New Comer Looking for Feedback

[gaparrott]

Hello all,

After several months of lurking I'm ready to jump in and get some feedback.

Background: I am 63 years old, looking to retire in two to three years. I was a townie for the first 14 years of my life, then small ranch/farm (commercial rabbits,homestead goats, chickens,hogs and beef) 31 years, and Orange county city lot the last 18 years. Want to go back to the rural life, nay, need to go back for my sanity. Can't go for a while due to family matters, thus the two to three years.

The plan: To start small on what might be called a hobby farm and rebuild skills and familiarity. But I also want to be able to start something for my kids and grandkids to learn from, eventually take over, and be able to expand if they have a mind. With that in mind I want to start with enough acres to grow a reasonably sized farm business diversified between pastured poultry (chickens and turkeys, eggs and meat, and perhaps hatching), beef cattle (high density planned grazing), pastured hogs, and perhaps some dairy cows, sheep, or goats. I'm thinking this is northwards of 60 or 70 acres minimum. Alsoin an area where leased grazing land might be available. You can probably see the trend here of grass based. Have read Salatin, Judy, and Huesby as well as many of this forums invaluable threads. Also just about every internet site dealing with this type of endeavor.

The question: Where to do this. California is out of the question for many reasons. Looking at a number of factors, rightly or wrongly, I have boiled it down to two states, Missouri and Texas. In Missouri I am leaning toward the central area around Columbia, probably inspired by Greg Judy, or the southwestern part of the state. In Texas my thinking is towards the area south of Dallas and I20, east of I35, north of I 10, away from the coast and not too far east but to far east to use I 45 as a boundary.

So if you've stuck with me this long and are willing to contribute I appreciate it a lot.

Thanks in advance for any advice and information.

George

[Wisconsin Ann]

I'd opt for Missouri of the two, simply because of the land/rain/water thing. Although Texas doesn't have state income taxes, if that's good for you.

Personally, I'd tell you to do a bit further north, into Wisconsin, Iowa, or Minnesota, because of the cost of grain and hay...but of course, we have WINTER, and that can be a deal breaker for many.

Anyway. Sounds like a good plan. You could possibly buy the land early, and lease it out until you're ready to move...(now is EXCELLENT time to buy in most places). And if you start with a large amount of land, and barter with the neighbor farmer to hay or crop it...you get the benefit without having to buy the big machinery right away. (need to know that your neighbors are good folks, tho)

If you're looking to sell at like a farmer's market, or to townies, make sure you are close enough to a town to make it worth the drive. Also, sounds like you might be up for a "shares" produce place. Townies buy shares, you provide XXamount of produce (and eggs) each week.

Good luck with it all

ETA: almost forgot - since you're starting to look at this...check out rabbits. Quite a few places are now offering rabbit in restaurants, grocery stores. It's super heart healthy, and soaks up flavor like a sponge. They're as easy to raise as chickens, and kids love to work with them. I'm fairly new at raising them, and already have rabbit in the freezer, and more in the colony, and more on the way. They're also QUIET unlike those chickens who like to crow at 3am

[Joshie]

I'd advise you not to start out with that many animals. You may have experience with a lot of animals but it's been a long time. My hubby is about ten years older than you and he says that things are much more difficult now than they used to be... It's just more physically taxing.

Are your kids interested in farming at all?

I certainly wouldn't want to buy in Texas. Personally, I don't like the weather. Missouri land is likely to be less expensive but you're also less likely to make good money there.

[gaparrott]

Thanks for the quick response, Ann.

I'm with you on the thinking about the land, rain, water, although east Texas isn't as bad as central and west. And Wisconsin is a beautiful state. Went a couple of summers and one winter. The summers are wonderful, the winter was bearable for a week, but wouldn't want to live there.

I raised rabbits as a high schooler and have thought about it, although they are a bit harder to control on pasture, and wanted to stay away from pens as much as possible. Thought I would wait and see what the market will be like where ever we end up.

[gaparrott]

Hi Joshie. No I wasn't planning on all of it right away, or even in one or two years. I want to get a base down and get the kids sucked in. We are having discussions now and have some interest from two of them.

I know about the do less than before syndrome but do have to remind myself often if my head gets ahead of my body. I do find that I tend to find smarter ways to do things these days where I would have just manned up to it before.

