Just thinking...Tiny House Homesteading?

[PulpFaction]

So, in another thread I expressed some frustration over the difficulties I'm having with my "Homeless Homesteading" situation. I'm finding it impossible to do much of anything associated with "homesteading" in my tiny 16' trailer that is parked here or there or wherever, but certainly nowhere stable.

The challenges I'm experiencing make me wonder about another trend that has been gaining popularity: The Tiny House. I seem to remember a thread on this when I first found this forum, but couldn't find it again.

What I'm wondering is...if you were a single person living in a TINY space, do you think homesteading would even be possible?

I have no ability to can or dehydrate food as my kitchen facilities are next to zip. I have no storage space for the foods I would preserve even if I DID have the room for the canners and dehydraters and such. I have no regular refrigeration access. The climate I'm in currently requires a lot of time and patience to produce cultivated food, though there is an abundance of natural food available seasonally. (If you like a lot of meat and fish and berries and bitter greens!)

I'm trying to imagine what might change if I actually did have some land, but found myself limited to similar Tiny interior spaces. I think I've determined that homesteading just simply requires a certain amount of storage and cooking facilities that are not to be found in your typical "Tiny" house.

Where's the balance? Frustrating!

In other news, HomelessHomesteader sounds like a good blog name....

[||Downhome||]

you just need to change your thinking a bit, the natives well some had permanet villages many where always moving at least from summer to winter camps. you could trade some of that wild meat for some of the things you need even more so make it into something like jerky or sausage. I dont see why you could not come up with a outdoor kitchen with most of the essentials that you could break down and move when you do.

if you had a permanet place you could construct a root cellar easily and prob for next to nothing, I had the idea of a microhome myself my idea for the work area was an outbuilding that was more or less to cut down on heating expenses. just give it some thought Im sure you can work out something.

[PulpFaction]

Thanks, Downhome. Good points. I do especially like smoked salmon jerky.

I think I need to learn to do more with my small propane grill. It's currently my "outdoor kitchen", but I don't think I use it very efficiently.

Also, I did set up a blog, LOL. http://homelesshomesteader.blogspot.com/

[PhilJohnson]

I got a big house with land and I still don't have the ability to can or dehydrate as of yet. No stove and no fridge. Hopefully that will change soon. I think it would be pretty tough to can with a grill, maybe you should look at getting one of those small wood stoves and setting up out side for canning? I have seen solar dehydrator setups, not sure how well that would work for you up in Girdwood. I always thought anything near the coast of AK was rather wet and cloudy. I am going to try and build a solar dehydrator myself so I can start preserving the abundant amount of apples on my parent's land.

I think without some sort of permanent home base it would be pretty tough to homestead. I used to van a few years ago, definitely not a homesteading friendly setup since there is no room for anything and being on the move all the time isn't very good if one wanted to grow a garden.

I think an 8x16 foot house would be enough for me, I lived in smaller. I would set up a small summer kitchen for canning to free up space in the house. But then that would mean having a little bit of land. I guess what I am getting at is maybe having a small house isn't what would make homesteading hard, it is the lack of land Having a small house even here in Wisconsin would be nice since I wouldn't have to cut so much firewood.

[Merit]

It's gotta be the lack of land, in my opinion. I lived in Mexico a while, and they were "subsistence farming"...living off the land. Indoors was mostly just sleeping quarters. Have to agree with the above; it's the land access that makes the homesteading, not the housing facilities.

[Callieslamb]

I don't know how much you can do to 'do for yourself' if you don't have a home or land. When we saw that our lifestyle didn't match our dreams, we moved to a situation better suited to our dreams. That was possible for us - it might not be for everyone else.

[Old Vet]

Originally Posted by PulpFaction

So, in another thread I expressed some frustration over the difficulties I'm having with my "Homeless Homesteading" situation. I'm finding it impossible to do much of anything associated with "homesteading" in my tiny 16' trailer that is parked here or there or wherever, but certainly nowhere stable.

The challenges I'm experiencing make me wonder about another trend that has been gaining popularity: The Tiny House. I seem to remember a thread on this when I first found this forum, but couldn't find it again.

