Guy in R.I. criminally charged for operating on his dog

[Oggie]

I find this a bit odd. The reaction from the SPCA official is a bit over-the-top.

If this is a crime, I know a few criminals who have neutered their own dogs of given them some other kind of veterinary care.

Here in Oklahoma, a few folks who weren't vets have been charged for "floating" horses teeth.

I'm not condoning hacking on your pets nilly-willy. But to be charged with a crime when helping a pet was the intend seems a bit extreme.

BARRINGTON, R.I. -- A Rhode Island man who says he couldn't afford veterinary care for his dog has been charged with illegally operating on the pet.

Alan MacQuattie recently removed a cyst from the leg of his 14-year-old Labrador mix. The dog was operated on again by professionals to deal with an infection from the first surgery.

E.J. Finocchio, president of the Rhode Island Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, calls the surgery a "heinous crime."

Court records show MacQuattie pleaded no contest last week to misdemeanor charges of animal cruelty and unauthorized practice of veterinary medicine. He was allowed to keep the dog.

From:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...020501625.html

[david_r]

That seems a bit silly. If you're dog ever gets caught in a trap, don't try to take it out unless you have a trapping license.

I find it a bit misleading for the reporter to state that the infection was from the first surgery. "...following the first surgery." would be more appropriate.

My dog had a wart on his tongue and I pulled it off. Come get me!

[lmrose]

Where I live there are two vetinarian hospitals 10 miles away that treat only dogs and cats. The nearest vet for farm animals is 40 miles away. My husband grew up on a farm doing his own vetinarian work as did his father. He also does all of our vetinarian work except spaying cats and dogs.

Through the years he has casterated bulls and buck goats. He has delivered breach calves and goat kids which required putting his hand inside them to turn the baby around. He has removed quills from horses, cows and goats, treated animals for diareaha, mites, worms, mange, colic and pnemonia. He has removed tumors and warts. He has also "floated" a horse's teeth. He has also had to put down sick animals who couldn't be saved. He has put in feeding tubes and tubes to give medicine. He gives shots of pennicillian and vitamins. He also has given homemade tonic to animals who were old and weak or new born and weak. He has treated barb cuts and more serious ones. He amputated a mangled foot on our cat after it got caught in a mowing machine. The cat lived and soon will be 18 years old. Once he had to reach inside a goat and cut up a dead kid to get it out as it was too large. He disinfects his hands and arms and what ever he has to use and never had an infection in an animals caused by anything he did.

When he doesn't know how to do something he calls the vet and asks.We also have a few vetinarian books with information. Had he not been able to do all these things we could have lost many animals waiting for a vet to get here. We could never afford a vet who charges $30 farm call plus mileage plus by the hour calculated so much every fifthteen minutes.

Things go wrong with animals just like they do with people. We don't run to the doctor all the time for ourselves either. The SPCA and some other people may mean well but sometimes over step their boundaries. If our pioneer ancestors had been kept from treating their animals medical concerns they would have lost many of them.We live in times that will just continue to get harder for most of us unless we learn how to take care of ourselves and our animals too and not depend on everyone else to do it for us. It is a reality of life.

[cdcolburn]

I think the wordage is a bit over the top (heinous crime) as though he sawed off it's leg or something but I do believe that there should be a line drawn to what you can do to an animal and anyone who does surgical procedures I think should be licensed (like a human doctor, paramedic, psychologist, etc...).

[CottageLife]

We don't know what type of job this guy did on his 14yo dogs leg - did he have a way to numb the dog or knock the dog out while he did this 'surgery'? Or did this guy just hack away at the dogs leg with a butter knife?

With the amount of info given, I don't think I can say how horrible his crime may/may not be.

Edited to say - I didn't see the link prior. I still think it was a very poor idea for him to do this. It doesn't say this guy has a farm animal background, or that he was raised around animals, or that he knows how to do surgery on a dog. A cyst can go into the leg a ways - it could bleed a lot, a 14yo dog could have other medical issues. If it was cancer, he could have made it worse. I sure as heck wouldn't give the guy another dog.

[tab]

Funny thing my large animal vet SHOWS me how to do things! Like when the mare had an issue she took the time to have me reach inside and feel the baby. She explains things and has recommended books. I guess the line between trying to help with valid care, concern and knowledge as opposed to ignorance and disdain can be blurry but I think we need to be careful with that line.

