Wannabe

[tamjap]

I am a wannabe homesteader. I am currently looking for land that will eventually become my own self-sustainable haven. If I can find a good sized plot (10 acres or more) that is close enough to town to commute, I can afford to purchase some land with a house or trailer already on it, and move right in. If I have to go much more than 30 miles outside of town, I will have to buy some property that has not house, and begin making upgrades to the land until I can afford to build my house there. In this scenario, I would keep my current rental and work the land on the weekends. In that event, I will probably begin with a small cabin from lumber on the land, and go from there. I live in southwest Missouri, have two small children (4 and 9), and no wife.

I have a few specific questions, and would like to solicit any additional advice.

1. If the property I buy is mostly wooded, can I simply remove the trees from the area I want to farm, till the ground, fertilize, and use the land for crops?
2. If I needed to buy something farther out, only visiting on the weekends, would I be able to maintain a sow on the property to clear underbrush and manure the land (assuming wooded) with only being there on the weekend?
3. How much capital should I have to start?
4. Assuming starting from scratch (no house, no well, etc) what tools would you consider to be essential?
5. Am I being too ambitious by thinking that I can do this without a wife to take care of things?

This is not something I need to start tomorrow, but I would like to secure the land as soon as possible. Probably within a month or so.

Thank you for your advice.

[sunshinytraci]

Well, my advice that I give people who ask me about starting a homestead is basically not to expect everything to go as planned. Prepare as much as possible for set-backs and don't get too worked up over them if you can help it. Keep at it and keep at it.

So for your questions:

1. It's not simple to remove trees, especially large ones with heavy roots. I personally think its best to buy a property with the amount of open land you want already open. But, it can be done with lots of work and equipment.

2. I personally wouldn't keep animals if they have to be alone without care for five days at a time. Too many things can go wrong.

3. As for capital, I can't answer that except to say as much as possible. I always like to keep 6 months of bills in reserve somewhere just in case but I rarely have that ideal.

4. Tools? Chainsaw (a couple of different sizes is best) , miter saw, tractor?? (I find one necessary. saves alot of load on my back.) implements to go with the tractor - plow, disc, tiller, harrow, post-hole digger, snow blower; the standard house tools - hammers, sledge hammers, wrenches screwdrivers; you know, I don't think you can have enough tools on a homestead.........

5. Naw, if you can work hard and not expect everything done to perfection right this minute and take your time, you will be fine.

My problems have been with becoming overwhelmed and wanting to give up. that comes from expecting perfection immediately. Try not to.


Hope this helps.

[jmtinmi]

Originally Posted by sunshinytraci

1. It's not simple to remove trees, especially large ones with heavy roots. I personally think its best to buy a property with the amount of open land you want already open. But, it can be done with lots of work and equipment.

I would add that if the trees are black walnut trees the 'tanin' in them would prevent you from having a good garden for ??? long.

[PNP Katahdins]

Just remember, trees can become "free" firewood in the future. Plan to use them wisely if you are lucky enough to have them on your new property.

What skills do you have that would be valuable to a homesteader or for bartering? What kind of crops are you thinking about, some to sell or some to feed your family, or both?

Good luck in your venture. Save the animal raising for when you can be there every day. You can barter for them from neighbors. Don't have to raise your own for awhile.

On the subject of neighbors, find a place you can fit in and contribute. It's hard when you're on bad terms even if it's not your doing.

Ask around with relatives, friends and co-workers for property available in your comfort zone. A decent job is nice especially if you need family health insurance. Once your kids get older, they will want to do school things that take more of your time.

The ideal property is out there for you, at your price. I truly believe that. Might take awhile to find it though. Keep funds in reserve! Take your time and do it right the first time.

Peg

[Wolf mom]

Welcome to HT! It's a wealth of information.

I commend you for your forward thinking.

The closer in to town, the higher land prices, with more restrictions. Remember, always check what zoning reatrictions are before you buy. Conversely, the further out, less restrictions & lower prices.

I bought land 3 hours away from my job in the "big city" and came up on weekends. I found it was a wee tad too far to travel and try to do anything productive there. I also had to board my horses as the person I paid to care for them on my land gave just minimal care. Sure talked a good talk tho.

