Cougar?

[Lizza]

I think we may have a cougar around and we have lost one goat. No sign of the goat at all, like it just disappeared.

Has anyone dealt with one before? My husband is thinking about putting in motion detector lights tomorrow aimed at the fields and barns. Our neighbor got two llamas and said he hasn't lost an animal since (he has sheep). Has anyone else used llamas? I would get a LGD but I need something that can guard now, not a puppy, and I worry about bringing in an adult dog with my other dogs and animals (I saw the back end of my Australian Sheppard as he ran to hide underneath the porch when we heard a screech in the woods, not even a whisper of a bark out of him).

I am calling the fish and wildlife people tomorrow in hopes that they may try and track it but I'm not going to hold my breath for help.

I am keeping the kids close to home and not letting them in the woods, even with the dogs. I am also upgrading our gun because I don't think either of the ones now would bring down a cougar.

Thank you for any help!

[Lizza]

I guess I forgot to say why we think we may have a cougar. We have had cougars in the past around here. About 20-30 miles away they trapped and killed a mother with two cubs last year. Our neighbor thinks he lost about 3 sheep last year before he got his llamas to a cougar. The neighbor at the top of the hill said they saw one on her way up her driveway (about 1/2 mile steep driveway) this winter. A few days ago we heard the oddest strangest noise in the woods below our field. It made a few quick noises (high pitched odd noises), then moved REALLY fast and made one more quick noise down by our main shop, and that was it. After that we realized we were missing a goat (full sized, older goat) but never heard any goat/predator struggles that night. I really don't know. It actually took me few days to figure out that it might have been a cougar but now I realize I don't know what else it could have been. We have coyotes but have no sign of a carcass and I don't know if they can get a full size goat away from the herd and barn without a huge rucuss. Thanks again!

[Reptyle]

Originally Posted by morningstar

I guess I forgot to say why we think we may have a cougar. We have had cougars in the past around here. About 20-30 miles away they trapped and killed a mother with two cubs last year. Our neighbor thinks he lost about 3 sheep last year before he got his llamas to a cougar. The neighbor at the top of the hill said they saw one on her way up her driveway (about 1/2 mile steep driveway) this winter. A few days ago we heard the oddest strangest noise in the woods below our field. It made a few quick noises (high pitched odd noises), then moved REALLY fast and made one more quick noise down by our main shop, and that was it. After that we realized we were missing a goat (full sized, older goat) but never heard any goat/predator struggles that night. I really don't know. It actually took me few days to figure out that it might have been a cougar but now I realize I don't know what else it could have been. We have coyotes but have no sign of a carcass and I don't know if they can get a full size goat away from the herd and barn without a huge rucuss. Thanks again!

My thoughts are that something had to father those cubs from last year, therefore, Papa is out there somewhere doing what cougars do...If Mom was killed with her cubs, then he may have taken over her turf.

[sungirl]

What type of goat? dairy, fiber, meat, mini? I would contact Fish & Game people about getting money for the lost animal. Back in Maine I had a lamb go missing so I put up a game cam and found the 'yotes were taking them down. I lost 2 and got a check for $200 for them. Now that diddn't cover the loss but it was sure better then just taking the loss.

Patty.

[Lizza]

Thank you both. When we first moved in 6 years ago we came home and found a note taped to our door telling us that the cougar "was back" and eating all of the jack rabbits and not to let the kids roam in the woods. When we went over she said we had an "old" male cougar that came from time to time. I guess he was seen disappearing into the bottom of my property. That was 6 years ago and we haven't had any problems since, except last year. They did a bunch of logging last year, I wonder if it drove them down? I am going to call the fish & Game people today. I don't know how I can prove it was a cougar but I hope they take me seriously.

edited: she was a dairy goat.

[TedH71]

Male cougars have a huge property to range on and they frequently overlap females' for breeding purposes. Males do keep males out tho. I believe a male's range is larger than a female's 100-500 miles...not kidding.

[ff468]

Today there was a female caught in a Salt Lake City suburb ofWest Jordan. This area was once farm land, wheat/corn and has now been over run by house after house. The hills to the west are where the big copper mine is. Tons of cats on them.
We have hed them in our neighborhood as well. Most the time they are just passing through and maybe a house cat or dog will come up missing. The coyotes do far more damage than these cats.
Good luck, always a sad day to lose livestock.

[Cygnet]

If you have a lion around that has learned to prey on "human-owned" animals, you need 2-3 good sized dogs to discourage it. Lions may eat one dog, but they're not stupid, and they won't mess with a pack. Dogs don't have to be pedigreed anything, just moderately aggressive, loud, and willing and able to put up a credible fight if it comes down to that.

(There's one in my area that hasn't, as far as I've ever heard, eaten any livestock. It kills the occasional single dog -- great for keeping down the stray dog population -- but is really, really suspicious of people. I've seen it once while horseback riding and see tracks and scrapes occasionally.)

-- Leva

[Lizza]

I just wanted to update and say that I talked with my local Fish & Game guy for about 45 minutes today. He was really nice, they aren't going to help, but they were really nice. They said they would come out if we either saw one during the day (because that means they aren't hunting well and could be lame or maybe a mother weaning that is very hungry) or if we could find where the cat stored the cache (if we lost another goat and we could find that within 24 hours they would come get the cat, of course we have to actually stalk said cat and he said to bring at least two people and a gun-he said the cougar would probably be watching his cache, sounds fun).

