How did you get started?

sahmoffour · #1 11/27/10, 02:23 PM

Hubby and I are so dissatisfied with our current lives. We live in suburbia, he has a high stress very demanding (but high paying) job. We have four kids which I stay home with. I grew up on a farm, and have wanted to be back on a farm again ever since we moved to town when I was 19. Problem is, my Dad sold the farm and I don't know how to go about getting back into it. Seems for a good farm, that you can actually make a living off of, is around a cool million. I would love to homestead, but don`t see how we could make a living off of it, especially with four kids to raise (ages 2, 3, 6 & 8). We just put our house up for sale (we live in AB, Canada), and are open to moving anywhere in Canada to follow our dream.

So tell me, how did you get started? Do you or your partner work? If not, how do you pay the bills? I`m so scared to just jump in, only to be an epic failure. Our dream is to have us both at home, working on the farm with our children and making a living off of it, but I just don`t see how you can make enough money at it without having enough money in the first place to buy a turnkey farm operation that`s worth an insane amount of money...We will come out of this house with a decent amount of cash, but won`t be able to pay outright for a cheap small acreage even.

momof2birds · #2 11/27/10, 02:41 PM

If you are both agreed that this is what you ultimately want, there are some tough decisions and choices to be made. Are you willing to cut back on what you condider to be necessities currently? Most homesteaders live a much simpler life, without cell phones, 500 satellite channels (or indeed without TV, as I've done for 8 years), vacations, name brand clothing, wasteful use of electricity and water,... What do you consider to be 'necessary expenses'? This lifestyle is not for everyone but it can be very rewarding, especially when you start young with small children. I know everyone here will hve a ton of useful advice for you, and I wish you hope, joy and success.

Tracy Rimmer · #3 11/27/10, 03:14 PM

Welcome to HT!

This place is the farm just north of me:

http://www.REALTOR.ca/propertyDetail...idKey=64541082

There are 38 acres, so it's certainly not commercial farm material, but it would make a nice little homestead, has a nice barn and outbuildings, and an adequate home for just under $160K.

We seem to be in a bit of a micro-climate here. At least, I find that we can grow a lot of things here we're not supposed to be able to. I grow most of our own food, and we do just fine.

What does your DH do? You indicate he's some kind of a professional. There are jobs around, if one knows where to look. I don't suppose he's in IT?

What part of AB are you in? We moved here three and a half years ago from the Calgary area. Real estate prices here have increased since then, but not so much that it's out of reach for an average family.

Callieslamb · #4 11/27/10, 03:46 PM

We don't have the option of DH staying home. So, he works away and I farm. It's a very slow beginning. We have to be satisfied with not doing it ALL for ourselves. We started just wanting to live out of debt and each step that direction had us doing more for ourselves. We only have 7 acres and there is a ton of things we can provide for ourselves on just that little bit. We have a milk cow, 3 calves, six sheep, 10 chickens, a large garden and a small orchard including small fruits.

Somethings you might ask yourself - what would you like to do on a farm for income? Do you have a special interest area? Where could you best do that? If one of you has to work 'out' - is the other one willing to carry the on the farm work? Can you find some kind of niche market need to fill? Frequent Farmer's markets to see what's offered - and what's NOT. Is there something your climate/location has to offer that others don't take advantage of?

If you want to live on the farm you will need an income - unfortunately large farms are expensive as are the miriad of pieces of equipment to do the work. with a lot of research you will find that you can provide for yourself on very few acres. We wish we had a bit more....but are doing great with what we have.

sahmoffour · #5 11/27/10, 03:49 PM

Some more info...

We're definitely not afraid of scaling back, and have already done so. We had a small garden this year and did ok with it. I cook from scratch as much as possible. I homeschool our kids right now but have considered putting them back in school due to them being so secluded from others and none of us are really enjoying it at this point...but that's a whole 'nother can of worms saved for another discussion. We don't spend much money really on extras...we do have internet and cable tv which I wouldn't be able to give up lol. We shop at second-hand stores for clothes. Try to save on water and electricity and heat as much as we can, this past month alone I've saved $50 altogether on all three of those bills compared to other months, which is pretty good considering it's getting pretty cold here lately and dark very early.