Yuppers - alone with 2 children will take up a lot of your time. My neighbor has one middle school boy. A lot of time is taken to transport to school, play dates, sports...

Go slow, plan then check your plan. Get to know your land. Wind, rain runoff - little things like that turn out to be very important to know before you commit to building something that can't be moved later on.

Cash? Time? Always need more than you think.

Above all, have fun!

[Callieslamb]

1. I ditto buying land with some already cleared. In SW MO you will need a bulldozer. Then most of the roots will still be in the way - though you can probably plant pasture grasses.

2. Further out would also put you further from your children if they are home and you have to work. I would not leave animals alone for that long.

3. Twice as much as you think you need

4. Tools: ??? I have no idea, I have never started from scratch. Chain Saw, trailer or wagon and a vehicle to pull it. I find it is cheaper to hire tractor work done that to maintain my own - but my land is cleared and I am not raising crops. Post hole digger. I have about worn my 2nd pair out! Tools will depend on what you are planning on doing on your land. but basic carpentry tools are essential no matter what.

5. There are plenty of women doing without men, so why not a man without too? Just remember these young years with those kids will set the stage for their future. Give them what they need now and it will be so much easier later. It gets easy to make the farm's needs more important than the kids' needs.

[rscheiderer]

OK, I'm going to play Devil's Advocate. Where is the mother of your children? Does she play any significant role in their lives? Do you have a girlfriend? If so, is she like-minded?
The reason I ask is that you are really going to need some help. On a homestead there are just too many "two-man" jobs. You'll be moving to a new place, without knowing a lot of people...it's going to be really hard. It also helps to have one person stay home and one to work away from the farm. A lot of "regular" farmers go this route, to keep health insurance and a steady paycheck. Working the homestead is a full time job in itself, especially if you have livestock. You can't plan a day off work to be home when the calf is born or the garden is finally dry enough to work because you never know in advance when those days are going to be. And, speaking from experience, it's hard to get up and milk the cow, feed and water the chickens, etc. before going in to work your job. There are things you never think of...if my husband didn't take on "poop control" with the tractor, I'd be in a world of hurt. And of course, accidents happen. What would you do if you cut yourself up with the chainsaw and you were out there alone? Or got bit by a snake? All too often you don't get cell service out in the boonies.
I know it sounds like I'm trying to crush your dream. I'm not. In fact, I applaud you...you're giving your children a wonderful, honest and healthful life. Just be very careful and try to think of everything you can... which your original post indicates is exactly what you are doing.
By all means, if you can afford it, start paying on your land. You can't go wrong there, and this is an excellent time to buy. But take baby steps and expect things to take a long time to get established. And, at the risk of sounding unromantic, you need to make a conscientious effort to find a wife or girlfriend who is on the same page and wants the same things that you do. It will be better for you, better for the children and better for the homestead.
Good luck to you; I'm sure you'll be fine.
Rebecca

[uncle Will in In.]

One way to get your feet wet in the homesteading game right away would be to rent an older farm house out in the country. Look for a place with a big garden space and an outbuilding or two where you could house a few starter type animials like chickens and a couple hogs. While you are looking for your own place, you can accumilate most of the tools you'd need, and get a wealth of hands on experience. That would also eliminate lots of the unwelcome surprises that are bound to come when you buy your homesread. GOOD LUCK - Unk

[Jenni979]

We live in the Ozarks and in February we had to clear part of our land to bring our home in... It was a huge pain... We only took out what we needed for the house, and we paid someone to do it...

Now we are looking to clear another section to make room for an actual yard & garden. We found someone who is willing to take down all the trees if he can keep the wood for firewood... Now the BIG pain will be removing all the stumps.

It's a bit of a mess, but it will be well worth it, in the long run.

I second what the others have said; Assume that it will take at least twice as long and cost twice as much as you originally planned.

Good Luck!!!

[Windy in Kansas]

Welcome to the forums.

In SW Missouri I think you will also have to contend with a lot of rocks in the soil from what little I know of the area.

