Growing field corn. Whats your thoughts on this

[FarmboyBill]

I have never been satisfied with my field corn crops since comeing to okla. I plant around 8 acres of OP corn and take what grows and then plant it back to oats. Im thinking of only planting one acre of RR hybred corn, working it at least once a week with rotery hoe, spring tooth harrow fixed to allow for the rows, cultivator and then spray . Whats your thoughts,. I soak the seed for around a week then quick dry it on tin before I plant which seems to do really good, as far as it goes. I totally went through my planter, and thats about all I can think of to do, I get soil samples and dry fertilize at time of planting, We dont have anhydrous ammonia here which I think is essentual for good vorn, so I got to go around that. I would like to water the rows once a night from the sprayer for a week if a dry week, and then water once a week till the corns a foot tall if again its a dry season. which last year it wasnt lol I got the ground plowed, and that was that. I got bottom ground, and it stayed wet for the most part up into July

[oldmanriver]

Last year I planted Hickery King a white corn of the old days . We had a very dry year record setting and the corn did very well . The stalks were 7 to 9 feet tall and the 3 acres produce about 50 bu per acres . It was enough to feed my livestock for the winter and I only add triple 10 (cheaper) when it was planted . Since this is not a hybird I will have my own seed this year . The local farmers (big guys) aveaged about 150 bu per acre but I don't raise it to sell and I used 0 cemicals . I plowed it 2 time then let the weeds grow with it . I would never get the weather right to plow once a week and I will not spray period . What are you getting now with the OP ?

[DaleK]

If you're going to do all that watering and cultivating along with spraying you might as well just buy an acres worth of corn, it'll cost you a whole lot less in the long run. Forget about cultivating it, that'll stop the ground from drying out nearly so bad so you shouldn't need to water it as much if at all. Don't see much anhydrous around here, nobody has any problems growing good corn with plain old urea after starter or UAN if they're set up for liquid like we are.

Farmboy, how many years have you been growing corn in Oklahoma? They grow a bunch of it over around Bixby. But it's sweet corn. Last year was a bad year for gardening around here. I planted my sweet corn in April and never got to till the rows since it kept raining so much. My corn didn't do didly squat last year.

But I've always had purty good luck before. I only plant about a 1/4 acres worth. I prepare the soil and lay rows out. I plant my seeds down inside the furrow rows. When the corn is about a foot high I till in between and throw dirt to the corn burying it up to the first blade leaf. Then when it gets about knee high I till it one more time and throw more dirt to the stalk. Then I leave it along and they do alright on thier own. I get great results doing it this way. Everytime you throw more dirt to the stalk it will bury the lower roots deeper where it will stay moist throughout the summer. The stalk will also send out more roots to feed on the soil each time you do that.

I raise sweet corn, field corn, and hickory corn this way with good results.

[rambler]

I live in the ever too wet area of southern Minnesota, so I probably can't relate well to your dry issues.....

If you go with roundup corn, you should get 2.5 or more acres from a bag - might as well do that, if not the whole 8 acres? It might cross with your open pollinated anyhow.

Roundup will really get rid of your weeds, but you might as well manage it right if you are going to pay for it. Work the field so you have a good seedbed, and don't till it any more, no point to cultivate it, etc.

Spray with glysophate when the corn is quite small, and spray a 2nd time around knee high. Use a quart of product per acre.

This will hammer your weeds hard. Especially the perannual ones, like thistles & deep-rooted things.

If you spend allt hat time tilling & working the ground, the weeds will be underground & not recieve the spray. Glysophate only works on green plants the hour you hit them with spray - it won't do anything at all to seeds, or weeds that are not out of the ground.

I'm sure many will have good reasons to grow or not grow RR corn. That is up to you. If you grow it, make good use of what you are buying - stop cultivating, and _use_ the effects of the spray. It will get a whole lot of nasty deep weeds if you use it right.

--->Paul

[FarmboyBill]

Originally Posted by DaleK

If you're going to do all that watering and cultivating along with spraying you might as well just buy an acres worth of corn, it'll cost you a whole lot less in the long run. Forget about cultivating it, that'll stop the ground from drying out nearly so bad so you shouldn't need to water it as much if at all. Don't see much anhydrous around here, nobody has any problems growing good corn with plain old urea after starter or UAN if they're set up for liquid like we are.

