In-depth diesel truck question

[n9viw]

Pony and I are continuing our plans to GTFOD and off to our farm, but as we learned a couple weekends ago, our little Jeep Cherokee just isn't up to the task when it comes to hauling real loads! We towed a 4x8' flatbed with the tub for my Jeep Scrambler, a 2-burner box stove, some stove pipe, five Jeep wheels with 31" mud tires, an extra rollbar, and three empty barrels on it. Needless to say, it didn't go well... high engine temps, had to keep the road speed to 40-50mph, and really couldn't go any faster than 55 on the flats either due to engine temps or simply 'hitting the wall'. We need a truck, but our budget is about 5k.

A friend of mine told me about a local dealership selling a '96 Chevy K2500 with all the stuff we're looking for, for about $5k. I started doing some research into the Chevy diesel, and about got scared out of my wits! Cracking blocks, blown injector pump controllers, overheating, blown head gaskets, and these are all KNOWN problems, with NO factory support! The coolant issue was addressed in the '97 redesign, but if you own a '96, you have to make the mod yourself.

I've heard some good things about the pre-Powerstroke Fords, the 7.3 and 7.3T in particular. My biggest concern about Fords is their TTB front axle system- apparently they're very smooth, but when they go out, they're EXPENSIVE.

Dodge has always used the Cummins engine, which has a rock-solid reputation. The only problem is that when you CAN find them, people still want a mint for them. The ones that are affordable are quite high-mile or getting pretty rusty in the body.

So, all that said, and WITHOUT riling the usual "Ford vs Chevy vs Dodge" chest-beating nonsense, which would you recommend? I'm looking for REAL-WORLD, PERSONAL EXPERIENCE - hearsay need not apply! (direct relatives' experiences are okay) What works for you? What didn't? We're looking for decent power (up to towing 10k if necessary), decent mileage (15+), and decent strength/longetivity (NO LEMONS!).

Thanks!
Nick

[Forerunner]

You might step out of the box and consider a single axle dump truck with an International DT466 or Cat engine or equivalent.
Good tires are easy to come by, used.
Mileage plate is relatively cheap.
They are out there for 3-5k.
You can haul a swell of a payload, AND, imagine how useful that big, motorized wheelbarrel will be on the farm.

I had a 1979 International tandem axle dump, and I miss it horribly.

[Theront]

I wouldn't be afraid of the 6.5l diesel. I have one and so far am enjoying it. I got mine with blown head gaskets. I replaced the heads and gaskets and actually got to tow with it this weekend. I pulled our 31' camper and supplies with my family in the vehicle. My camper weighs 7200lbs empty. I had no problems maintaining 55mph with cruise. I even had to brake for a semi on the hill in front of me.

There is a lot of support on the internet if you look. I have found another site with a family like Homesteading today. I frequent there a lot also.

dieselplace.com

Good luck with your decisions

Theront

[fantasymaker]

the ford deisel is rated at about 250,000 miles but thats in a midsize comercial operation,Often you can double that,but agin thats pretty extreame.
The key to what your looking at is a 1-ton with one of those you will get a solid very solid long lasting truck that you are less likly to overload. and the milage is about the same as a light truck. The key to milage is in the gearing the higher the better.
A good used one will let you spend the appropriate amount for your situation.the more you spend of course the better the truck available to you.
1 and 1/2 ton trucks can be GREAT buys but they are usually geared low and set a bit higher resulting in useing more fuel.
You MIGHT concider a fullsize diesel van the one ton I drive now gets 20 mpg and can pull a 4 ton trailer with ease.

[whiterabbit454]

i vote dodge because of the cummings engine my dad has one it has over 100,000 on it no worries its just getting broke in the body will fall apart b4 the engine

[ErinP]

Just as an FYI, Ford's PowerStroke engine is a 7.3. (Prior to that they were just 7.3 IDI) It came out in 1994. It's also the newer (and problematic) 6.0.
A pre-2003 PowerStroke will be a work horse that'll last you for years. Navistar's (International Harvester) 7.3 PowerStroke is one of the best light diesel engines ever made.
A post-2003 (the 6.0 engine) might be a work horse that'll last you for years. I know nothing about the '07 incarnation as a 6.4


Oops! Got so caught up in clarifying your statement about Ford, I forgot to answer! lol

We've lived on, and neighbored, a lot of ranches in Nebraska, Kansas, Colorado, and the Dakotas. For whatever reason, Fords are the most popular diesel pickups, followed by Dodge. (More Ford dealerships, maybe?) Chevys are fairly unusual. (Bad press?)

We have a '97 PowerStroke F250 that's almost hit 200,000 miles. It still runs like new.
We have several friends and neighbors who have similar vintage PSDs as their work pickups that have between 150 and 300K on them. Still going strong. We're planning on getting 400K out of ours and are therefore careful to garage it.

So far as mileage, we get a typical 20mpg on the highway, no trailer, with the cruise set just a hair below 65. We can, and do, easily tow 10,000lbs. though heavier loads would be better with a one ton, rather than 3/4.