[tamjap]

Thank you for all of the advice. Much of it is stuff I already kind of knew deep down, but didn't want to admit. Especially how long it is really going to take. I don't mind taking it slow. I am budgeting this as though I keep my current job, and actually lower costs. It will pretty much wipe out savings by the time I buy equipment, but even that I am going to take pretty slowly at first - make sure it's something I really need.

I would absolutely prefer to find something with at least 5 acres of cleared land, and some wooded as well for the free firewood, but that seems to be difficult to find in my price range, which is why I was asking about converting.

Peg: I am rather unskilled in anything that would matter to a homesteader. There's going to be a very large learning curve. I have started canning, but its not much fun when you have to buy all of the food at the store first. I can knit a little bit, but it's been a few years since I've done it, and like I saw in someone's signature: Its just click, click, click, click..... 70,000 hours later you have half a sock.

Rebecca: Unfortunately, my wife passed away about 6 months ago. Despite the best efforts of the women in my church, I'm not quite ready for a new one yet. Maybe in time. But that is why I was asking how feasible it was to do alone. For now, I don't mind investing a little extra time on things to find a way to do it without a partner. I'm sure it would certainly help to have one, though.

Unk: I like your idea of getting a farm on the outskirts rather than jumping right into a true homestead. I will keep my eyes open for such an opportunity.

I guess, ultimately, I would like the experience to be easy, cheap, and fast. But then I would end up with a happy meal instead of a good pot roast and a big pot of beans. It goes against the nature of homesteading to expect starting out to be any of those.

Thank you again for your advice.

[shanzone2001]

I am so sorry to hear about your wife. I can't imagine how difficult things have been for you and your 2 young children. In my opinion, no wife is better than a wife who does not have the same homesteading dream as you. Many women are just not cut out for the work that goes along with homesteading.
Have you checked out the Country Singletree forum here on HT? There are many wonderful single people who homestead alone and can be a great support system.
Good luck! Speaking from my own experience, your children will love raising farm animals. Maybe even get into 4H???

Advice- start slowly with the animals. Maybe start with one type (you mentioned a pig) and once you have that figured out and going smoothly move on to something else like chickens. They are fairly easy and will provide your family with eggs and meat. Also, start slowly with the gardening as well. Choose a few items you know your family will eat and go with those. Start small and slowly take on new varieties of vegetables.

[jlrbhjmnc]

Originally Posted by tamjap

Unfortunately, my wife passed away about 6 months ago. Despite the best efforts of the women in my church, I'm not quite ready for a new one yet.

My goodness! So very sorry for your loss. Take your time. The children need YOU, not you and a new relationship. IMHO. Learned that from an older lady I trust.

Jennifer
Don't wait for something big to occur. Start where you are, with what you have, and that will always lead you into something greater.

[Callieslamb]

So sorry for your loss. I am glad your kids have you. You can do a LOT alone. Gardening is essential in a HS situation. Concentrate on learning/improving those skills. You can learn to garden anywhere. Get connected with folks where you are going to land. It's very often WHO you know that gets the job done. Are you going to have a job along side the Homestead? Consider how long you will be away from your kids. It is doable. Just go carefully. I was raised in SW mo. There are some great deals on land. Keep looking. You'll find just the right place. With your situation, I would go for a place that has as much on it already as you can afford. Time is going to be your biggest challenge. I have a feeling you will learn what you need to learn just fine.

[sgl42]

sorry for your loss.

if you're just starting, i would not rush buying the land. many people have spent a year or more looking at land to find a property that suits them. during that process, i suspect they're honing their dreams too. but buying to soon, you're likely to end up missing something -- lack of good water, bad neighbors, poor soil -- in the rush and enthusiasm you told yourself something wasn't important, or you got too excited and didn't do your due diligence. that can be a painful and costly mistake.

take your time. refine your dream. (read these forums, and there are numerous problems that aren't obvious from the outside, but serious issues that you need to address, preferrably ahead of time.) build your skills. build up your tools from garage sales. read books. offer to help people to learn. (eg, voluteer with habitat for humanity a few times if you know nothing of construction and want to learn a thing or two. or assist a friend or neighbor. lots of ways to increase your knowledge in a low-risk, low cost manner.)

