Of snakes, creeks and animals

[happydog]

One of my new neighbors warned me against letting my kids play in the woods near the creek. He said there are copperheads. Yesterday I walked along the creek on the land we just bought, pushing aside the fallen leaves in spots. I found a lot of small 1" to 2" diameter holes in the ground all along the creek. I'm guessing those are snake holes?

I didn't see any snakes though. Maybe it's already too cold and they're hibernating? I need to get a good snake book.

I'm really bummed because the creek is a kid magnet and I thought they'd spend a lot of happy summer hours digging and playing in the water. It's just a little trickle of a creek but I was planning on digging out the spring to improve the flow and making one area into a pond. I really don't like snakes, especially poisonous snakes. The thought that at the bottom of each of those holes is a whole den of poisonous snakes waiting for warm weather to come swarming out really gives me the creeps.

In the back of my mind I remember reading that pigs eat snakes. We'll be getting guinea hogs in the spring. Or maybe it was guinea hens that eat snakes? Lol, I've read too much. Maybe it was geese?

Is there anything I can do to get rid of (or at least cut down on) the snakes so we can enjoy our creek safely? Or should I just fence it away from the kids and animals and give it over to the wild kingdom?

[Bearfootfarm]

I'm guessing those are snake holes?

Snakes dont dig holes. They use holes dug by other animals.
What you saw were probably crayfish holes.

Snakes are pretty much everywhere in NC. About all you can do is keep weeds cut down and simply be careful where you walk and put your hands.

[KIT.S]

At our house, those 1 to 2 inch (and 3 inch for the gophers) holes in the ground are mice, voles and mole/gopher things. Our snakes are not poisonous, and mostly hide under black plastic when they can find it, and pallets. I am not familiar with copperheads, and our pigs are willing to eat anything, but are cautious enough to sniff and nose something before they try to bite it, and I would expect them to be bitten on the face before they dispatch a poisonous snake.
How sad to think the kids can't play in the creek, and I hope you find something that will make it safer.
Kit
Oregon

[KMA1]

No, the holes are not snake holes. As Bearfoot syas, the holes are likely crawfish. Snakes live in the country. Particularly in the woods and along streams. There are copperheads in western NC. Most of the snakes I have seen along streams in the mountains up that direction are banded water snakes, which a lot of people mistake for copperheads. Best defense is to teach kids to watch out for themselves and teach them how to identify snakes. In my opinion, it would be a horrible mistake to fence any hogs into any area around a stream or a spring. Terrible for water quality and the ecosystem, and will make the area totally unsuitable for your family to enjoy.

[Callieslamb]

I think most snakes avoid human contact. Teach your kids how to watch, keep the grass mowed and the brush cleared out where they would be allowed to play. I agree- that creek is just too womderful of a kid spot to not be used as such.

[dakine]

I grew up around water moccasins, copperheads and what not. We knew what they were where they lived and how to deal. My Mom taught us. Never once got bit by a snake I never picked up. As for those holes, if they are by the creek, there are crayfish. Some times they build a castle around them.

[Danaus29]

Snakes occasionally use holes other critters have dug but they have no way of digging holes on their own. Snakes prefer to hide under rocks and like KIT.S said, black plastic and pallets. Tarps and woodpiles are also snake magnets.

Your best defense is a good offence, keep the play area clear of snake magnets and keep it mowed. Get a good book on snakes of NC, your division of wildlife or local park with a nature center would probably be the best place to look, and teach the kids NEVER to handle or harass a snake. Copperheads are typically shy snakes and would rather hide from you. Some rattlers can be aggressive and really need to be watched for. Any snake with visibly cloudy eyes is getting ready to shed and can't see well. Those especially need to be avoided because they will strike. Even your typically gentle garter snakes will bite if they are getting ready to shed and you harass them.

[stranger]

snakes wouldn't use those holes, they couldn't controll their body heat in a damp hole. there were rattlesnakes near where i live but in recent years they haven't been sighted very often, i think the wild turkeys get them soon as they leave the den when they're still small.

[Danaus29]

Snakes wouldn't use holes in the ground on a long term basis but snakes will go into those kind of holes if there is food down there. Certain snakes are specialized to eat crayfish and crayfish holes can be good places to find an easy meal. If the ground is warm the snake wouldn't loose much heat in the short time frame it would be there eating.

Also a snake might use a crayfish hole to escape from a predator.

[happydog]

Yes, dakine! That's what I remember crawfish holes looking like. Do they ALWAYS have the "castle" around them? Because the ones I saw yesterday were all smooth and flush with the ground. They were also right on the edge of the water so they were very damp. And covered over with fallen leaves. I was actually looking for the spring head so I was pushing aside the leaves with my boot, poking around. Then I started noticing all these holes and remembered what my neighbor had said.

