Logging your timber

GoatsRus · #1 11/03/10, 09:31 AM

If someone logs your timber, what is the normal split? 50/50 or something else.

Numerous years ago, my DH did a 50/50 with a guy. We have someone looking to cut timber on the back of our property and we heard through the grapevine he was doing 60/40.

agmantoo · #2 11/03/10, 09:40 AM

GoatsRus

Use a professional forester and have the stand of trees cruised to determine the amount and species that will be harvested. Then put the timber up for sealed bid. You will get the best price in this manner and you will get paid for what timber is there! Either get the entire payment up front or get progress payments. Do not give the buyer more than 6 months to complete the harvest or the buyer may "grow the trees" at your expense by delaying the harvest. Have in writing the manner that the harvester will leave the condition of the property. Notify your state forester that the harvest will be done so that the SF can monitor the harvest.

PS...not long back I know of a small tract that was quoted at $32,000. Done as above the tract brought a little of $60,000. Deducting the fee of the forester the owner netted an additional $22,000 plus.

luv2farm · #3 11/03/10, 09:41 AM

Depends on the type of timber (hard or soft woods, paperwood, etc) and the terrain. Taking into consideration that you have good timber and decent terrain, with the cost of fuel and operations, around here the split, at best, is 55/45. If your timber is "junky" (please don't get insulted) or you have lots of pulp and paperwood, or rough terrain, it could be as low as 30/70. It all just depends. Good luck and get a second opinion!

luv2farm · #4 11/03/10, 09:44 AM

A Master Logger has 2 years from date of contract to harvest timber, unless stated otherwise.

Quote:

Originally Posted by agmantoo

GoatsRus

Use a professional forester and have the stand of trees cruised to determine the amount and species that will be harvested. Then put the timber up for sealed bid. You will get the best price in this manner and you will get paid for what timber is there! Either get the entire payment up front or get progress payments. Do not give the buyer more than 6 months to complete the harvest or the buyer may "grow the trees" at your expense by delaying the harvest. Have in writing the manner that the harvester will leave the condition of the property. Notify your state forester that the harvest will be done so that the SF can monitor the harvest.

SFM in KY · #5 11/03/10, 10:24 AM

We had some logged recently on a 50/50 split but we had a good loading area and the loggers had another piece to log adjoining us that had some timber that was easier to load from our land. The 50/50 split may have been partly for the convenience.

GoatsRus · #6 11/05/10, 11:26 AM

Thanks for the info. We don't have a lot of good hardwoods back there, mostly scrub, so I don't think there's enough to get a forester involved. But there are some Oak, black walnut and hickory.
There are 5 of us that own property on the other side of the creek (river when it's swollen).The property is accessed by a gravel road and is in a flood plan. There's plenty of room to manuever a big truck and they can cross the creek easily when it's low. The guy harvested our neighbors trees using the 60/40 split, or so we were told.

Luv2 farm - LOL... I didn't get insulted because junkie timber is exactly what's back there for the most part. We'll never use the property because it floods several times a year. Buy hey, if we can make a few bucks on the hardwood, I say go for it.

tallpines · #7 11/05/10, 11:43 AM

My DD's neighbor had an extra lot in N.C. with very tall, healthy pine (100 feet) and hardwood trees that she wanted cleared.
Unfortunately she had already signed a contract before sharing her "deal" with the neighbors.

We could not believe it when she decided to have those trees cut------------and then boasted that she even paid them extra to REMOVE the logs!

She commented on how costly it was.
She pointed out one hardwood tree and said it was costing her $800.oo to remove that one tree--------------
She had about 40 nice big trees removed.

She was too naive to know she got ROBBED!

The logger ventured across to my DD's and ask if she'd like him to cut a couple of her big trees.
DD ask him: How much you paying for good logs?

The guy walked awy with out another word.

Sawmill Jim · #8 11/05/10, 08:10 PM

Good solid walnut was right high also white oak . Lot of white oak goes to making whiskey barrels . Not that i know anything about trees .

silverbackMP · #9 11/05/10, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tallpines

My DD's neighbor had an extra lot in N.C. with very tall, healthy pine (100 feet) and hardwood trees that she wanted cleared.
Unfortunately she had already signed a contract before sharing her "deal" with the neighbors.

We could not believe it when she decided to have those trees cut------------and then boasted that she even paid them extra to REMOVE the logs!

She commented on how costly it was.
She pointed out one hardwood tree and said it was costing her $800.oo to remove that one tree--------------
She had about 40 nice big trees removed.

She was too naive to know she got ROBBED!

The logger ventured across to my DD's and ask if she'd like him to cut a couple of her big trees.
DD ask him: How much you paying for good logs?

The guy walked awy with out another word.

If they are yard trees they are not worth anything (other to MAYBE a small portable band mill operator). Commercial mills will not take yard trees. They are embedded with too much metal and destroy blades and buried objects are dangerous to the mill operators when the junk and/or blade teeth fly from the mill.

texican · #10 11/05/10, 09:23 PM

Around here, the logger will tell you what he can pay. He has fixed costs, and the difference between that and the mill price is what you get. Sometimes it's zero, or less than zero. But, you still see logging trucks going down the highway.... large timber companies can make money on losing sales, by posting the losses. Doesn't work for individual owners very well. Last time I had my plantation thinned, the market started getting glutted, and each week the price dropped a couple of bucks. When it got to 9bucks/ton I told em 'no mas'... the logger, a neighbor, basically shut down for a few months, as he couldn't find anyone willing to pay him to haul their trees off.

just_sawing · #11 11/06/10, 08:21 AM

I am in Middle TN and deal with the loggers on the other end. 50/50 for hard wood and 60/40 for ceder(60 goes to the logger) If you have walnut, Cherry or Prime White Oak you can get 60'40 with 60 on your side.
Be very careful with who you hire I have shut some off because they want me to pay cash. The norm is to write two checks one to the owner and the other to the logger.
Our loggers in this area are not known to be gental with the land. They are good guys but are trained by what their grandpa did Dad did and now they do the same.
Contact me if you need more help.

**highlands** · #12 11/07/10, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoatsRus

If someone logs your timber, what is the normal split? 50/50 or something else.

We don't do a split that way. We have contracts based on the species, wood quality type and value. Logger pays trucking. We do this all the time as we're logging some portion of our forests every year. Since you are not familiar with it I would strongly suggest paying a forester to work for you to do the contract at the very least. You may be wise to have him do more including marking the wood, negotiating, monitoring and final audit.

Good luck.

taylorlambert · #13 11/07/10, 12:01 PM

Here only time a 50/50 split is used is when a its a small logger thats not insured to 1 million dollars or set up with the big mills. I help one such logger and he does most of it on the halves. I think it brings 10 to 15 per ton. He has a larger logger that has a smaller wood ward and he loads his own trailers from that. He has a scale will weigh it out. Its not as much as a big crew pays but it allows one to log their own pulp and saw loags if its not enough to get a big outfit in.

I have a friend thats a logger and on the side he cleans up landings whare a stray log is or like me I have a an un saw able tree thats only goods for pulp. an 3 smaller trees thats about to get dug out. He will cut them for me and than I will load them. He can get a load prett quick.

Sawmill Jim · #14 11/07/10, 03:03 PM

Buying standing timber is always a gamble for the seller the buyer will bid low enough to cover bad trees . Main thing is finding some one you trust

All those trucks, loader,skidder and 1,200 dollar saws are paid for by the seller plus the crews living . Truth being selling standing verses a split is standing the bid will be 1/3 of value delivered to the mill price