He did say that we could kill the cat ourselves carte blanche....we didn't have to follow any hunting rules. This is only actually ON our property though. He said to go down and get a cougar tag so that we could follow it and kill it off our property if we needed to, for that we would have to follow shooting hours and things. He did want us to call the state police so they could pick up the carcass so they could look it over, if we can actually manage to shoot it that is.

My husband talked with the feed store owner today and I guess about 3 weeks ago a neighbor about 5-10 miles away lost two goats and then the cougar hung out in the barn, they shot and killed that cat. I also happen to get a hold of a neighbor about 1/2 mile from me and they saw a cougar last Saturday night about 10:30, it was stalking a calf. They tried to shoot it but it was too far. They had a friend come set traps all along the mountain. This woman said there was a mother that raises a set of cubs every year and thinks that is who this is. The Fish & Game guy also thought there may have been more then one at our place, meaning a mother & cubs.

Thanks again for the help.

[TedH71]

See if there is a hound hunter that hunts mainly cougar...I am not sure if it's legal in Oregon but know they are allowed to hunt bear and bob cats in Oregon so am assuming cougar is legal as well. You would have to contact your neighbors though because it's pretty much guaranteed that the cougar will run to your neighbor's lands in order to try to get rid of the dogs if he/she doesn't climb a tree.

[wyld thang]

MS, my neighbor got a llama(he's a mean one BTW) to guard her horses, never had a problem even though she's seen a cougar pull down a deer across the road from her, and also caught it in her barn one night in winter(so now she never goes to teh barn without her gun). I have found a fresh kill it worked on for a few days, it moved it around. Spooky. In a normal situation they do have huge territories, and seem to pass through rather than hang out(unless it's hurt and finds easy pickin's). There are lots of people here with fat juicy goats and chickens and calves, but very seldom is stuff taken. There is one neighbor on the edge of no man's land who gave up on raising calves though--the cats do seem to be very wary of human activity, and since she was on the very edge it was easy for the cat to bop in and get some take out.

All this is from my experience living in a similar area of Oregon as you. Definately keep the kids close, keep an eye on things. If it's a problem cougar other animals will be taken, but if it's one event and nothing else happens it probably has moved on. I have heard stories of two female cougars that have lived very near and raised cubs, but people have definately sighted them. Also when the human activity/density rose above a certain point(and probably more barking dogs) the females moved on. Small stuff like cats and very small dogs did disappear in the cub season. Cougar hunters have to ask permission to track a cougar across private property I think.

Hope that stuff helps!

last I heard it was illegal to hunt cougars with dogs in Oregon--which is stupid--may be different tho, that was the local gossip

[JasoninMN]

I am sure some people aren't going to like this but a llama adds a false sense of security to the flock and thats it. I am sure someone is going to add how they have had no loses since a llama came around but lets face it a llama is another prey animal. Sure they will probably intimidate a lone coyote or a domestic dog because of their size, but they have also been preyed on my dogs, coyotes, wolves and cougars too. Cougars can kill prey much larger then a llama and a llama is nothing but another meal to a cougar. Google cougar attacks on llamas and you'll see for yourself. The only affective guard animal against a cougar is a PACK of LGD's and its best if you have some that patrol and a couple that stay with the flock because cougars have been known to outsmart even a pack of dogs.

[Lizza]

You are right JasoninMN....at least that's what the Fish & Game guy said. He said if I got a llama the cougar would probably just kill that, it wouldn't protect my goats. Although my neighbor does swear that he hasn't lost any since he got two male llamas.

Yes WT, it is illegal to hunt with dogs (for bear as well as cougar) in Oregon. The Fish guy said that it really wasn't needed. Cougars have gone from about 200 in the 60's when they were almost hunted to extinction to about 5200 now, most of that during the years of hunting with dogs.

He said I have one of either two cougars. The first is that this is part of someones territory, females have between 25 miles and 100 miles range (he said it's probably somewhere in the middle) and males can have 100+ miles, overlapping as many females that he can. So if it is that cougar then he said it takes about 2-3 weeks to make there "rounds" to all there spots in their territory, checking everything out and hunting, remarking and whatever else cougars do. That it could be back sometime in the next few weeks to check on more food. The second type is a "transitory" cougar who is trying to establish a territory. He said if it was a transitory animal that we probably would never see it again, it's just trying out territories. I told you I spent a lot of time on the phone today .

[CraftyDiva]

What next?...............................http://www.aarp.org/family/love/arti...HBX_PK=cougars

[sungirl]

Originally Posted by CraftyDiva

What next?...............................http://www.aarp.org/family/love/arti...HBX_PK=cougars

:

Patty.

[TundraGypsy]

A woman was jogging through the woods on a horse trail, north of us a number of years ago. She got too close to a cougar's den and got bounced on and killed. They found her body a day later after bringing in dogs to find her. They killed the momma and took the two babies to a nearby zoo. No one jogs in the woods anymore, even those on horses are a little leary of the area now.

We have wild things in the lower area of our 50 acre property. Cougars, bobcats, foxes, a lot of coyotes, and a yearly bear who likes to eat from our orchard. We've seen all the tracks and know they are there. I don't walk around the place like I used to either; not after I saw the huge bear tracks in the dirt and the huge piles of scat. Yikes!

[sungirl]

Any update? Did it come back?

Patty.