Thanks

[blooba]

Originally Posted by gaparrott

Thanks for the quick response, Ann.

I'm with you on the thinking about the land, rain, water, although east Texas isn't as bad as central and west. And Wisconsin is a beautiful state. Went a couple of summers and one winter. The summers are wonderful, the winter was bearable for a week, but wouldn't want to live there.

I raised rabbits as a high schooler and have thought about it, although they are a bit harder to control on pasture, and wanted to stay away from pens as much as possible. Thought I would wait and see what the market will be like where ever we end up.

between the 2 I'd do Missouri, why is AL,MS, and TN out of the pic? They have similar weather. KY has lax regs but is a little chillier than TX but not as bad as most of MO.

[Wisconsin Ann]

about rabbits...if you did a large colony..yes, fenced in....but it's mainlyto keep predators OUT. The colony is a great wayto raise the critters.

Another thought for you to look into..honey bees. Will help your orchards or vegetables, and they are something you can keep on your land, OR transport around to other fields to pollinate.

Honey always sells well, and all the bees really require is a hive, water, and shade during the summer/windbreak during the winter.

[tamsam]

Well WV is way out of the question. We don't have anything here to offer anyone. JUST KIDDING. If you don't mind the cold then look into WV for good land prices and the cost of living. I am disabled and can not think of anywhere else I would rather live.If you want to raise a lot garden stuff you need flat land which is rare here. If you want to take it easy and enjoy life and not have tons of animals here is the place to be. As disabled as I am we still heat with wood and coal and haven't been cold in the 8 years we have had our house. This winter was the hardest one most people could remember and it was so relaxing to be snowed here for 12 days and listen to the scanner and watch the snow fall. I guess I just like it here to much. Good luck in finding your place. Sam

[ronbre]

planning to do this for your retirement shows a true love of it..so i will encourage you..hubby is 61 and i'm turning 59 in a couple of months..and we both know how hard it is to move much at our age..(he has serious medical/head injury problems) (i was born crippled and have had a hip replacement from that with neuropathy and arthritis).

i'm still going gung ho..but am doing it with an eye to the future..raising up the garden beds some more every year..etc..more perennials..you know..more permanent less annual

[quietstar]

Good hunting George. I took on a similar search several years ago in several states, always with my personal requirements formost in mind. It's all part of logical research and due dilligence that a wise buyer completes. I'm a professional Real Estate appraiser, and nor sure if that helped or hindered my efforts. While I considered parts of four states, I found something great 124 miles away from where I lived in Texas and hope you do as well. Good luck...Glen

[blooba]

Oh yea, I believe it's Alabama that has a sliding scale property tax for senior citizens. No income = No property taxes.

[65284]

I'm in the Columbia area and my advice would be to stay out of Boone County. Look in Randolph, Monroe, and Callaway Counties. Within easy drive distance of Columbia and cheaper taxes.

[bluetick]

Hi neighbor! Your "kid" issue may come into play more than you realize now.

I was born and raised in New York State, and lived there until almost a year ago. My last place there was almost all I wanted all my life. For 17 years, I lived in a big old farmhouse on 5 and a half acres with a small barn, shed and lots of trees. I kept chickens, ducks, and geese, and had a small vegetable garden. I loved it! The area was rural and the nearby village (5 miles away) had a feed/hardware store, small grocery, post office, bank and a wonderful veterinarian. Retired and in my early 60's, it began to get harder to keep up. The bales of straw, bags of feed and loads of firewood kept getting heavier!

My adult children had established themselves in southern CA with jobs and homes. After years of listening to them coaxing me to make the move, everything fell into place last year. My home in NY sold quickly, and I found a place here on 2 acres of flat, usable land that was affordable. Being near my children became more important to me than being the fiercely independent old cuss I had become.

If your kids are really on board with your plans, it should work to everyone's benefit. However, if they decide to dig in and remain in CA, you might regret the move. I am not trying to discourage you! If your kids are reading such publications as Backwoods Home and Countryside and are expressing a strong interest go for it and good luck! Just consider that as you age, you may very well want and need for them to be nearby. (Oh, my gosling order will arrive next month, and chicks will go into the brooder when the geese leave it!)

[Big Dave]

There was a family that had top leave their homestead in central Texas just a month or so back. I can not recall the name but if you scroll back or ask maybe you could find your dream place.

