shipping an old gun

Sparticle · #1 08/18/08, 04:32 PM

I have a box of the ex's that I'd like to ship back to him. In it is an old, non-working hand gun from WWII along with many other things like his dad's old trench coat. How much trouble do you think I'd get in if I just mailed it and didn't declare it? The gun could have been in the pocket without me noticing it. I was going to use either DHL or UPS.

The reason I don't want to declare it is that I'm not shipping to a gun dealer.

steelpipe · #2 08/18/08, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Here is exactly what the ATF 'Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide' (ATF P 5300.4) says:
(B9) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by carrier?
A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by carrier to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U. S. C. 922( a)( 2)( A) and 922( e), 27 CFR 178.31]

B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U. S. Postal Service? [Back]
A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. A nonlicensee may not transfer any firearm to a nonlicensed resident of another state. The Postal Service recommends that longguns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.

If your former hubby is in the same state, then Federal Law says ok. I have no idea what the State you live in may say, you'd have to check that out. As far as what would happen? Who knows. But you are rolling the dice with a possible visit by the BATF as a consequence if you ship to another state, undeclared and not to a licensed FFL holder. Is your ex really worth the risk? Make him pay to ship the thing to a licensed dealer if he wants the gun back.

nathan104 · #3 08/18/08, 05:53 PM

That handgun should qualify under the curio and relics FFL. It would not have to be shipped to a gun shop, merely have him find a close C&R license holder.

**clovis** · #4 08/18/08, 06:03 PM

I would NOT use DHL...UPS will be far safer and better.

That old gun might have some serious value. If you care, make sure you have it sent with adult signature confirmation. He will have to be there to recieve it though.

You could always sent the stuff to me....I love WWII stuff!!!!!

Clove

steelpipe · #5 08/18/08, 06:24 PM

Edited after reading the complete post above.

cchapman84 · #6 08/18/08, 06:36 PM

I would recommend taking the gun apart and sending it in two separate shipments. That way, you're only shipping parts, not a complete gun. Not sure which parts you'd have to separate, you'd have to check with someone who knows more about it than I do. But, it's perfectly legal for companies like Cheaper Than Dirt to ship parts to people across state lines, so it makes sense it would be legal for you to do so as well. It will cost a bit more, but it's better than getting into hot water over an old gun.

woodsrunner · #7 08/18/08, 07:54 PM

Let me clear up a couplr misconceptions here.

The fram of a gun(the part with the serial #) is never a part. It is the gun. All the other parts could be removed and shipped. But, the frame is a gun and has to go through a dealer.

A C&R is a collectors license. A C&R holder will probably get in trouble for tranfering your gun.

As long as one of the states isn't NY,CA,MA,or IL. It's perfectly legal to ship yourself a gun as far as the feds are concerned. Is your last name still the same? Verify this, because it's been a couple years. Then ship it to him with his name as sender and reciever. If they ask for ID, then the name is the same, used to be no hassles.

nathan104 · #8 08/18/08, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cchapman84

I would recommend taking the gun apart and sending it in two separate shipments. That way, you're only shipping parts, not a complete gun. Not sure which parts you'd have to separate, you'd have to check with someone who knows more about it than I do. But, it's perfectly legal for companies like Cheaper Than Dirt to ship parts to people across state lines, so it makes sense it would be legal for you to do so as well. It will cost a bit more, but it's better than getting into hot water over an old gun.

Not true. The receiver (or frame) portion of any firearm that contains the serial number is considered a firearm and is what must be shipped to a proper license holder. The rest of the parts of the gun are just that, parts, and may be mailed. Its the frame/receiver with the s/n or where the serial number would be that is the problem.

EDIT- woodrunner beat me to it before I submitted my response, lol.

gunsmithgirl · #9 08/19/08, 04:28 AM

I would think it would be best to ship it to a gun dealer. he may have to pay a small transfer fee to get it, but that way you don't risk getting in trouble.

USPS will let individuals mail long guns, but only dealers may mail pistols through them. Not sure if they will let you around that due to it's age and condition or not, but you may want to check.

stranger · #10 08/19/08, 04:41 AM

Right , better ship it by licensed gun dealer or you could you could be in more trouble than you ever thought possible even if you broke no laws, The ATF will give you night mares for no reason.

cfabe · #11 08/19/08, 07:27 AM

With this situation there are state and federal laws you will have to deal with. State laws will vary - for example what gunsmithgirl said about long guns / pistols being different is true in Michigan but not most other states. NY is one of the more restrictive states in terms of firearms laws, I don't know the details but I suggest you take the gun to a gun dealer and have him transfer it to a dealer near your EX. That is the "most legal" way to do it. In all honesty you will probably get away with just mailing it but if you are caught, you will probably find yourself in jail. Not worth the risk.