[fantasymaker]

Originally Posted by Forerunner

You might step out of the box and consider a single axle dump truck with an International DT466 or.

IH engines are not exactly noted for their economy....Specially this one!
Thus the reason the engine in the Ford is usually expected to give about 4 mpg less than the one in the Dodge

[Wisconsin Ann]

We bought a 1996 Ford F250 7.3 turbo diesel ,4 wheel drive, extended cab that had been owned by a landscaping company, and plow in the winter. It had the plow stuff up front (no plow tho), heavy duty hitch for $5,000 a couple of years ago. GREAT TRUCK.

it had 140K miles on it. now it has 167K. Engine still purrs like...well, a REALLY big cat. We had to replace the limited slip differential last year, but we're REALLY rough on that poor truck. I think that was $1300 all told.

We haul pallets of bricks on it while pulling more bricks on a 10K pound dual axle trailer.

gotta love a good truck.

(gets lousy mileage tho. 16 to 17mpg usually. on the plus side, it only goes down to 14mpg fully loaded and pulling a big trailer ....we're set up to use waste veggie oil tho. that works pretty well...just have to remember to FIND some!)

[daycab]

I've got a '99 F350 powerstroke with 140,000 miles on it. If I drive the speed limit and I'm not pulling anything, I get 17 mpg. With fuel prices now, I don't use it unless I need to pull or haul something. Mileage goes down to 10 - 11 mpg with 4k - 5k load.

I bought it 4 years ago with about 90,000 miles on it. I've put brakes, tires, and a alternator on it. Great truck.

[watcher]

Stay way away from the Ford diesels! Especially the pre-powerstroke ones and any Ford product with an E4OD automatic transmission (you can tell if the OD button is on the end of the shifter lever).

We are in the same sort of spot. We are looking at an older V8 Chevy or GMC. People we have talked to say they offer good power with fair fuel econ.

[ErinP]

Stay way away from the Ford diesels!

Why?

Or do you just mean the auto tranny?
(150K does seem to be the magic number when they die. We have a handshaker, though. No problems!)

[FL.Boy]

I'm a chevy/gmc man. But right now you can't give away trucks. There on ever street corner for sale. Imo i would not give $5,000 for a 13 year old truck.

[knight88]

I have a Dodge Cummins 2500, my first Chrysler product ever, the truck is a 2006, has 94,000 miles on it. We have been using it to move to TN from AZ. GREAT machine!. One or two more trips and the farm will be relocated. BTW our mileage has varied between 12MPG and 23MPG depending on the trailer load. Would definately do it again...

[fantasymaker]

Originally Posted by watcher

Stay way away from the Ford diesels! Especially the pre-powerstroke ones and any Ford product with an E4OD automatic transmission (you can tell if the OD button is on the end of the shifter lever).

.

Why ?These are simply some of the best machines available for most work.They will outlast the chevey in everyway.
The Dodge is the only competitor of any note and while the cummings WILL outlast the Powerstroke its only important if you will really be useing the truck after 350,000 miles or so. The Ford on the other hand will be otherwise much more usable for the last 200,000 miles than the Dodge.
Don't belive my 5,000,000 miles of experiance in ALL types of trucks? Just take a look at your local hotshot or trailer toter terminal and see what the mix of trucks is among those that have to make a living with them.

[Quint]

I wish I'd have known you were looking for a truck. A associate of mine sold one of the old body style Dodge pick-ups with the cummins turbodiesel. One of the late 80s early 90s models that still had the same square shoebox body from the 70s. Had 52,000 miles on it and was mint. He sold it for 4 grand. He offered it to me but I was strapped for cash at the time and couldn't take him up on the offer and he needed to get rid of it quick.

[fantasymaker]

That sounds like a good deal Quint. How did he come to decide to part with it? Sounds like it might have been a great match for the OP.

[zito]

Originally Posted by watcher

Stay way away from the Ford diesels! Especially the pre-powerstroke ones and any Ford product with an E4OD automatic transmission (you can tell if the OD button is on the end of the shifter lever).

The above poster gives bad advice. Really bad advice. I have an '86 3/4 4x4 with the 6.9 and a manual trans. 180 000 miles on it so far, and it's needed glow plugs and a rebuilt injector pump. The truck's needed 2 rear diffs, but that's because of the weight I load on it. It's a work truck, and when it's on the road, it's pulling a 28' gooseneck 95% of the time. Mileage varies from 27 empty, down to 17 loaded pulling a 16 000 lb trailer. That's in Canadian gallons; do your own conversion. The powerstrokes have more power, but get correspondingly worse mileage. Actually, even a wee bit worse mileage than that, imo.

As for the automatic; I'll admit I'd even prefer a 3-spd c-6 to the E4OD. However, it's like any overdrive. If you're going to be moving a substantial amount of weight, lock out the overdrive. Btw, the '91 and older Fords mount the overdrive lockout switch on the dash, '92 and up have them on the shifter handle.

