Helping Parents w/ heating costs.

[Cindy in PA]

Trying to figure what to do to help my 82yo parents with winter heating costs. They went through about 800 gallons of oil (hot water baseboard) last year & with the price increase this year will be really tough. House built in 1951, story and a half on full basement. It has no insulation. Main floor less than 1000 sq. ft. Finished basement (1972) has separate thermostat that is kept off. Upstairs is finished (1962). The oil burner is circa 1971. DH and I already figured we will put plastic on windows & covers on electrical outlets. Dad already covers over the top of the open stairway to the upstairs with styrofoam. This is NOT good in the case of a fire, because of fumes. I figure I can make an insulated curtain to hang at the bottom of the stairway. I assume it would be better for him to insulate as opposed to buying a new burner. I was thinking blown in cellulose or spray foam for the walls. I am concerned with moisture if we use cellulose. I know that foam or cellulose can be DIY, but is not recommended. The roof would be next to impossible to insulate, as only the cubby holes have access to the roof and floor and they are filled with HVAC equipment for his heatpump. Dad is attached to his plaster walls & exterior redwood siding, so damage should be kept to a minimum. What improvement gets the most bang for their buck? Has anyone done blown in iinsulation on existing walls? Keep in mind his heatpump, used only now for A/C is also 20 years old & on it's last legs. I feel they could go back to window units in their small house. Mom is disabled and needs A/C in humid weather for breathing. I read that his burner should be about 55-60% efficient from that era and new ones are 85-93%. Needless to say funds are limited. Thanks for any help you can give me.

[Use Less]

Call your local power company, fuel supplier, town hall, etc. There are programs designed to provide free energy audits and help with remediation. Sue

[whiterabbit454]

insulation i highly recomend we did our house long time ago with the blown in insulation if there is access to the roof you can also blow it in up there you would also see about having insulation added to the floor this will greatly decrease your heating bill good luck

[DW]

Do they still have that program that helps w/heating costs? I think it's called LEAP. My mother used to get $ from that. On insulating: My MIL had the blow in stuff done (in probably the same age house) and I don't think it was too expensive.

[watcher]

What we did to our house when I was a kid was build 2X4's 'wall' along the interior of the outside walls, add isolation then paneling right on top of the studs.

It didn't take that long to do and wasn't that expensive when compared to the money saved on heating and cooling. If I were doing it today I'd make the space larger. Either by using 2X6's or by placing the stud wall slightly away from the existing wall. I'd think using the 2X6's would be easier but the other way would be a little cheaper as well as offering much more sound proofing.

You could also put insulating foam board on the ceiling and cove it with ceiling tile. Working around the light fixtures could be a pain but again I think the cost would be well worth it.

You lose a few square feet of living space but the difference was AMAZING in both winter and summer!

[stranger]

finished basement?. make an efficiency appartment and let the renter pay for the fuel evne if they payed two thirds of the heat.

[mommagoose_99]

Our home was bult in 1860, no insulation. We had blown in insulation done, new energy efficient windows and doors added. Our house went from 60 degrees in winter to 72 degrees in winter. We burn all wood and are using much less. I would make window quilts and those little cloth door jam huggers to keep wind out.caulk everything you can think of and buy parents good underwear to keep them warm.
Our county has the HEAP program to help with fuel costs.

[Windy in Kansas]

I would certainly be willing to pay for insulation before paying another oil bill if it were me.
Working with plaster walls will be more difficult than with sheetrock ones but it can be done. I would probably go for the blown in cellulose.

At the least fasten sheets of foam insulation to ceilings of rooms used and then cover with sheetrock.

[wy_white_wolf]

Contact the LIEAP (Low Income Energy Assitance Program) in your area. They help with high energy costs and can do an energy audit on the house. They will upgrade insulation and other energy waste areas at no cost for those that qualify.

I guess in your area it's LIHEAP

http://www.dpw.state.pa.us/ServicesPrograms/LIHEAP/

[michiganfarmer]

Originally Posted by Cindy in PA

Trying to figure what to do to help my 82yo parents with winter heating costs. They went through about 800 gallons of oil (hot water baseboard) last year & with the price increase this year will be really tough.

move them in with you

[texican]

Do you have any extra rooms available? The time is fast approaching when independence (couple of people living alone in big houses) will be a fond memory...

Several good ideas mentioned. I'd recommend down jackets, insulated underwear, and some goose down sleeping bags. (course, I'm prejudiced... I like a cold house... unfortunately it doesn't get cold long enough in Texas)

[Maura]

Put insulation in the attic. Even poor insulation will pay for itself quickly. I'd go with blown in cellulose, but the fiberglass you can install yourself if you are careful.

I would heat the basement. Not high, but keep it at 68 deg. How old is the oil contraption? A new one would pay for itself in two to five years, depending on how much heat is going up the chimney.