Sparticle · #12 08/19/08, 07:56 AM

I'm in NY and he's in Texas. The box contains pictures, coats and many things besides the gun. Sounds like I'm going to have to do 2 shipments. I need to read back through all this and process it more so I can figure out what to do. There is so much conflicting info online.

I'm doing this for his kids, not for him. These are probably their only heirlooms of their grandfather. My ex, their father, didn't care about himself and went off on a drug binge when I was moving and wouldn't come get his stuff. So after 1 year of numerous warnings, I sold anything that would sell. This is the only thing of value left and i didn't have the heart to sell it.

texican · #13 08/19/08, 08:10 AM

I had an FFL for several years in the nineties. The law may have changed since then. But, back then, no one could ship a firearm, except a licensed FFL dealer or a manufacturer. I could only ship to another FFL holder. I shipped my own personal firearms across state lines, to myself, in AK... I couldn't carry my pistol through Canada. I had to present my FFL when shipping. Receiving was no problem... but, I would be risking a stiff prison sentence if I hadn't had the FFL license in hand when receiving, if a postal inspector had searched the package and asked for my proof.

It's not worth going to Prison... NY is one of the more stringent states. If you to gunbroker.com, there's an FFL lookup link... you can usually find a dealer nearby who'll only charge around 10 to 15$ to ship it legal... ship it to your ex's gun dealer of choice... only fair he pays at least the receiving end FFL's fees. Gunbroker.com also has resources on shipping laws, and possibly laws peculiar to NY.

Repeat: Saving $15 or risk 5 to 10 in Attica? or whatever womens prison they have in NY... Be wise, be safe... I don't think NY Corrections Units have homesteading sections or internet connections... but then again... Texas has "work farms"...

good luck...

**Cabin Fever** · #14 08/19/08, 08:12 AM

Your best bet is to find an FFL and have him ship the gun for you. He will ship it to another FFL of your ex-husband's choice. I often use the local Gander Mountain store to do this for me. It costs $20. Often there are many private FFL's and/or small gun shops in an area that will conduct this service for you. Remember tho, the shipment has to be from your FFL to his FFL. He will likely have to pay a service fee at his end as well.

Sparticle · #15 08/19/08, 11:49 AM

thanks everyone. i think i will find out about shipping it through a dealer. I didn't know about that option and it does sound safer.

radiofish · #16 08/19/08, 12:23 PM

Yes, find a FFL licensed gunsmith/ dealer, and ship it to another licensed FFL dealer in his area. As stated above, the Federales will not care what excuse you use, or if you try to plead ingorance!!!! See the above posts....

Better safe than sorry, and it should cost less than $75.00 dollars. Have him pay for the cost of shipping it to him.....

beowoulf90 · #17 08/19/08, 12:27 PM

As texican said, only a FFL dealer can ship your pistol and it has to go to another FFL dealer in that State. My local FFL dealer only charges me $20 on top of actual shipping so for him to do the paper work for that cost is fine with me. Even if this is a non working pistol it still needs to go through the FFL Dealer, unless it has been De-Milled after the war, then it is only a paper weight anyway.... But your local gun shop/ FFL dealer can tell you more once they see it.....

Macybaby · #18 08/19/08, 03:54 PM

Interesting - in the last two years I've shipped two pistols and didn't need to go through an FFL dealer. They both went back to the manufacturer, so maybe WHO they went to made a difference. Both were shipped from SD to some state out east (and back again, of course).

Both went Fed Ex, and did need to be dropped off at the main hub, and "inspected" for proper packing before sealing up and sending off. It was kind of funny because the clerk seemed so nervous to even be looking at a pistol.

Cathy

woodsrunner · #19 08/19/08, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparticle

I'm in NY and he's in Texas. The box contains pictures, coats and many things besides the gun. Sounds like I'm going to have to do 2 shipments. I need to read back through all this and process it more so I can figure out what to do. There is so much conflicting info online.

I'm doing this for his kids, not for him. These are probably their only heirlooms of their grandfather. My ex, their father, didn't care about himself and went off on a drug binge when I was moving and wouldn't come get his stuff. So after 1 year of numerous warnings, I sold anything that would sell. This is the only thing of value left and i didn't have the heart to sell it.

Where in NY are you?

If you are in the Rochester/Buffalo area PM me and I'll set you up with a dealer. Last time I shipped a gun he charged $20.00 + the actual shipping.

diamondtim · #20 08/19/08, 10:36 PM

Sparticle,

Drug Binge?!

Is your ex a felon or does he have a mental health record?

In other words is it legal for him to possess a firearm?

Are the kids 21 yet and do they have clean records?

There is no need to respond to those questions on a public forum, but they need to be answered before you ship him/them a firearm.

Good Luck.