get your kids involved. visit farms or petting zoos or historical reenactment farms. visit friends who live on a farm. find ways to get them interested such that when you do buy land/house, it's not a shock, it's something they want too.

best wishes...
--sgl

[chewie]

so sorry at your loss. and i think its great you plan to not rush into another relationship til you feel ready--that wouldnt' help anything. and welcome!

i think the renting a farm house with garden area would be a great idea. that way, you can get a real feel for what you'd like to do, not everyone is meant for a whole host of critters, and an acre of veggies. a couple raised beds (check out square foot gardening) and maybe 6 hens would be plenty for a while, you have a ton on your plate already. and maybe that would be enough too. neither of those things would take much space, and most landlords wouldn't have issues with that stuff. a farmhouse outside of town would be a great place for kids, and to collect yourself as well. it would give you time to find your own place too, and you'd make a better choice with some experience behind you.

i am a SAHM, but do tons of work to take care of our place--i do all the animal tending which includes dairy goats, hogs, chickens, dogs, horses. i am starting raised beds for gardening, planted fruit trees this year plus some other types as well. my kids are teens, so i get some help sometimes, and sometimes NOT! i do many of the other things like fencing and hauling to sales, etc., i make cheese and soap from my goat's milk, which i sell. i paint murals and more 'gallery' paintings, plus work at hunting lodges, put up hay, work cattle, anything to bring in a few bucks. all this takes my FULL time. there would be no way i could do maybe even half this with a full time job, not to mention having young kids. when my kids were young, even staying home with them, i did little else than care for them and feed the dog, and housework.

i mention all that to stress to you to go slow, and just cuz something seems 'homesteady' to you doesn't mean you have to do it. i bake all our bread, but if i worked or had a good place to buy it instead, well, i would! add things slowly, one at a time, til you find your way. best of luck to you, and YES, you CAN do this!!!

[tamjap]

Thank you for the encouragement and the condolences. I really didn't mean to come on and whine - sometimes I think that's all I do anymore.

I am absolutely planning on keeping my job (they have been so wonderful to me through everything - I couldn't bear to leave them right now). But in these uncertain times, there is always the possibility of lay offs, or just an economic collapse. I fear the direction the country is moving, and suspect that in either of those scary situations, those who are able to be self sufficient will have the best chances.

But, I guess even then, it doesn't do any good to rush in and make a bunch of very costly mistakes. I will slow down. Thank you for all of the advice.

[chickenista]

There are so many old farms out there that are just rotting away.
We got one and love it.
The house was from the early 20's and the farm and buildings were here waiting on us...
it was so much cheaper than trying to build from scratch.. yes, we have a ton of work to do, but we are knocking it out slowly.
Slowly. That is the word.

The first year is for a reasonable sized garden.. 10 tomatoes etc and 3 each of zukes and cukes and yellow squash and a few pole beans... that may seem small, but you will be amazed at how much work just a little garden can be until you get into the groove. Plus you need to get into the habit or working it and learn your growing season etc..
And a dozen chickens... that's it.

Homesteading can be the most depressing and frustrating thing out there... all your effort and dreams can disappear in an instant..
Homesteading can be the most rewarding and satisfying thing out there.. all your effort can fill you with such hope and pride and joy..
all within the course of a week..
there are days that I want to run screaming and days I wouldn't change a thing..

take it slow and easy...

[Linkovich]

Note on clearing trees: sometimes logging companies are willing to clear the land for you, in exchange for them keeping the wood that is cut, provided the trees on your property are actually useful to them. This might be an easier way for you. You'll lose your firewood, but you'll save time, effort and money. Now i'll go back and read the rest...

[PNP Katahdins]

Tanjap, what I meant when asking if you had any skills to barter would include non-farming type stuff too. Your eventual new neighbors may appreciate skills you have in your present situation, or from before. Make a list of your talents as you use them. You may be surprised.

It sounds like your present job is one to keep! Your homestead can fit in too.

Peg