(Plain old Urea after starter or UAN if there set up for liquid) What is urea. Ive heard of it, never knew what it was. What are you calling starter? and whats UAN? if whose set up for liquid?

[DaleK]

Urea is a dry nitrogen fertilizer, spread it with a broadcast spreader. It'll do pretty well the same thing as anhydrous, just a different medium and release time. Starter fertilizer is what you put on with the planter, can be dry or liquid. Ours is liquid. UAN is a liquid nitrogen source, it's a solution of urea and ammonium nitrate. We put ours on with the planter as well but it's often sidedressed into a growing crop. Some put it on separately with the sprayer, or mixed in when spraying, I prefer to get it closer to the crop so we band it in 10" from the row, 3" deep. Just depends how your planter is setup.

[FarmboyBill]

Originally Posted by oldmanriver

Last year I planted Hickery King a white corn of the old days . We had a very dry year record setting and the corn did very well . The stalks were 7 to 9 feet tall and the 3 acres produce about 50 bu per acres . It was enough to feed my livestock for the winter and I only add triple 10 (cheaper) when it was planted . Since this is not a hybird I will have my own seed this year . The local farmers (big guys) aveaged about 150 bu per acre but I don't raise it to sell and I used 0 cemicals . I plowed it 2 time then let the weeds grow with it . I would never get the weather right to plow once a week and I will not spray period . What are you getting now with the OP ?

Year for last I soaked the seed for the first time, and doubled the yield. I got 2 FULL wagon loads, I figure 60bu from 8 acres. Kinda makes your 50 per look sick huh? I dont like too tall stalks as the Oklahoma wind comes roarin down the plains lol. I added 1 ton of what they suggested on my soil sample on the 8. and it had been limed round 10 yrs ago. Even tho I plow it as ive stated. the morning glory on one end, the sunflowers throughout, and the couple of patches of Johnson grass grew as big or bigger than it did. I had 10ft or bigger sunfloweras and Johnson Grass, and the morning glory played heck with the picker, but since it wasnt getting that much business with the corn, it pretty well kept itself clean of the MG

[vicker]

Hickory King.

[EDDIE BUCK]

Just my 2 cents, Do you plant the corn in that bottom land on a ridge? Around here there is a lot of bottom land and flat land too, most corn thats not planted on a ridge will drown 4 years out of 5. Not killing the plants but knocking the yield back to nothing. Also if I was planting corn for grain to feed and sell, I would plant hybred corn. For silage, I would plant an OP variety. Check with some local farmers and find out what and how they plant. Eddie

[FarmboyBill]

Originally Posted by DaleK

Urea is a dry nitrogen fertilizer, spread it with a broadcast spreader. It'll do pretty well the same thing as anhydrous, just a different medium and release time. Starter fertilizer is what you put on with the planter, can be dry or liquid. Ours is liquid. UAN is a liquid nitrogen source, it's a solution of urea and ammonium nitrate. We put ours on with the planter as well but it's often sidedressed into a growing crop. Some put it on separately with the sprayer, or mixed in when spraying, I prefer to get it closer to the crop so we band it in 10" from the row, 3" deep. Just depends how your planter is setup.

Rather than run it through the planter fertilizer boxes when I plant the corn? STARTER FERTILIZER? What do I tell the fertilizer man I want if he asks (What are u calling starter fertilizer? My palanter fertilizer setup has the tubes rubber running down and to the side of the corn row. It drops the fert on top, beside or in the row. I wouldnt think hyoud want it in the row in case it would burn the corn when It came up, so I direct it to the side round 3in. How do they sell the UAN?

[haypoint]

What does your soil test say about ph? If you don't get the lime you need the corn can't use the fert. that you provide. In many places where they irrigate, salt residue builds up. Does your soil test mention that? Was it part of the test?
I would think soaking the seeds and then drying them would reduce the vigor of the seed, plus wash off any chemicals that are there to reduce mold, etc.
I'd do the whole thing in RR. As long as you've got the sprayer out, just do it. Are corn borers a problem? You can get RR corn with Bt. to stop corn borers.

[rambler]

From messages on another forum, I'm wondering if you are confusing RR corn & hybred corn. You shouldn't mix RR corn with other corn - you don't get any use of the RR part then, just wasting money.

