Disc harrow, 3-pt cultivator, or BCS?

[PACrofter]

I'm at the point where I need some more equipment (toys for boys). I've bounced along behind my trusty old Troy-Bilt for too many years, and the rocks in our Pennsylvania soil are just too much for it. Plus, I've broken sod in the field to start planting some winter rye and, eventually, field crops; the thought of using the TB on the scale of acres makes my shoulders hurt just thinking about it.

So I'm looking at options, and would appreciate your input. I figure I can do one of the following:

A) Get a three-point hitch cultivator like what they sell at Tractor Supply. That would run me ~ $2K and make quick work of tilling one of my fenced garden areas. It would not, however, fit into the second of my fenced garden areas because I've got some poorly-placed raised beds that prevent the tractor from accessing the site; or

B) Get a disk harrow for ~ $750 new, possibly less used. This would allow me to mellow the freshly-broken sod in the field, and probably would help to smooth the soil in the larger fenced garden area. I could continue to use the plow to do the rough work in there, and then the Troy-Bilt to finish it off if the harrow doesn't make it smooth enough. This option would not help in the second fenced garden area; or

C) Get a BCS, which would set me back ~ $4 - 5K. A friend has one and swears by it; it looks like it would fit into the smaller garden area and yet be rugged enough to handle the acre or two that I would plow up in the field at a time.

I could probably rustle up the cash for any of these options, although it would be less-than-pleasant for option C. If we set aside the issue of the absolute cost for discussion purposes, what are your thoughts on the merits of these options?

Thanks in advance!

[geo in mi]

PACrofter,

I'm not understanding what the BCS could do that the Troy-Bilt couldn't do equally as well, unless it is simply just time for a replacement. True, it looks like the BCS could handle more attachments, but, for rototilling, why change?

geo

[DaleK]

What size tractor? All of the 3pt cultivators I've seen at TSC are flimsy trash I'd never bother with. You should be able to find a good used trail or old Triple K or other cultivator for quite a bit less than that, even if you have to cut it down or take tines off to be able to pull it.

[PACrofter]

Originally Posted by geo in mi

PACrofter,

I'm not understanding what the BCS could do that the Troy-Bilt couldn't do equally as well, unless it is simply just time for a replacement. True, it looks like the BCS could handle more attachments, but, for rototilling, why change?

geo

My Troy-Bilt jumps around waaaay too much when it hits a rock. Heck, it even jumps around when it hits a hard patch of dirt. The BCS is, first of all, heavier than the Troy-Bilt and so is less prone to jump around. Also, from what I've heard and read, it will till the soil much more easily because of its design (I think the tines are counter-rotating, for example).

Have you used both types? I'd be interesting in knowing if you've tried the BCS and found it lacking - or not much better than a Troy-Bilt. Thanks!

[PACrofter]

Originally Posted by DaleK

What size tractor? All of the 3pt cultivators I've seen at TSC are flimsy trash I'd never bother with. You should be able to find a good used trail or old Triple K or other cultivator for quite a bit less than that, even if you have to cut it down or take tines off to be able to pull it.

The tractor I'd use is 34HP.

Out of curiosity, how do you know the cultivators there are pieces of trash? I don't know how to make that assessment so I'd appreciate your insight. Is it the gauge of the metal they use?

I'd never heard of the Triple K brand. I'll look into it - thanks!

[jwal10]

So you already have a tractor.... Get the toys and remove a raised bed or keep the Troy Built. Get an S tine cultivator like I show below, just as wide as rear tractor tires. You can cultivate longer rows and even break ground in the spring with it after the plow breaks the sod the first time. Now me I would get a 3 pt. mower to knock down the legume covercrop you plant then hit it with the cultivator....James

http://www.buctraco.com/CultivatorMultiToolKits.htm

http://www.wikco.com/arenavtr.html

[DaleK]

PACrofter, poor quality and thin metal, and also they use lower-grade bolts. You should be able to get a good used cultivator to fit that tractor for $500.

[clovis]

What kind of tractor do you have?

[kreig]

I have a BCS and I love it . Long ago I had a troy built and can say with confidence that the BCS is way more machine. Of course I now drool over all of the attachments that I will "need " to get some day. Off the top of my head I can't remember the name of the attachment but they have one that does basiclly the same job as the tiller but is better for rocky ground. I absolutly love my snow blower it really kicks @#$$. If you haven't already I would look at www.earthtoolsbcs.com they have lots of good information.It is by no means a cheap tool but I am convinced it is worth it. I am sure I will be passing it down when I can no longer use it.

[Murray in ME]

If you already have the tractor, I'd get the tractor mounted implements you'd need. You should be able to find everything you'd need for a good bit less than a new BCS type tiller. Especially if you look at used equipment. It would be much easier if you're going to be expanding to an acre or two.

On the other hand, machines like the BCS line do a great job. I'd especially recommend looking at the Earthtools link kreig provided. It amazed me when I saw all the implements you can get for those machines.

If you do decide on a BCS type machine, I'd recommend looking at the Grillo brand machines carried by Earthtools. Earthtools sells both BCS and Grillo brands. The Grillo brand is just as well made as the BCS machines and are less expensive. Joel from Earthtools recommended the Grillo brand to me a couple of years ago when I was looking into buying a BCS.

I ended up buying a Grillo 107D with an 11hp Honda engine and 27" tiller. The tiller will adjust down to 16" although I've never done it. I love my Grillo. It does a great job and it is super easy to switch implements. I used to have a 8hp Troy-bilt Professional Horse. That was a good tiller but my Grillo makes the Troy-bilt look like a toy. It's just a much better machine. More powerful, wider tilling width, better tilling, many more available implements. It a great tool.

