Why won't my pump prime????

seedspreader · #1 06/28/08, 07:33 AM

Boy this has been an adventure...

Leaving to buy a pipe threading kit to try to rethread a knurled up pipe end soon.

agmantoo · #2 06/28/08, 08:37 AM

Are you going to pick up a new pump while you are out? We had part of this conversation in earlier posts. Even with a new pump you are still going to have some issues. Did You ever find the well itself. I would like to know what you found. If it was a small casing and only an adapter to take the 2 pipes from the house you will probably need to return here. Your best bet is to refurbish the entire system in order to get reliable service. A submersible pump would be my choice provided it could be adapted. On second thought, lets discuss your options prior to spending any more time and money, you could be throwing good money after bad if not careful. PS...I was previously under the impression that the pump was working. I was wrong wasn't I?

seedspreader · #3 06/28/08, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by agmantoo

Are you going to pick up a new pump while you are out? We had part of this conversation in earlier posts. Even with a new pump you are still going to have some issues. Did You ever find the well itself. I would like to know what you found. If it was a small casing and only an adapter to take the 2 pipes from the house you will probably need to return here. Your best bet is to refurbish the entire system in order to get reliable service. A submersible pump would be my choice provided it could be adapted. On second thought, lets discuss your options prior to spending any more time and money, you could be throwing good money after bad if not careful. PS...I was previously under the impression that the pump was working. I was wrong wasn't I?

Well, the pump runs. When it was mounted, you couldn't see the cracks, but as soon as I put water in it started leaking like a sieve. Figure it froze and cracked at some point.

I went to TSC and bought a pump.

The pump I pulled off was a 1/2 horse power Wagner (saving the motor for other uses) running on 115v. I ran a 10 foot smaller pipe in through the 1" return water pipe and didn't hit my bend (down to the well) and that was extremely good news because it means the well is at least past the front porch of the house. I figure that the well (from talking to some drillers around here) is probably about 60 feet deep or so, based on the HP and 115V.

The pump I bought has a screw in needle valve on the top of it, and I put a pressure gauge in the housing. As soon as I have the pipe rethreaded and hooked up, I am going to prime the pump with the needle valve shut and slowly open it up until the air is release (watching the gauge so that pressure doesn't drop below 24 lbs at any time per the manufacturer).

I think I have a standard 4" well, but of course won't know until I dig it up... but just based on talking to a few folks around here.

agmantoo · #4 06/28/08, 05:59 PM

If there is any air in the system the pump will not prime. My understanding of what you typed will not work. You must fill the entire pump and well portion of the system lipping full and it must hold the water until the get the fill plug/valve closed. The outlet of the pump needs to be held to above 20 PSI by using some type of valve such as a ball valve that is opened ever so slowly while holding the pressure on the pump side near the 20 PSI referenced. Priming a jet pump with a horizontal section of pipe is rather difficult at times. How nearby is the closest pressure water system? If you can get a garden hose strung from a neighbor to your place it will simplify the priming. You also need a tank(preferably a bladder one) in the system in event the foot valve doesn't seal perfectly.

poppy · #5 06/28/08, 06:04 PM

[QUOTE=seedspreader;3165893][IMG]

Have you tried Viagra?

seedspreader · #6 06/28/08, 06:11 PM

I figure it will be trial by fire... I don't know WHY it's this way (because there should be a foot valve in the well head) but there is a check valve at the top on the incoming side... so I am going to fill the inlet pipe, and the body of the pump with the needle valve at the outlet side (it came with the pump) and follow their directions. We will see if it works or not. You can see the return pipe that I have to cut and rethread... that's tomorrow's battle (after church) because today was Momma's day and we went to a couple of shops when we went into the city.

seedspreader · #7 06/28/08, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by agmantoo

If there is any air in the system the pump will not prime. My understanding of what you typed will not work. You must fill the entire pump and well portion of the system lipping full and it must hold the water until the get the fill plug/valve closed. The outlet of the pump needs to be held to above 20 PSI by using some type of valve such as a ball valve that is opened ever so slowly while holding the pressure on the pump side near the 20 PSI referenced. Priming a jet pump with a horizontal section of pipe is rather difficult at times. How nearby is the closest pressure water system? If you can get a garden hose strung from a neighbor to your place it will simplify the priming. You also need a tank(preferably a bladder one) in the system in event the foot valve doesn't seal perfectly.

I have a bladder tank on the system, but it's after the needle valve on the water supply outlet. The actual kit for the water supply outlet with the needle valve is called the "ejector kit".

Supposedly, after filling the pump housing/supply pipe, screwing on the ejector kit, (with the needle valve closed) turning on the pump, and watching the pressure build, you are supposed to slowly open the valve to let air and water out of the outlet until you are flushing only water out of the well. Don't know if it will work or not, but we will see.

The pressure gauge was put right into the pump body (as per manufacturers directions).

I figured at best I have a 50/50 chance of making this work. If it works, it will be 300 dollars (pump and parts) vs. 1500 (approx) for an updated submersible pump.

Eventually I will put in the pitless adapter and extend the well casing above the ground, but I am hoping it will be a couple of years before I HAVE to.

seedspreader · #8 06/28/08, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poppy

Have you tried Viagra?

Nope. Have you?

agmantoo · #9 06/28/08, 06:36 PM

For free I am going to provide some advice better than what you could have paid for today. Do not use any of that existing plumbing. You are about to contaminate the new pump with all that rusty crud. Then the new pump will not work and it will have to be dismantled and that will void the warranty. Man up to the task and start ripping out the old system and replace it with plastic from the well to the house. If at the well you have two pipes going down inside the casing you can replace all the pipe with plastic. You will have to pull what is in the well additionally. With no prior experience I doubt that you can get the jet and the associated pipe out of the old well. If by chance you have a 6 inch well, return the jet pump and get a submersible one. I will assist should you want my help but we need to do the project properly. When this is all over you will have a new respect for well repairmen. I am like a cow chain, I have been dragged through this mess so I somewhat know what I am doing. You can do it right once or you can do it over after a lot of expense and frustration.

seedspreader · #10 06/28/08, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by agmantoo

For free I am going to provide some advice better than what you could have paid for today. Do not use any of that existing plumbing. You are about to contaminate the new pump with all that rusty crud. Then the new pump will not work and it will have to be dismantled and that will void the warranty. Man up to the task and start ripping out the old system and replace it with plastic from the well to the house. If at the well you have two pipes going down inside the casing you can replace all the pipe with plastic. You will have to pull what is in the well additionally. With no prior experience I doubt that you can get the jet and the associated pipe out of the old well. If by chance you have a 6 inch well, return the jet pump and get a submersible one. I will assist should you want my help but we need to do the project properly. When this is all over you will have a new respect for well repairmen. I am like a cow chain, I have been dragged through this mess so I somewhat know what I am doing. You can do it right once or you can do it over after a lot of expense and frustration.

You know, if it was as simple as "man up" I would do it. I appreciate your advice, but I have to do what my pocket book allows. I know that dollars to donuts in the long run, it would be cheaper to do as you say, unfortunately, I don't have those long term dollars right now. I have short term cash flow...

I know it may not work, but it's what I can do now. It's pretty much that simple.

agmantoo · #11 06/28/08, 08:57 PM

At least dig into the top of the well before destroying the new pump. Possibly you could run the pump above ground on some cheap new plastic until you can relocate it. There is no need to waste $300 plus.