What I'm wondering is...if you were a single person living in a TINY space, do you think homesteading would even be possible?

I have no ability to can or dehydrate food as my kitchen facilities are next to zip. I have no storage space for the foods I would preserve even if I DID have the room for the canners and dehydraters and such. I have no regular refrigeration access. The climate I'm in currently requires a lot of time and patience to produce cultivated food, though there is an abundance of natural food available seasonally. (If you like a lot of meat and fish and berries and bitter greens!)

I'm trying to imagine what might change if I actually did have some land, but found myself limited to similar Tiny interior spaces. I think I've determined that homesteading just simply requires a certain amount of storage and cooking facilities that are not to be found in your typical "Tiny" house.

Where's the balance? Frustrating!

In other news, HomelessHomesteader sounds like a good blog name....

What are you sleeping on? You can put a lot of caned goods under a bed. I have seen a lot of tables that were made from caned goods with a board on top. What do you pull your trailer with? you can do a lot of storing in a pickup with a shell on it.

[PulpFaction]

What am I sleeping on? Insulation. I need to do some more investigating what's going on under there, but it seems to be some utility type stuff, perhaps some kind of tank I should be utilizing, and lots and lots of insulation, which is very needed!

[NCLee]

Without seeing it, I suspect your tank is your fresh water holding tank. If it's clear or white, it's for fresh water. If it's black it's a waste water - black water, grey water, or both. That's the general rule, but there can be exceptions, especially if someone has done some remodeling.

You can do a lot with a small propane grill. One quick example is that you can bake in it. Once you get the hang of it, they make a great oven.

You can use a Coleman 2-burner camp stove to can foods. It won't be as last as a large kitchen range, but, as long as it's shielded from the wind, it will work. For acid based foods, all you need is a stock pot that'll hold a few pints to do water bath canning. Small clean river rocks, canning rings, folded towels, crumpled aluminum foil balls, etc. will serve as a trivet to use under your jars.

A small dehydrator, such as the 4-try model here doesn't take up much space. http://www.excaliburdehydrator.com/p..._group=hunters Bet you'll be surprised at just how much food you can store in a small space by dehydrating it. For anyone living in a small place, dehydrating food is the best option. The list of fruits and vegetables that can be dried is large.

Even if you don't/can't garden, purchase those either fresh or frozen when they go on sale. They really are a nice addition to the fish and game that you have available to you.

Agree about setting up an outdoor kitchen. If possible, include a fire pit of some type. That source of heat will give you all the hot water you need for processing food. With a little practice (without the jars) you can use it to water bath can. All you need is a steady/solid place to set the canner so it doesn't tip after it's full. I wouldn't recommend trying to pressure can over an open fire as it's too hard to regulate the heat.

A folding card table with a piece of plywood cut to fit the top, doesn't take up much space. It can be stored under your trailer between uses. When you move, just fold up and set on edge, wedged in to keep it from falling.

You have 16' times x' underneath your trailer for storage of items that don't need to be protected from freezing. A tarp or sheet of plastic on the ground will help protect the bottom of things you can store there. Just make sure to route rain water around it. Under there you can put a water bath canner, for example. When you get ready to move, just put the canner on your bed for the trip. If you use hay bales to insulate the area, just work out a way to access the area when they are frozen in place.

Dried foods can also be stored under there. Even if you have to vac seal (another small appliance) in plastic bags and store in under-the-bed type storage bins. Again, when you move this is something else that can sit on your bed during transport.

When we used to go camping with a 8' slide in pickup camper, I made a camp kitchen because I didn't have storage space for much of anything in that. It was a box with 2 doors and shelves inside. It sat in the isle between the 2 side bunks during transport. When we set up camp, it went on the picnic table, tailgate, or where ever we could sit it. It had folding handles on the outside. Latch to keep the doors closed.

When I built it, I measured the various things that needed to go in it. Made compartments to fit. Dishpan, camp cookset, folding steno stove, silverware tray, bottles and jars, etc. Plastic shoe box held the little misc things needed to prepare meals. The dishpan held potholders, table cloth, dish rags, etc during transport. The heavy duty plastic table cloth also served as a tarp to protect the box from the rain, if we couldn't set up a canopy.