[CottageLife]

Originally Posted by tab

Funny thing my large animal vet SHOWS me how to do things! Like when the mare had an issue she took the time to have me reach inside and feel the baby. She explains things and has recommended books. I guess the line between trying to help with valid care, concern and knowledge as opposed to ignorance and disdain can be blurry but I think we need to be careful with that line.

But it is great that your vet is showing you Who knows if this guy has been shown how to do surgery on his dogs leg? We foster dogs for a rescue, so there is a lot more medical stuff I'm comfortable and trained to do now - but I sure as heck wouldn't do surgery on my dog.

[david_r]

He stated he used a local anesthetic

"I think it is a crime to walk on the sidewalk in this state." At least he's got spunk.

Here's a video clip of the news segment that shows the dogs surgery area.

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/22474184/detail.html

I'm curious how many people here who take issue to this would think twice about lancing a boil, castrating a pig or a calf, ear marking stock, branding, clipping beaks, dehorning, etc.? None of those are done with anesthetic. I doubt most of them involve antibiotics, either.

When we castrated a couple pigs, they were cut pretty deep and the only treatment the incision received was a squirt of dykem blue.

[edcopp]

Sounds like if a Vet had done the first surgery that resulted in an infection that there would have been no problem. The Vet would have done the second surgery, and there would have been 2 bills.

Now the pet owner tried to do the right thing (by the dog) and he will have to pay a fine.

It's reall all about money, it seems.

[lmrose]

When I wrote above how my husband has to be our vet when it comes to our animals I should make something clear. He learned through years of experience how to do this out of necessity. Our animals are never hurt and are always treated with care and respect.I don't recomend a person do vet care on an animal when they don't know what they are doing.That said, a person can learn some very basic veternarian care . It is good when vets take time to show people whose animals they are treating what they are doing and why. I do believe still in the years ahead it will benefit us all who homestead to learn how to take care of ourselves and our animals.

[cdcolburn]

A little more info:

E.J. Finocchio, a veterinarian and president of the Rhode Island Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, called the surgery a "heinous crime."

He said the procedure was medically unnecessary since the cyst was benign and did not appear to be hurting the dog, though MacQuattie said she was irritated by it.

"The dog was not suffering, the dog was not in pain," Finocchio said. "We know that from the nature of the cyst and the condition of the dog that we looked at."

Finocchio said the procedure would probably have cost less than $200, and that his organization could have helped foot the bill.

Seattle PI

[Wayne02]

I say let him operate. In fact the instructions should be on the internet for peoples reference. One of the keys to healthier nation (for both humanoids and animals) is greater use of home care. The internet as a means of disseminating the proper information should be leveraged so people can take more control of their own health as well as that of their animals.

[FoxyWench]

the fact of the matter is it is a CRIME to practice veterinary medicine on "domestic" animals in the USA, this means dogs, cats and other "pets", NOT livestock...

however it is against the law to not provide veterinary care to an animal that needs it...(that includes livestock)

delivivering an animal, including manouvering a breech ect is not veterinary medicine (a c-section hwoever is)
banding to neuter is NONE SURGICAL however it is actually illegal to do a neutering that way on a dog or cat and is considered cruel when not "livestock"

do i agree...not nessicarily,
but at the same time i do agree that joe schmo should not be performing surgery in his garage for example...
these rules are in place to protect against back yard earcrops, lop jobs, surgery in unsanitary conditions, surgical procedures without anesthesia ect...

again, i dont nessicarily agree, i vaccinate my own dogs, ive docked tails at home and removed dewclaws...
but i also dont belive its the average animal keepers job to remove limbs, cut their animals open, perform surgery ect...
theres a difference between emergency first aid though.

[nc_mtn]

Originally Posted by FoxyWench

the fact of the matter is it is a CRIME to practice veterinary medicine on "domestic" animals in the USA, this means dogs, cats and other "pets", NOT livestock...

however it is against the law to not provide veterinary care to an animal that needs it...(that includes livestock)

So I gotta ask - is a guard dog (for livestock) also livestock?

[Callieslamb]

I've removed a cyst from my arm......are they going to come and get me next?
I've also lanced a blister.....and stitched myself up once......Good thing Dr's don't act like vets......

[beachcomber]

good thing it wasnt a cat ... might have let the evil out of it

[ZooNana]

This is almost as stupid as men who are charged with practicing obstetrics without a license when they catch their baby when their wives give birth without notice.