[geo in mi]

Originally Posted by PACrofter

My Troy-Bilt jumps around waaaay too much when it hits a rock. Heck, it even jumps around when it hits a hard patch of dirt. The BCS is, first of all, heavier than the Troy-Bilt and so is less prone to jump around. Also, from what I've heard and read, it will till the soil much more easily because of its design (I think the tines are counter-rotating, for example).

Have you used both types? I'd be interesting in knowing if you've tried the BCS and found it lacking - or not much better than a Troy-Bilt. Thanks!

My 8 HP Troy-Bilt Horse is the old cast iron one with Kohler motor(when Troy-Bilt was original and not made by MTD). I've worn out the second tiiller gearbox on it and I'm considering getting it fixed for next year. I've never tried the BCS unit, but I think rocks are still rocks, regardless. That was the reason for my question.... they're kind of immovable objects when they are buried in the soil........ So, I would consider a tractor with some kind of tillage implements as you are considering. Rocks will break any type of equipment, so going from one kind of rototiller to another would just keep you in the same place.

geo

[cbaker]

I have a BCS w/10 hp Acme engine. Bought new 1/80, Have only replaced normal wear parts, tines, bearings, seals,stc. Engine has had sparkplug, carb. clean & adj.. Big garden every year, heavy use. Engine still has good compression, change oil reg. never have to add. If I was a few years younger would buy a new one today. W/elec start!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cbaker

[PACrofter]

Originally Posted by clovis

What kind of tractor do you have?

Clovis, I have a Kubota L3400, only two years young.

[PACrofter]

Krieg - thanks for the link; that's the site where I've been spending too much time lately. ;-)

CBaker - thanks for the feedback. That's along the lines of what I've heard from my friend, although she's only had it a year or so.

Question for both of you - what is the biggest piece of ground you've used the BCS on? Do you think using it every year on a market-garden-sized plot (say, one to two acres) would be too much for it? (Or too much for the user?)

Murray in ME - I'd never heard of the Grillos, either. I'll definitely look into them!

Thanks everybody for your feedback - I really appreciate it!

[kreig]

I would call earthtools and ask about the acerage question but here is my GUESS, the BCS would handle it fine but you might get tired of walking behind it over two acres! The first year might be hard to till but once the soil was worked once it would be pretty easy the following years. Once the soil is worked once you are literaly just walking behind,you could hold it with a couple of fingers unless you found a new rock! The it would jusy jump out of your hand and stop. I do 1/2 to 3/4 an acre a year pretty easily. I have used my chipper for hours on end and the machine never hesitates. Being a bit "experienced" in birthdays I got the electric start and it is sweet.

[Ross]

Why not a mounted tiller for the tractor?

[wwubben]

I would get a moldboard plow.That would roll rocks to the top where you could pick them.Then disk and use your troybilt.I don't know how thick your rocks are,but this will work around here.I only use my troybilt now.

[Murray in ME]

Originally Posted by Ross

Why not a mounted tiller for the tractor?

After reading the op again I think this is a very good option. PACrofter, it sounds as though you already have a plow for your tractor. That should move most of the larger rocks up where you can pick them off. Then, a tractor mounted tiller would be ideal. Especially if you're looking at working a couple of acres. You could keep the Troy-bilt you have now to use in the areas you mentioned that the tractor would have a hard time getting to. It would also work great for weeding, hilling potatoes, and working up small areas in the field to replant after a crop is finished.

Something like one of the larger BCS or Grillo machines will certainly work on a couple of acres. Even more. It is a lot of walking though. If you have one of the larger tillers, say a 27" like mine and you overlap a bit when tilling, you end up walking almost 5 miles to till 1 acre.

I guess the best solution depends a lot on you. How much time and energy do you want to spend working an acre or two. Tractor mounted implements will do the job much faster with much less work. A BCS or Grillo, with all the implements available is arguably more versatile for small acerage. Some of the implements for the BCS/Grillo are much less expensive than tractor mounted implements that do the same job. For example, for the BCS, you can get a plastic mulch layer that lays 3' plastic for around $500 and a root digger plow that will dig potatoes, garlic, ect. for around $250.

Another possible option if you are really interested in a BCS type machine would be to also look for a cheap used disc for your tractor. That way you could do most of the work with the tractor and do final seed bed prep with the BCS. This might be the ideal option if you could afford it.

[PACrofter]

Originally Posted by Ross

Why not a mounted tiller for the tractor?

How is that different from option A in my original post? That's what I intended to ask about...didn't realize there was a difference.

[PACrofter]

Originally Posted by Murray in ME

Another possible option if you are really interested in a BCS type machine would be to also look for a cheap used disc for your tractor. That way you could do most of the work with the tractor and do final seed bed prep with the BCS. This might be the ideal option if you could afford it.

This is actually the solution I'm leaning toward right now. The tractor-mounted tiller would definitely be more convenient for the larger parts of what I want to use, but it would be difficult to get into the smaller, tighter spots in the family garden areas. The Troy-Bilt simply doesn't cut it any more, and I suspect that as I continue to age it will become even less acceptable. (Of course, if I *don't* continue to age it will all be irrelevant anyway!)

We just harvested our potatoes this weekend, and the crop was miserable. The soil was too compacted for the tubers to get any size on them. Maybe I'm just having a knee-jerk reaction, but I think if I had a more convenient way to work the soil then I'd get better root crops (and probably better everything). Since I do already have the tractor, the moldboard plow, and a subsoiler, going with a used disc cultivator would complete the set for everything on a field scale. Then the BCS or Grillo for the smaller-scale stuff.

Thanks for the input, everybody!