Right now hubby works away a lot. He's the field manager of a screw piling company, which he's worked for for 10 years now. He can run heavy equipment, he is a welder by trade. He has his Level 1 welding inspection certificate and is going for level 2 soon. He's also worked at a cattle feedlot before when he was younger and has some training in that as well. He's definitely a hard worker with a very high work ethic and I know he would excel at anything he chose to do. It's scary for us because he's basically one of the boss-men at his work, and has a very secure job there, and we live in the town we both grew up in. But, even though we have some family here, basically none of them are any help to us. My family is very busy, never have time to spend together or babysit for us, etc. My mom passed away years ago, and my Dad spends 5-6 months of the year on vacay in Arizona. My hubby's family consists of his dad and brother, who are basically non-existent in our lives. We don't have a lot of friends here, and wouldn't have a hard time leaving. The main thing for us is that he still would need to make some kind of an income, and while jobs are easier to come by where we live currently, housing prices are high, but jobs seem to be harder to come by in other parts of the country. We've looked at Ontario as hubby's mom lives there, but I'm not sure what he'd do for work. I've searched kijiji and can't find anything that would be a good fit and would still make enough money. I guess the main thing is with farming I just don't know how much money we could possibly make at it. I know I want to have dairy goats/chickens/meat rabbits for our personal use no matter where we move to, but am unsure what type of farm to think about in order to bring in a bit of income.

Tracy, why did you guys move to MB? Do you have family there or were you just moving to an affordable area to give homesteading a try? We would probably be coming out of this house with about $65-70K to put down on a farm, so it's a good chunk but definitely not enough that we would still have mortgage payments to make.

Lyra · #6 11/27/10, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by momof2birds

If you are both agreed that this is what you ultimately want, there are some tough decisions and choices to be made. Are you willing to cut back on what you condider to be necessities currently? Most homesteaders live a much simpler life, without cell phones, 500 satellite channels (or indeed without TV, as I've done for 8 years), vacations, name brand clothing, wasteful use of electricity and water,... What do you consider to be 'necessary expenses'? This lifestyle is not for everyone but it can be very rewarding, especially when you start young with small children. I know everyone here will hve a ton of useful advice for you, and I wish you hope, joy and success.

Good point. A lot of people think they want the lifestyle but once it happens they realize it was a mistake. A large part of the difficulty lies in not being close to all of the amenities and opportunities that a more populated area offers. Distance and quality of schools, shopping, activities, church, etc. will all be factors in the change to a rural lifestyle.

Tracy Rimmer · #7 11/27/10, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sahmoffour

Tracy, why did you guys move to MB? Do you have family there or were you just moving to an affordable area to give homesteading a try? We would probably be coming out of this house with about $65-70K to put down on a farm, so it's a good chunk but definitely not enough that we would still have mortgage payments to make.

No family, this was just where we found the property that met our needs. We searched pretty much everywhere in Canada -- the search took us about seven years.

You will probably have to have at least one off-farm income, regardless. Unless you have a large amount of money to invest or some sort of private income, you'll need some money coming in, and farming isn't much of a living any longer, unless you can run with the big boys which, from you post, it doesn't sound like you're ready for.

There are jobs to be had -- for people with a good work ethic, anyhow -- in Brandon, and plenty of skilled trades needed all over the area. My village is currently ACTIVELY seeking an electrician, and they'll help out with some costs if someone qualified were interested in moving here and starting a business.

Don't believe everything that you hear about MB, either -- we had worse mosquitoes in AB, and our cost of living went down by at least a half, maybe even two-thirds, without much by way of loss of amenities. If you discount the chinooks (which I do because they only ever gave me headaches!) our weather isn't that much different, except we seldom get snow between May and October -- unlike AB

It's a lovely area -- we love it. The community is fantastic, and we are well on our way towards the lifestyle we looked for for so long. Most people in the area are very supportive, and they do love to see young families moving here!

ronbre · #8 11/27/10, 04:43 PM

got a great buy on the homestead, $8000, back in 1971..so we couldn't resist..it all went from there

chewie · #9 11/27/10, 06:34 PM

we lived on a ranch that included a house with pens for horses and goats, pretty much do as we pleased. during that 10 year stint, we found, and proceeded to pay off our property that had a nice barn, 16acres and utilities running to it. took a million hours to clean it up, build a house, and more headache than i can even put into words dealing with the bank!!

soooo, in light of our past experience.....if i were to have a do-over, esp. in this time of shakey economics, i'd build a small debt free place. use your house money to buy land, hopefully with utilites if you want those. there are posts/threads here about building a livable cabin type home for around $5000. your kids are small, you could build small now, add on later. or, buy a place even if the house is 'scary'. the land is what is important, and location.

we looked inot going a bit less on-grid, but in this area, we were money and comfort ahead just doing that 'normally'. but i do without, altho that seems an odd statement, as i do not feel 'without'....shopping, fancy cars, hiring out what we can do, etc. i guess i see it as i traded--big city convience for rural peace. i could easily get rid of the dish, keep tv only for netflix (DH thinks otherwise!) but having good internet is a huge help in this situation. i order tons of stuff online, plus learn more than i cuold ever figure out myself, or buy enough books for!

