Landowners, this is something all of you should be aware of.....

[mldollins]

Its called "prescriptive easement". Do a search regarding your state on this matter.

Here is why, years ago my wife and I were looking for a house and found one we kind of liked. However, We noticed that the other neighbor accessed their property with the same entrance which would have been out entrance. When I did a search, they had a prescriptive easement to that property because that home had been using that entrance in excess of 20 years. As a rule, if a person accesses their property through yours for 20 years unimpeded, they can automatically have a right to continue using that and you cannot do anything about it. Legally you can do nothing unless you somehow buy them out contractually.

http://www.escrowhelp.com/articles/20031104.html

Do a search on this regarding your state. Some states are as low as 5 years.

[ronbre]

hmmm that would give us a prescriptive easement on the property we just sold to the neighbors..as we always used that land to access our rear of our property..howeve..as we knew we were selling we built road on our property and on our son's property so we both had access to the rear..not as far back as we did there..but we are working on building farther through our woods with our roads to reach the far back eventually.

[Yvonne's hubby]

I have to wonder why this is a major concern? If folks have been using a driveway that long, to access their property, who would want to deny them access now?

[mldollins]

You purchase property and find out that a neighbor accessed their property through yours whether by foot or vehicle. You in no way can build a fence around your property that might impede the person and if you build a home on that property, he or she still has a right to walk on your property without your permission. You might not have been aware of this when you bought the property but the law favors the other individual and YOU not the other person will have to do the legal paperwork to stop it.

[Yvonne's hubby]

Originally Posted by mldollins

You purchase property and find out that a neighbor accessed their property through yours whether by foot or vehicle. You in no way can build a fence around your property that might impede the person and if you build a home on that property, he or she still has a right to walk on your property without your permission. You might not have been aware of this when you bought the property but the law favors the other individual and YOU not the other person will have to do the legal paperwork to stop it.

Its not like someone has the right to wander around all over your property. Its just an easement for ingress and egress to their property, one that existed for many years prior. I see no reasonable reason to not continue to let them use said easement. As far as fencing goes, a simple cattle guard solves that issue. Again I have to ask why anyone would want to deny a neighbor access to their property that they have had for an extended period of time?

Oh, and if you purchase your property through a licensed realtor, you would have been made aware of any of these easement issues prior to purchasing.

[tab]

Exactly as YH stated. We used to own a land locked parcel and HAD to be granted access. We actually went the legal route and had a right of way drawn up and recorded. Both the row parcel and the one we owned have been sold since then but the row continues. No problems as it was all on the table. No we didn't wander around, just drove on the driveway we built and maintained. The boundaries were clearly defined and it did not cost very much to do a legal document.

Not to say that some crook can't try to steal land that way from a vacant landowner or such.

[Stann]

Originally Posted by Yvonne's hubby

I have to wonder why this is a major concern? If folks have been using a driveway that long, to access their property, who would want to deny them access now?

It's not a trivial problem. It's serious. What if the driveway has a creek and culvert on it? What if there are water rights or electrical involved on or across that piece of property? What if that longtime neighbor is just not a nice person, and wouldn't hesitate to damage your valuable aspects of "shared" property? It's difficult to protect your valuables, such as water access, if it is shared land.

On rural land, the sheriff and "officials" are often of little help in these matters. They'll say, "Try to get along with your neighbors." It's the wild west out here. Do what you must to protect your property.

[ksfarmer]

Nothing new. If a neighbor has no other access to his land the courts (at least in Kansas) will allow him to continue. However if he has another route to his land, then, he will be required to use it and quit the disputed route. We have land where the neighbor pays a fee each year to access his farm ground across our land. These things are best if worked out in a civil manner to the benifit of both parties.

[whodunit]

I think it's something to be very aware of.

I know in this area there have been disputes over gates being placed across such roads/driveways.

Sometimes one person doesn't want to be bothered with a gate they have to open and close, so they just leave it open when they come and go. Of course, it's their gate too, so don't they have the "right" to leave it open if they want to?

The sheriff never wants to get involved since it's a civil matter and there are no laws saying you can't leave YOUR gate open or put a gate on YOUR road.

Also, I am not trying to HJ the thread, but water rights is another issue.

We bought a place that we knew had a shared well with one other house, which was across the street. The actual well and the power used was on our property, but "owned" by both properties per a written water agreement.

Both places were owned by the same person and the people who lived in our place before we bought it (who rented), bought his place across the street.

When they rented the landlord (who lived across the street) just adjusted their rent because they had to pay for the power to the well, but when we came along I suggested we needed a meter to determine how much water each used and pay accordingly.

The neighbor (co-owner of the well) disagreed and told me that it didn't cost much to pump water and the cost of installing a meter wasn't worth it. I consented and he just paid a flat rate for his part which we both believed was well and beyond his actual usage. He was extremely diligent about paying and I never once had to ask him for the money.

The problem was we also found out that a third neighbor also used the well. We were never told this by the seller or the real estate agent.

Apparently years prior the owner let the third neighbor tie in and pay nothing since the people were in dire straits financially and had an inadequate spring. They were supposed to begin paying something when they got back on their feet. They did get back on their feet but never paid a thing. They had been getting free water for years.

I was ticked and told the co-owner that we needed to have an attorney draw up another water agreement involving the third party. It would specify what was paid by each party and that all parties would be responsible for repairs. If you use the pump, you are wearing out the pump.

The seller agreed to pay for the cost of the attorney since he admitted he had forgotten to tell us about this.