"What you saw were probably crayfish holes."

The crayfish holes I've seen have the excavated dirt piled up on top like a chimney or volcano. Like the pics dakine posted. Gosh, I hope they were just crayfish holes. Maybe the tops were washed away by rain or eroded by all the leaves covering up the holes?

"Snakes live in the country. Particularly in the woods and along streams. There are copperheads in western NC." Yes, yes, and YES. This is 17 acres we just bought in the mountains of western NC. In the country, in the woods, along the stream.

I could live with banded water snakes. Homeschool this week is going to focus on learning All About Snakes. I don't want them to be afraid of snakes, but neither do I want them to try to pick them up or "play" with them. I have a 6 and 4 year old.

When I was a teenager I used to go swimming in a "swimming hole" in eastern NC that was actually part of a swamp. Sometimes there'd be snakes in the water but I guess we made so much noise they left. Funny how that didn't bother me then. Now? no way!!! (Geeze, my mother would've had a cow if she'd known. Those could've been water moccasins.)

And yes, I've given up on the idea of letting my animals wander free and drink from the creek. There is a spring that pipes water to the barn. I need to figure out how to get it to the various pastures.

Thank you guys, very much. I feel a little less freaked. Children have survived around here for many generations. I guess mine will too.

Although, there's a old (dates in the 1800's) graveyard beside our property with a dozen graves. Mostly tiny ones. I almost wish they'd put the cause of death on them. We saw a graveyard nearby on an old homestead that held an entire family, mother, father, and all 8 children. They all died of cholera in the 1800's and were buried just a few feet up the hill from the two room cabin they lived in.

[Old Vet]

I have been bit by a water mosican, ratler,and a copperhead. It made me sick but not the way most people have thought. I even drove to a DR office to get a shot. Remember to keep benedril around and if bitten take some because it will keep the poison from spreading. Then go to a DR. If a dog was bit I would give him several benedril and keep him quiet for a while. I only got bit while blowing beaver dams. Since the kids won't be poking around under water like I did they might not get bit at all. Kids that are from the country need to know what to look out for.

[dakine]

Originally Posted by happydog

Yes, dakine! That's what I remember crawfish holes looking like. Do they ALWAYS have the "castle" around them? Because the ones I saw yesterday were all smooth and flush with the ground. They were also right on the edge of the water so they were very damp. And covered over with fallen leaves. I was actually looking for the spring head so I was pushing aside the leaves with my boot, poking around. Then I started noticing all these holes and remembered what my neighbor had said.

"What you saw were probably crayfish holes."

When they start out they may not have a "castle" and they can get washed away or removed by animals ( read racoon ) looking for something to eat. These holes can get to 2 feet deep with water traps and places to hide. pretty ingenious. Yes I have seen them with and without the "castle".

[plowjockey]

Originally Posted by happydog

Is there anything I can do to get rid of (or at least cut down on) the snakes so we can enjoy our creek safely? Or should I just fence it away from the kids and animals and give it over to the wild kingdom?

Wonder how all those countless other NC kids, managed to flourish out in the wild?

Teach them to be a little careful.

The snakes belong out there also.

[Ravenlost]

I grew up running the woods barefoot in north Alabama. Never did get bit by a poisonous snake (thank goodness and knock on wood), but my Mama taught us what a copperhead, cottonmouth and rattler looked like. If we found a poisonous snake where we were playing, we'd kill it, bury it and never tell for fear our Daddy wouldn't let us play there any more (a kid version of SSS I suppose!). Nonpoisonous snakes were left alone...after we played with them for a while!

I agree that the best thing to do is teach your kids how to identify the different types of snakes in your area, the habits of the snakes (where they like to sun themselves, etc.) and to teach them how to be aware of their surroundings without teaching them to be afraid.

My Daddy always taught us to be most cautious in the Fall because he said snakes were ornery when they were looking to hibernate for the Winter. We had to wear shoes come September. LOL...

[Toads tool]

Teach them what to watch out for and to be cautious.
Kids and snakes are gonna cross paths, especially in a rural setting.
There's protecting and there's coddling.
Let kids be kids and if something were to happen, get 'em fixed.

[cowcreekgeeks]

Learn to identify copperheads and if you see nonpoisonous snakes let 'em live...they'll kill copperheads. If you have the room for cattle, black angus are exceptional copperhead killers.

[Rita]

We have a creek and I have never seen a copperhead near or in the creek. They LOVE brushpiles and tall grass. I don't think they are aggressive as I was inches from one several times and it didn't bite.

[Jenn]

DD has to wear shoes or boots if we aren't with her. Have them swim only with you around, wade if safe with some sort of foot protection.