i would go slow....do your garden and then get a few hens. the next year, a couple goats. then maybe a couple pigs. you will know when you are ready for more. but if you get in too far too soon, that's not fun or useful.

we do not live off what we do here at home. we both work away, i only during hunting season and then odd job thru out the year. DH works for a nearby ranch. i also do artwork that i have in galleries, make soap, and do some barter/trading. i wish we could make it on what we could do here, we could do lots more, but there is no outlet for it--no farmer market as everyone has gardens, etc. here. but that is where some trading came in....soap for cukes, milk for hay.

we do use most of what we make for ourselves tho. soap, milk, cheese, bread, most stuff homemade, garden, pigs, chickens, .....you get it. so when i go to the store, i need very little. when the fruit trees grow, that'll even be less.

i think its cheaper in many ways going the traditional way. feed isn't cheap, but you can do things to help that too. but, the satifaction of eating a meal (or most!)of what you produced with your own hands on your own land, knowing its safe, healthy and tastes better than anything you can buy, priceless!

lmrose · #10 11/27/10, 06:38 PM

RE/MAX Banner Realty- 1-902-245-4952 or www.remax-valley.com or e-mail - digby@remax-valley.com is one realty who might could help you find a farm you can afford.

Also there is Pier 11 Realty LTD. 1-902-245-4711 e-mail: pier@ns.aliantzinc.ca

Another is Robert Long Real Estate- www.robertlong.ca

Any of them could tell you what homes, farms, acreages are available in Nova Scotia if anyone wants to move here.

Our old house, barn and ,ten acres was $25,000 and that was 25 years ago. The same today would be $70,000. Good farms could cost $150,000 on up in the Annapolis Valley.

We both worked ten years to pay off the bank. We were 39 and 40 we started and had two kids grown and two thirteen and fithteen at home. Then raised a grandson.

After the place was paid for we never worked full time again. Our expectations are simple and it cost us little to live because we are frugal. How hard you have to work for money depends on your needs and wants.

geo in mi · #11 11/27/10, 06:39 PM

sahmoffour,

Give me a few acres, a good power supply, and the ability to weld, and I think I could make it in equipment repair. I think you would have nothing to fear.

geo

big rockpile · #12 11/27/10, 09:26 PM

When I first started I worked two Jobs my wife worked one.All what I made went in Savings her pay Paid the Bills.Manage to save enough for down payment on 6 Bedroom House and 5 acres.

big rockpile

motdaugrnds · #13 11/27/10, 10:27 PM

If your primary concern is how to use the farm you will purchase to bring in money, I would suggest you research what is needed in the area(s) you are interested in. Then you can decide whether or not your farm could fill in that/those needs.

FarmboyBill · #14 11/27/10, 10:35 PM

U say u havnt been on a farm since u were a kid. Did u think your dads land was large. Point is, things change over time. Mom and dad may have made farm life seem enjoyable. Maybe u had brothers that did all the heavy work while u helped mom in the house and garden, or with the chickens ect. Point is, uve lived in town for years. Youve got soft. Youve forgot what real work is like. Dabbeling in a garden isnt nothing like haveing a mkt garden, other than u can make something grow. Haveing a doz chickens isnt like haveing a hundred, or any other dabbeling have anything to do with makeing a liveing doing something on a farm. U need to start dabbeling, and find and look for a feel for something that you feel is right for you to do. That will take years. U sound like u expect to jump right into a running farm with a sustainable income at the start. Wont happen.

Sonshine · #15 11/27/10, 10:41 PM

We only live on a couple of acres. DH works and I'm a stay at home Mom. DH helps with the chores around here, but most of it is usually done by me and our DS.

sahmoffour · #16 11/27/10, 11:21 PM

FarmBoyBill, I'm only 28, and moved off the farm 10 years ago. So yes, it's been awhile, but no I didn't just help my mom in the kitchen and garden. I don't expect to just jump in and make a good income off our farm. I know what farm life is like, and I know it will take time to build things up. I realize my husband will still have to work while we're doing this. My dad had a half section of land, and we had a herd of about 100 dairy cows which I helped milk morning and night. We also had a beef herd, as well as various other animals for our own purposes, including chickens, pigs, ducks, turkeys and a couple horses. I worked hard on the farm, and I do know what real work is. I can drive a tractor and various field equipment. I know a lot about caring for animals, and I had to get up early to milk and then go out to bed down animals in -40 blizzard conditions. Thanks for your input, but please don't make assumptions about me. I do have a good idea about what type of lifestyle I'd be undertaking, the main part that I'm unsure with is the $$ side of things, as I wasnt' involved in the cheque cashing/bill paying part of the farm. My Dad can give me a good idea on the $$ side of a dairy farm, but I'm more interested in smaller animals as I know I'll be doing a lot of the work on my own for the first few years anyways and I'd feel more comfortable with animals like dairy goats instead. Here anyways, there's not a large market for that so I'm having a hard time finding information about the financial side of dairy goat farming.