Mentioned this, as it may be an option for you to build something similar to store/transport some of the extra items that you need for preserving food. Naturally, you'll have to do more in terms of water proofing if you leave it outside in your outdoor kitchen.

Re-think your storage. Can you put things currently in your lower cabinets somewhere else? Use that space for your canned goods? Sometimes creative thinking can turn up extra storage. Leave the frying pan on the stove between uses. Leave your dishes on the table covered with a kitchen towel between meals, etc.

Oh, before closing... one of the things I learned was to transfer to zip lock bags many things that came in boxes. Half empty boxes of cereal take up way to much space. Everything that was practical was put into smaller storage containers. And, in your case, a water bath canner is an ideal storage container between uses. When you need to use the canner, put the stored items on your bed, if you don't have anywhere else to set them.

I'm getting really long-winded, so I'd better close. Hope you find something within this post that will help.

Lee

[uncle Will in In.]

Go to a paying job daily, and park near the grocery store.

[ronbre]

have you checked out the really really really low price repos out there..some banks have even given houses away rather than trying to sell them..just so they don't have to maintain or pay taxes on them..

before housing got as cheap as it did..my niece bought a really nice home for $30K on 5 acres..and then houses went way cheaper than that..around here some homes went for under $10k


so if you are looking in Michigan..you will find a house for a low price !!! My sil has a beautiful double wide in a modular home park in Toledo for sale really really reasonably priced..as they just bought a new home a few miles away..

shop around !!

[Wolf mom]

As you already have taken stock of what you have, think of how you can use it outside the box. Think of what you can do & have, not what you can't do. Sounds like there needs to be some focus on your path to the future.

If you want a Tiny House, be creative in how you can make it work for you Everyone is in a different place. You also have to realize the demographics of the people on this site.

Is your question on what can you do now with what you have or what can you do in the future?

[wyld thang]

Personally I think a lot of those tiny houses, while they look cool, are a rip off when you hear how much they paid for constructing one. You can build a basic big garden shed and trick it out really nice for a lot less money. I have a neighbor up here who did that, he just had a stove and futon inside with a few shelves for canned food and books, and he did a lot fo living ourside(outhouse, firepit etc, no electricity)

You're up in Alaska, prime area for learning from history. THere have been lots of folks who lived in a small cabin and found ways to do what you want, with trailer sized workspace. Part of it is doing a lot of stuff outdoors. And using caches--those little storage boxes on stilts.

Have you heard of DIck Proeneke? there's a video and a couple books, get them pronto.

I would set up an outdoor kitchen. Here's a pic of my dear friend's set up


She's got a pop-up canopy, which they tie tarps on for walls when the weather gets nasty or really windy. SHe's got two folding tables, and one of those fold up kitchen centers. Get as solid of tables as you can get--card tables are rickety and also NOT tall enough to be comfortably usable for a countertop--your back will be screamin in no time. She's got a killer outfitter propane stove that would work great to can on(they scored one used for a great price, by if I could squeeze the bux I would buuy one of these new, they are heavy, tough and cook food wonderfully!)

Better view of her stove, she is making blueberry pancakes with alaskan blueberries btw


coolers slip under the table. If you have a working fridge in your trailer, you can rotate out frozen gel packs. Don't know what your bear/critter situation is though. But since it's just you, the fridge inside might be all you need.

We go in a trailer(hubby likes his trailer...) but when we are camping with my friend and her fam we cook together in her kitchen, and do dishes together.

You can set up a real nice firepit and use a dutch oven.
You can spread gravel under the canopy to keep down dust. You could find a river with the right size gravel and scoop a few buckets.

So...there are tons of people up there who survived in small cabins with limited prep and storage, so def it's possible. Part of it is setting up outside, and using a root cellar (which for just you would probably be enough) or elevated caches. You can can on a woodstove outside--you could probably get a cracked one for cheap or free(I got one for free and it's awaiting my outdoor kitchen setup). If you just use it outside it won't matter so much if it's cracked or got some holes.