With the savings from attic insulation and a new water heater, I'd then take a look at the windows. They are probably loosing heat around the windows. You could replace the windows, but simply adjusting the frames so air can't pass through will make a big difference. Whatever you do, make sure the windows can still be opened. Someone who sells windows probably can fix the current windows so they fit better. Don't let anyone talk you into replacing the windows until you've put in attic insulation and bought a new heater. Those windows advertised on TV are not the best, simply midgrade. Even low quality new windows save you on fuel simply because the windows fit snug, where as the old windows were loose.

[DenverGirlie]

Originally Posted by michiganfarmer

move them in with you

that's what I was thinking too

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

insulate maybe foam board around the a/c equiptment blown in the rest of the attic
they can come foam your house with very little damage to the siding or walls

my parents have a 50's house it had no insulation , but in the 70s when they bought it my dad sold injected foam insulation they remove the top piece of siding and drill holes behind it then stick the long tube inside the wall and foam from bottom to top

there house is well insulated now , and the phome has gotten better much greater density closed cell foam is available now with a r6 per inch rating also stops air infiltration

my 1909 house has blown in celulose in the walls and 6 inches in the cieling i need to add more just as soon as i get off the nob and tube wiring
i need new windows and doors but i use about 700 gallons a year that keeps it 68

my new wood stove gets installed tommorrow then i need to get my re-wiring project done so i can add 8 inches to the attic


but yes 82 , they may be living with you soon enought any way
you have to ask yor self do we keep working so we can give it to the oil company or do we find another way my auto fule bill was 600 then 700 now 800 one more month till i start working from home 4 days a week

it is sad when you realize that you have dropped 10 grand on fuel for auto and heat in a year the number hurt and i am working on change

[ldc]

I live in the humid south and bought cellulose insulation to be blown into the attic space by a neighbor with a blower. It was a lifesaver and money saver, in terms of a much improved cozy winter temperature, and in terms of fuel saved. It's still working; so while I'm sure the insulation must be damp by now- it was done 14 years ago - it is still a big improvement over the original nothing. ldc

[brosil]

We used a chopped fiberglass mixed with glue to prevent settleing. It works great. We have wood siding and the installers just pried it up enough to insert the hose and then nailed it back down. You should be able to find something similar in your area.

[longshadowfarms]

Slightly off topic but as I've been walking the dog lately I've noticed that around here (fairly low income town in a high rent district) a LOT of homes have single pane windows. One of our neighbors has absolutely no insulation at all and single walls - it is really a cabin but they live in it year round! I really worry about how many of these families are going to manage this winter. It seems to me a no-brainer that insulation and windows are going to pay for themselves pretty quickly but if you don't even have that kind of $ to start or don't know how to install windows yourself, it seems an uphill battle. It would seem to me that efforts like HEAP would be well served to help people button up the house first before trying to help them pay bills.

[Ross]

Insulate insulate insulate. I sell oil furnaces and DWH and boilers but your best money is spent on insulation. I doubt the burner is much below 75% eff and you should get it serviced and reset but that's all I'd do........ if there's room to add insulation. Blown insulation into the attic is a priority make sure the windows and doors are sealed well and upgraded where needed. If you seal up the house too wel remember the oil burner will need a fresh air inlet or you risk depressurizing the house and poisoning everyone inside.

[SolarGary]

Hi,
You can use this calculator to evaluate improving insulation in the walls, ceiling, etc. It will also tell you how much a more effcient furnace would save:

http://www.builditsolar.com/Referenc...sulUpgrade.htm

It might be able to tell which projects have the best payoff.

If your utility has an audit program, this might also help decide on which projects pay the best.

Cellulose is actually a pretty easy diy project, although walls are more difficult than attics.

It sounds like the attic may not be accessible? This would usually be the first target to go after, and in addition to adding insulation, sealing the joints on any heating ducts that go through the attic and insulating heating ducts in the attic can be a major savings. Sealing all the wiring, plumbing, and light fixture penetrations from the living area into to attic can also be a major saving.

Gary

[Cindy in PA]

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions. I knew that insulating was the way to go, but a new heater is easier! I will start looking for an insulation contractor. The attic is going to be a big problem, but I will go up and look inside the cubby holes and see what's what. As far as taking in a tenant, the basement is a dark 70's finish and you have to walk all thru the finished part to access the laundry and the bathroom. I also would fear for my parent's safety with someone moving in. Moving them here would probably be over my Father's dead body. That being said, we have a 1200 sq. ft ranch with 3 bedrooms & one really small bath. We are 4 adults aged 19-55 and it's pretty tight. I would & will definitely do it in a pinch, but parents have a handicap bathroom that was necessary since 1995 when Mom had her first stroke. Dad is her sole caretaker & does medical procedures you would not believe. She goes from bed to living room chair. If it wasn't for Mom, he would be out working. He was $500 over the LIHEAP limit last year and would have to go down below SS to get more than $100 anyway. As far as our electric co. (DH & DS#1 employer), it is one of the few that offers little in the way of eenrgy audits right now, but I will look into it again. DH and I will help my parents as much as necessary. I have two other siblings, but they are not able to help really. Their house is paid for, so Dad can get money if he has to. Just wanted to make sure that what he would have to pay is less than what he would pay the Oil Company. It will pay him if he finally decides to sell in the future. Thanks again.