The cummins diesels are awesome. Excellent power, and better mileage than the Fords, especially pulling. Better longevity imo as well. However, you do pay a premium price for them in a used truck. As well, transmissions seem weaker on the dodges. I prefer the early '97 or older Dodge, to get the 12-valve motor. They seem to have fewer problems than the 24-valves, and get better mileage. As well, if you're an automatic kind of guy, you can find allison automatic trannies in medium duty trucks, and retrofit that to your Dodge pu. Thousands of cummins were put in medium duty trucks, so parts/service/repair can be easier to find at times. My brother currently has an '03 Dodge with 115 000 on it, and it's been a good truck. Needed a water pump replaced so far, and that's about it, more or less. Had an issue with it chugging on the highway; it was in to the dealership 2 x to solve the problem, with ECM and pretty much any fuel or ignition related sensors/components being changed. Turned out it was a faulty fuel filter. Since then, it's done well. Now however, it has a starting problem, and the dealer thinks it's injectors. Those run around $350 each, from the dealership. Something to keep in mind.

Stay away from the Chev's unless you can find a low-mileage truck. Imo, stay away from even low mileage chev diesels. For every person who can tell you how they had/have such good luck with them, you can easily find 10 others who say "they SUCK!". Turbo problems, cooling problems, and cylinder head problems seem to be the most common.

Good luck finding your truck!

Zito

[Beeman]

Originally Posted by n9viw

Pony and I are continuing our plans to GTFOD and off to our farm, but as we learned a couple weekends ago, our little Jeep Cherokee just isn't up to the task when it comes to hauling real loads! We towed a 4x8' flatbed with the tub for my Jeep Scrambler, a 2-burner box stove, some stove pipe, five Jeep wheels with 31" mud tires, an extra rollbar, and three empty barrels on it. Needless to say, it didn't go well... high engine temps, had to keep the road speed to 40-50mph, and really couldn't go any faster than 55 on the flats either due to engine temps or simply 'hitting the wall'. We need a truck, but our budget is about 5k.

A friend of mine told me about a local dealership selling a '96 Chevy K2500 with all the stuff we're looking for, for about $5k. I started doing some research into the Chevy diesel, and about got scared out of my wits! Cracking blocks, blown injector pump controllers, overheating, blown head gaskets, and these are all KNOWN problems, with NO factory support! The coolant issue was addressed in the '97 redesign, but if you own a '96, you have to make the mod yourself.

I've heard some good things about the pre-Powerstroke Fords, the 7.3 and 7.3T in particular. My biggest concern about Fords is their TTB front axle system- apparently they're very smooth, but when they go out, they're EXPENSIVE.

Dodge has always used the Cummins engine, which has a rock-solid reputation. The only problem is that when you CAN find them, people still want a mint for them. The ones that are affordable are quite high-mile or getting pretty rusty in the body.

So, all that said, and WITHOUT riling the usual "Ford vs Chevy vs Dodge" chest-beating nonsense, which would you recommend? I'm looking for REAL-WORLD, PERSONAL EXPERIENCE - hearsay need not apply! (direct relatives' experiences are okay) What works for you? What didn't? We're looking for decent power (up to towing 10k if necessary), decent mileage (15+), and decent strength/longetivity (NO LEMONS!).

Thanks!
Nick

I have no idea where to start answering your question. I ride to work in a 94 GMC diesel 6.5L that has 250k mi. on it. I serviced this truck since new and aside from maintenance it's had 1 injector replaced and a trans sensor.
Basically they all have good ones and bad ones and they're all pretty expensive to repair if something breaks. I question why you want to jump immediately from a Jeep to a diesel HD pickup? A good reliable proven inexpensive gas engined V-8 pickup would be my choice. I'm GM partial so a good 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton with a 350 engine and an automatic trans (I'm automatic partial also) would be my choice. Simple, cheap, proven and dependable that's hard to beat, I would stay in the 90-95 range for the simpler thropttle body fuel injected 350 engine.

[agmantoo]

I too have been down this "road" in an attempt to find a good vehicle. I have concluded that none of the the big 3 meet my needs. I am now searching for a Isuzu NPR cab and chassis. On this truck I will install a small flatbed and have a decent farm truck. Start looking around at the landscape, exterminator and small delivery trucks and you will see the truck I am referencing. These little trucks are rather plain and blend in with the traffic. From all the inputs I have received the diesel is very dependable and the trucks give overall excellent service. This is the truck I am referencing
http://www.truckpaper.com/listings/d...5D462DB231A5C3
Good fuel economy and durability, ability to make a U turn on a two lane road and with a short wheel base (109 inches) are features that attracted me. These trucks have great accessibility for servicing.

[neolady]

A piece of advice was given us by a dealer many years ago and it could fit your situation. Rather than spending $$ for a newer vehicle, why not lower the payload your Jeep is hauling around and just make a few more trips?