate?

I had some priced out several years ago, and the price was about $140 per opening for an Italianate sized window.

IMO, this is one of the very best options out there. Be careful though, you need to look for quality when you do this. I have a friend that spent way more than the $140 per window. These were VERY poorly constructed out of cheap pine, and the guy who built them made every window 1/2 smaller than the measurements "so they would fit". What a joke!!!! Those storm windows do about as much good as a screen door on a submarine since they are so much smaller than the opening.

The place that was going to do mine were considered the premier place in Indiana for historic wood storms and sashes. Sadly, that business burned to the ground several years ago, and they closed their doors forever.

[Alice In TX/MO]

I'm glad I wasn't the only one wondering if it was Windows XP.

Reboot!

[fellini123]

Wow thanks guys I printed off all the great info. Hubby agrees with everything. He did question leaving no weep holes, but he understands the thoughts of freezing air between the storms and the windows, and then defrosting in the daytime and causeing mold, meldew and rot!!!! Nasty!!

Ok Ok I have windows 7 actually, so no reboot necessary!! LOL

We cant put anything on the outside as it is a National Registry house. And 3 stories!! I would NOT want to be the person on the ladder putting up the top windows!! LOL

I am going to try and change my avatar so you all can see the house.

Alice in Virginia