When I saw the topic I thought it was going to be that he did major surgery, but removing a cyst (depending on where it is) isn't major surgery. Yes, it's still "surgery" and it was probably better for a vet to do it and yes there can obviously complications from doing it himself but it was removing a cyst, not open heart surgery.

[yarrow]

glad the home vet *police* weren't peeking in on us last week! JamieJune our 12 year old pitbull/beagle mix (hubby saved her from being bait in a dogfighting ring back in Oklahoma).. As she's aged she's developed some old lady lumps.. most looked to just be fatty tumors under the skin.. BUT.. there was one *mole* that was on her knee. It had started to really grow (very bluish/purple.. you could almost see it pulsating..yuck).. BUT.. it wasn't bothering her at all. She never even licked on it. I was waiting until time for her annual teeth cleaning (was going to have it taken off while they had her under).. then the morning of our ice/sleet storm last week, the tumor on her knee was bleeding a little bit. A little time & pressure, everything looked fine. I put a towel in the chair she likes to sleep in.. and forgot about it. Around midnight, we were getting ready for bed. I told the dogs time for last potty... Jamie jumped up and it just started to pour blood. (don't know if she ripped her nail thru it. or if it just blew out on it's own.. BUT.. it was like someone had turned on a faucet. (last arterial bleed here was a doeling who impaled a back leg.. that one was spraying so hard, it was spraying my ceiling!) but Jamie's was just pouring. It looked like the exit wound from a large caliber gunshot, jagged edges and all. I yelled for my daughter to help me. She laid on her & started pressure. I grabbed my emergency medical kit (I keep one stocked for easy grab & run just in case.. don't want to be digging/looking when I need it NOW!! LOL) A couple big chunks of the tumor had exploded out of the thing.. It was bleeding so badly I couldn't get a clear look (nor could I see to get stats in there to pinch it off) .. We did pressure for a while, I began to sew. The skin on the tumor was so thin & stretched out that I had to begin with wide apart stitches just to have something to anchor to.. We held her leg off (like a tourniquet) to allow me to work. Every time I'd think I was getting ahead, it would start to gush again. (all this time my daughter is laying on top of Jamie.. my fat butt was sitting, spraddle-legged flat on the floor.. leaning over working (I had flash light as my surgical light) .. my tv room was beginning to look like a slaughter house... the blood was spreading out from us, clotting up into pools..spreading a foot this way, two feet that way. We were soaked in it. I just couldn't get it to stop. I kept stitching. I began to get scared that I wouldn't be able to stop the bleeding... BUT.. the sleet was really coming down, no way in or out.. no vet was coming to our rescue.. so I just kept sewing. (at one point I actually thought about taking a blade and cutting it all off to give me clean margins.. but I was afraid she'd already loss so much blood that I'd make it worse)... so I kept sewing.. layers upon layers of stitches, stitches around the outside.. I had so much dried, crusted blood on my hands.. I could barely bend my fingers. FINALLY, after an hour (and over 100 stitches) I got it just about stopped. Knowing I couldn't sew on it anymore.. I started to coat it in superglue. Put some on.. blow to dry it.. add another layer.. it was ugly.. but the bleeding had stopped. Bandaged her up with vet wrap & duck tape. I gave the poor old dog some banamine, a big dose of benadryl (I wanted her to sleep) and started her on excenel (not my drug of choice, but it's what I had) ... we were snowed/iced in on friday, but I was able to make her an appointment at the vet's for monday. Took her in for REAL surgery LOL.. happy to report everything turned out well. When I went to pick her up, they told me to bring her back in two weeks, to get her stitches removed.... everyone got quite and then started laughing.. they decided I *probably* could take them out myself LOL.


susie, mo ozarks

[||Downhome||]

the big problem here is courts have become cookie cutter bakerys, they dont examine facts or try to get to the bottom of things.

as far as being a vet or doctor I think thats only a issue when doing things of this nature for other people, many people are as capable if not more capable then some/many vets,
this is crazy as all get out. the gestapo keep on a rolling.

[Callieslamb]

Originally Posted by ||Downhome||

the big problem here is courts have become cookie cutter bakerys, they dont examine facts or try to get to the bottom of things........

Agreed. Or the news media reports only part of the story to get us all upset at the PTB so we will want a little 'change'.