[ya-ni-sa_song]

I would like to say...congratulations on your desire to move out of OC. I have lived here for 18 months and have the official countdown for our evacuation on June 30th! Wow, it has been an experience and a half.

I can completely identify with your desire to leave CA. I was looking at moving out of state as well, but my children were only into the move with half a heart. Now we are looking at moving into the Sonoma area or Apple Valley. As far as your question of Missouri or Texas, I would go with Wyoming . How much time have you spent in each area?

[Navotifarm]

Joel Salatin is in Virginia with his extensive pasture raising and profits. We have (Usually) plenty of rain here which is very important. Also it is beautiful in Virginia. It is GREEN!
I lived in California for several years but had to come back east because I missed the green so much.
I lived in Texas for several months and was miserable. It was FLAT and dry. Even the Texas "Hill Country" is flat! Compared to the Californians I found the Texans to be very flat as well.
I only have one son. He categorically wants to live in California. Your children may be different, of course, but they most likely will have dreams and plans of their own which will be alien to your dreams. Before you get set anywhere, at least be sure you are in the same general locale where they want to be or you will put stress on them and cause pain to yourself. Many successful farmers are looking to transition their land now because their children do not want to carry on. Joel Salatin describes this as looking for a "surrogate heir."
I wish you the best of luck in your dream and hope you can work it out as a win/win for you and your whole family!

[FarmboyBill]

I didnt read alla the replys, so if im repeating whats been said, well, take it for what its worth. Im with Joshie, #1 Youll be at age 65/66, and your mind has never been involved with doing regular farming. By now, your mind rules your body, u just dont know it. Ive farmed small all of my life, save a couple years. My mind knows what has to be done on a farm and has no recourse but to cause my body to be able to do it cause thats all my mind and b ody know how to do. I know, if I dont farm, Im in a nurseing home, or stuck with my daughter, and I dont want that. I have conditioned myself for the last 40 yrs so as to be able to continue farming till I drop. By the way, im 62. I can put up hay, cause ive done it all my life. I can spend all day, every day for a week plowing, cause ive always done it, even tho the first 3 days almost kills me, until I get gradually back into condition. I can spend hours behind a buzz saw, or limbing, splitting wood, as ive done it for 40 yrs. My mind and body is more or less conditioned to do these things. Yours is not. Your mind is going to tell you, Your way to old to be starteing to do this or that. You may have medical conditions I dont have. I cannot walk very far, or stand on my feet at all hardly. I have found ways around that, like writeing terribly long posts on here just to get some relief,

My kids would be around the age of your kids. If they havnt got ther lives wrapped around farming, takeing care of a farm, being tied to a farm, How to manage a farm. If they already have outside interests, then theyre not going to bend there bodys or minds around farming. None of my kids at the moment farm, and I bought my daughter 2 tractors, and my boy one. My daughter has an area 80 X 180 to garden. I built her a 15 X 40 barn. Gave her a 1 16 plow, a 10ft disc, a section harrow, a 2 row corn planter for marking rows or planting sweet corn, a walking 5 schovel for cultivation, 2 tillers, for her and her husband. I told her, plow your garden, disc it harrow it, then use the tillers to mark out the rows. I even plowed it the first time. U know what she did. She used the tillers only till they both broke, never used the machinery, and finally asked me to take the machinery home, but leave the tractors, as she wants to run them in parades. My boy lives in town, so his AC WD sits here. One rim rotted out at the valve hole due to a leak of calcium. His FIL says he can fix it, but he takes forever to get it done.

I wouldnt trust my kids to be around when things need to be done here, cause they arent. They may come once or twice a year, generally stay only an hour, and dont do nothing. If you put down alot of money in farming with the intentions of them falling in line to provide the management and muscle for it. Id say , your just ruining yourself.

Farming has never been in their lives, and there going to chuck it whenever it conflicts with anything that has been in their lives.

That said, I think youd be pleased with NE Okla. I sure was, and if youll check it out, theres a bunch of us in here from here.

[gaparrott]

It has taken me a while to get back to this. I want to thank everyone for their replies and collected wisdom. I'm sure over the next two years as I move forward modifying and executing that I will have the opportunity and need for more advice on more topics.

Thanks again