I contacted an attorney, but once the third neighbor got wind of it, I guess he balked at paying anything (the co-owner handled the negotiations with him since they were acquainted).

I wonder if the third neighbor could have made some kind of legal claim like a "prescriptive easement" that he had been using the well for years and shouldn't have to pay anything.

After I had already consulted with the attorney, we saw a pump drilling rig driving up the road and the third neighbor had his own well drilled. I guess his financial problems were over.

Well, by this time I had a $100 legal bill that the seller had agreed to pay. He never did pay, despite a letter requesting he do so. The co-owner of the well split the cost with me and we called it done.

That amount of money wasn't a big deal, but it was the principle of the thing. Although I would have felt stupid suing someone over $100.

The third neighbor never did offer any payment for the months of water he got from our well. Being a nice guy I even waited until his well was operational before shutting him off.

Thinking back on it, I bet I could have caused the seller and the real estate agent lots of grief and made my $100 back and then some, but I despise people who look for things to sue people over and don't want to become one of them.

[fantasymaker]

Originally Posted by ronbre

hmmm that would give us a prescriptive easement on the property we just sold to the neighbors..as we always used that land to access our rear of our property..howeve..as we knew we were selling we built road on our property and on our son's property so we both had access to the rear..not as far back as we did there..but we are working on building farther through our woods with our roads to reach the far back eventually.

Nope this wouldnt create that prescriptive easment. You owned it and you sold it. Thats the deal. In fact in many places it would Prohibit you from getting a easment of nessity (easement to a land locked parcel) since you are the one that created the problem, the courts would hold that you are responcable for dealing with it. Apparently in this case you agree since you took steps to deal with the situation created!

[Iddee]

KSfarmer said it right. If he has another way, he has to use it. I had the same situation in MS. I just cut a new road along the edge of my property and fenced the rest. He had to use the new road.

[mldollins]

That I understand.

In Illinois, if a a person has been allowed to use a portion of your drive to access his property for 20 year unimpeded, he has a right to continue and the court is automatically on his side.

The house I was looking at was the second house on the end. The house the shared the drive was a corner house. There were three sides the people could access the house, one of those sides was an alley. I thought I could just put fence up and be done. NOT true. They had been allowed to use the drive for more than 20 years by the previous owner. I didnt buy the place. People tend to block the drive even though its not their property.

Bottom line, the next door neighbor had full legal rights to use that driveway that was not theirs to get to their property even though they could have accessed it other directions....

[mldollins]

http://www.answers.com/topic/easement-by-prescription

This might better define the issue.....

[Pony]

IMO, what it boils down to is this: Everyone agrees that easements are a good idea, but no one wants an easement on their land.

We had so many issues with easements and a neighbor who bought himself a local "good ol' boy" lawyer that we just decided to sell the property. It made us sick to sell it, but sicker still to deal with the jerk-face neighbor from H-E-double-hockey-sticks.

Bottom line: If there's an easement for someone else to cross the property, DON'T BUY IT.

[Yvonne's hubby]

Originally Posted by Pony

IMO, what it boils down to is this: Everyone agrees that easements are a good idea, but no one wants an easement on their land.

We had so many issues with easements and a neighbor who bought himself a local "good ol' boy" lawyer that we just decided to sell the property. It made us sick to sell it, but sicker still to deal with the jerk-face neighbor from H-E-double-hockey-sticks.

Bottom line: If there's an easement for someone else to cross the property, DON'T BUY IT.

Well, that works too, as long as you dont want electricity, telephones, or other utilities or access by highways and roads to your own property.

[Pony]

Originally Posted by Yvonne's hubby

Well, that works too, as long as you dont want electricity, telephones, or other utilities or access by highways and roads to your own property.

Okay, Mr Smarty-pants!

Aside from utilities IF YOU WANT THEM, do not buy a property with easements.

[EDDIE BUCK]

Originally Posted by Pony

Bottom line: If there's an easement for someone else to cross the property, DON'T BUY IT.

I agree,but sometimes you don't know it. Theres an eight acre piece of property thats right close to mine.Two years ago this couple I know bought it.About a year later and before they started building,the land owner that owns the land behind that eight acres comes up with a real old map showing an easement ROW through the middle of that eight acres,that belongs to him.
The last three owners of that eight acre prop, knew absolutely nothing about it, and neither of their maps showed that easement on them.The last folks that bought that prop wanted to build,but now have to wait till the courts decide whether the easement stays or not. Its a big mess,they can't do anything ,sell, build or make plans. EB

[MN Gardener]

Originally Posted by fantasymaker

Nope this wouldnt create that prescriptive easment. You owned it and you sold it. Thats the deal. In fact in many places it would Prohibit you from getting a easment of nessity (easement to a land locked parcel) since you are the one that created the problem, the courts would hold that you are responcable for dealing with it. Apparently in this case you agree since you took steps to deal with the situation created!

You can't give an easement to yourself....but you could have reserved the easement when you sold.

[mldollins]

have those things plus phone going to all the neighborhood along the edge of my property. But its in and won't be touched. However, how would you like to have someone have the right to access their property through yours when they could do it another way. This also limits your building options.

[DYngbld]

We split a 18 acr lot into three smaller ones, The back lot (ours) had no access to the road. We have a deeded essment running along one side, that all three properties have access to. We had all the fine details written into the deed. (who pays for maint. and how much). At the moment the other two lot are empty, and I hope to buy them so it will be a moot point, but this was the best route for us. Even if God forbid we have to move the next owners will have legal access. All of our utilities run allong this same easment..