Thanks to everyone though, you've given me lots to think about.

Rusty'sDog · #17 11/28/10, 04:57 AM

It is not about how much you can "make". You must realize that for the first few years you will probably "make" nothing. None of us can afford to buy a "Turn-Key" operation. Even if the house/out-buildings are adequate, the land will need work. It is about building a future. Every $$$, every hour, you put into it will have to be measured against what your goal is. For example, a greenhouse will cost you xxx$. How many more (or how earlier) will your crops yield? Will it be large enough to provide x amount of surplus tomato plants to sell to the community. How long will it take to pay off the investment.. You seem like a savvy lady, and I am certain that you realize that you cannot buy somebodies failure and expect it to turn you a profit overnight. It takes time, work, and money to do it. There will be bumps in the road, but your time and efforts will be building a future for you and your family. If your children benefit nothing from it besides a good solid work ethic, you have beat the curve.

Good luck, and do NOT let the naysayers dissuade you. Your dream is your children's future!

Tracy Rimmer · #18 11/28/10, 07:59 AM

SAHM -- dairy goats are cool, but there is a ready market for meat goats in most major cities, and they are SO easy to raise!!!! If you end up near a major centre, you'd have a ready market for meat in the ethnic community there -- check into it.

Part of how we did this was in cutting our expenses to bare minimum and then squeezing the rest before we got here. We took a lot of grief from our friends, most of whom thought we should be able to "afford" to live like them. What they didn't understand was that we could, we just didn't want to.

There are a LOT of resources out there on simple living and frugality. Check out Amy Dacyczyn's books, The Tightwad Gazettes 1-3. Some of it doesn't have any bearing on us as Canadians, but some of it is very, very good. Read Your Money Or Your Life by Vicki Robin and Joe Dominguez and use the methods there to work towards saving up as much money as you possibly can. Every penny will make a difference in that first year, I promise you.

I'm not going to tell you to start gardening now because, if you're a farm girl, you're probably already doing this if you can, and also because you're looking to relocate and you'll probably not end up in the same type of growing conditions. Alberta is pretty unique, nationally.

Start collecting things you'll need now, and getting rid of those things you WON'T need. I started collecting canning equipment and jars first, then began visiting farmer's markets for our produce. By the time we were actually on land that I could grow anything more than a salad garden, I was already canning most of our year's produce from what I bought at market. This is a great way to save even more money.

Another money-saving measure -- if you live near or in Calgary or Edmonton, look into the Good Food Box program. This is NOT a Food Bank, it's a bulk/CoOp buying program through Community Kitchens, and is the absolute BEST way to buy produce through the winter if you're living in the city. In the summer, visit the markets, but in the winter, you can get a fantastic assortment of a great deal of produce for a nominal fee.

If we did it, you can. We're working towards DH working exclusively from home, and it's not been that difficult, although there have been times when there have been few wants and a lot of needs. If you're the type who can consistently keep your eye on the goal and say "no" to anything that doesn't help you get there, you'll do fine. If you're not, then you just need to learn to be

anniew · #19 11/28/10, 08:48 AM

Grow where you are planted...

MaineFarmMom · #20 11/28/10, 10:10 AM

I've been working from home for 17 years. The last 13 years have been on 45 acres. I've tried many things from livestock to vegetables to a licensed kitchen. No matter what I do, the garden has always been a big part of it. I now grow vegetables year round as a business. I have more time away from the vegetables thanks to winter and spend most of that time as a freelance writer. I make enough money to pay all of our bills but we'd have very little money in savings if we depended on my income only. My husband is not interested in working on the farm other than helping out here and there. He is a forester. I started out on 45 acres of mostly forested land with a small house. We've built infrastructure as we go. My most expensive piece of equipment is a small used tractor I spent $6,000 on. The second most expensive is a $3,600 high tunnel. I bought the land to homestead and have had to plan what I do for a living around what I have available. You don't have to have a lot of land to earn a living.

Maine has a program called Maine Farmland Trust. If you could find a program like this you might get a lot out of it.

Meet Your Farmer might give you ideas. I'm addicted to seeing what other farms are doing. You never know what you'll learn in a short video.

What you do, how well you do it and how well you do your homework in the beginning play a big part in successful farming. Homesteading is a way of live, farming is a business. They can be combined as long as you keep the business frame of mind when it comes to your income. I think you sound like you have a good head on your shoulders and a lot of knowledge to work with already. Good luck!