Not to mention there is smoking stuff, mmmmmm! or make a friend and go can at their house?

[AngieM2]

This is one of those storage buildings, but being made to be a one bedroom 'house". This one has the shower stall in it as the bathroom walls was built around it. I talked to the builder and this one as you see it is $7995.00
Below shows how the inside is basically roughed in for walls. IT is 14ft x 32ft.
He was telling me of one he did that was up to the max 42ft long, but the two ends was a 6 ft porch.

[texican]

I have lived in tents before, from bivy size to large quonsets. It's very difficult to safely store enough food and supplies in a postage stamp size dwelling to get from one season to the next. When I was tent living, at least in the larger ones, I could get by with a months worth of food.

The size of your dwelling will determine how much 'stuff' you can have. More stuff = more security. On the other side of the coin, the more 'stuff' you have, the more you're tied down to the one spot. However, the basic tenet of homesteading, imho, is to have a secure and stable location, a cozy home with enough storage to keep several seasons worth of fruit and produce, a garden, orchard, and room for livestock.

I find we continually need more space, instead of less.

[fantasymaker]

WOW thats certainly minamal living! Im a fan of chest type freezers. They make great fairly secure insulated storage and The tops make good workspace.
Why the 16 foot trailer? Trailers are pretty cheep, you should be able to move up inexpensively if you want to.

[MariaAZ]

If I were seriously limited in storage space for food, I'd go for dehydrating most definitely. I've dehydrated potatoes, tomatoes, meat, fruits and veggies and they take up a LOT less space than a similar amount of canned food; in fact, I dehydrated over 10 lbs of sliced potatoes and it took up a little bit more than a gallon ziplock bag. Plus it cooks up well with just a bit of water.

[nodak3]

Oh my yes--dried foods!

Also, homesteader's in the old days were not all farmers. Think rancher or sheepherder!

[PyroDon]

dehydrator
five gallon bucket painted black, aluminum pie pans screened tops and bottoms cut out so they stack one small solar fan(optional) .
drill holes around the bucket lid (this will be used for the bottom)
your drying trays are stacked on this, then the bucket with a larger screened hole is placed on top . place this in full sun. drying the summer you have 10 hours of drying time, plenty for herbs and depending on outside air temp even jerky .

berries and meat can be dried
meat can be smoked or salted .
in all but the most notherly states lettuce can be grown through the winter as long as you keep the soil from freezing

[PulpFaction]

Thanks guys, lots to think about. Lee, really good information. I have been getting discouraged because I am in love with the traditional ideas of homesteading, but my set up right now simply doesn't allow it. Reminding me to think outside the box is good.

As to those that suggested a larger trailer, buying a repo, and "getting a job"...for various reasons these aren't immediate options. I am shopping for the ideal location for my permanent homestead, I have zeroed in on a specific area, and in the meanwhile building credit and cash reserves. I prefer the small trailer for the economy in towing, if I should take it on the road for actual travel. Honestly, though, I got it in a trade and it's not in the best shape and I don't think it would make it down the AlCan, so it will remain in AK.

You all inspired me to re-think what I can do with what I have. I'm going berry picking all day tomorrow and will trade some for kitchen time with friends that have pressure canners. I can also do the same with fish. I don't want to buy anything else here since I'm going to be heading back South shortly and shipping is too expensive to make it worth while. I might sell the trailer and put it towards getting a truck with a camper to get me back down South, and look for another small trailer there. The truck would provide a lot of valuable storage space.

Here is my other thought: On the theme of "using what I have", I have a lot of skills as a journalist and in marketing and such. I have operated a small experimental newspaper before and been a freelance writer for a long time. Maybe I should become a "migrant worker" until I find my perfect homestead. By that, I mean traveling from host to host (with their invitation of course,) and writing up articles and profiles along the way, either to sell to outside sources or put them together in a newsletter/magazine. I could hopefully sell enough articles or ad space to pay for gas, and trade work for food at the various locations. Perhaps if I had extras of one kind of food, I could trade it at the next stop for something I didn't have.

Do you think many people would be interested in this?