Hybred corn is a cross of 2 parents with different qualities, and results in a very high yeilding corn - you can't save the seed because the kids come out different than the parents did, won't yield worth a darn. Op corn might yeild 80-120 bu tops, while hybred corn can yield 150-225 bu per acre.

RR corn has been genetically modified to tolerate spraying glysophate (Roundup) weed killer on it. Glysophate kills most anything green it is sprayed on, so it will get rid of grasses & deep rooted broadleaves that are otherwise hard to deal with. It is a hybred seed, and there are laws against saving seed, tho there is no point to trying as it is a hybred.

Lime often lasts 4-6 years per application, so if your soil needs lime, and was last done 10 years ago - you need a good soil test & likely more lime. An ideal soil ph is 6.5, if it is less than 6 you are low, if it is over 7 you get high. It is easy to fix low ph with lime but it takes several months for the lime to work; it is difficult to fix high ph soils like I have.

Corn will use 40-50 actual lbs of P & K each for a good 150+ yield. It will also use about a lb of N per bu of corn produced (depends on what the previous crop was, etc.). So if you are using a 10-10-10 starter fertilizer with your planter, and putting 2000 lbs on 8 acres, you have 250 lb of fert per acre, which is _actually_ 25 lbs of N, 25 lbs of P, and 25 lbs of K per acre applied. That will only support 30-60 bu of corn raised per acre.

Dropping the fert on top of the soil wastes a fair amount of it. It should be placed within the top 3-6 inches of soil - that is where the roots go, that is where it needs to be. Your N will like to gassify itself & float away; the P & K does not move very well in the soil & will just sit there - might be available by next year for your crop then.....

Low ph will make the fertilizer less available to the crop, so part of what you get to the roots isn't working anyhow.

So, your corn is starving for fertilizer.

You need to double your starter fertilizer, and you need to add more N somehow. You can add N before you plant & work it into the soil, or you can sidedress the fert by placing it between the rows after the corn is up with special applicators. Most forms of N should be worked into the soil during or _right_ after application so it binds up with soil particales, or much of it will float away into the air.

Fertilizer nitrogen comes as a gas (NH3 also known as anhydrous amonia), granular, or liquid. End up with a number of different names for it, NH3 is something like 70% nirtogen. Some of the granular starter fertilizers are blended to a 5-17-21 so there is only 5% nitrogen in them - very low.

Many of the liquid formulations are very low salt & can be placed directly on the seed. On the other hand, granular and gas types typically need to be 2 inches or more away from the seed. It is best in any case to get the fertilizer below and to the side of the seed. Most of the roots corn puts out looking for fert are in the top 3-4 inches. They also have a deep tap root looking for water, can find some fert with that one too - but best in that top layer with the fine roots.

You can't possibly put enough on to supply all the N the corn needs with a starter fertilizer with the planter as you are doing. Like I said, a lot of them are only 5-10% N fertilizer. You use these starter fertilizers to help pop up the corn, get it growing well. Most of the P & K can often be put on with these starters, unless you soil is really low.

To get good corn, you will need to use enough of any of these N fertilizers to add 100-120 or so units of actual N. This could mean you are applying 300+ lbs per acre of the N source, to get the 100 lbs you need. This 100 lbs would add about 100 bu of corn per acre, _if_ everything else is right in your soil.

Check the soil ph. Check the soil fertility.

Most likely you need to lime your soil, and you need to add 2-3 times as much fertilizer to make a good corn crop.

I think some manure would do your soil well, from the sounds of it. P & K & micro nutrients would go up, and you would get 1/2 your N or so. It would likely lower your ph a little tho, so you really need to figure out where your soil ph is at. If there is any way to get manure out there, that is your best option from where you are at.

(For those who hate commercial fertilizers and hybred/ gmo crops, the same principles apply to op corn with natural type fertilizers. Same math, you just use different products. Whatever direction a person wants to go.)

Weeds are a big concern on corn - it does _not_ like the shading & competition when it is little. If you let weeds shade corn when it is 4-5 inches tall, the corn trys to outgrow the weeds. This destroys your yields - at this stage of corn growth, it should stop growing upward, & be building it's root system. Without weeds, it looks like the corn has stopped growing for a week or 2. With weeds, it wastes it's reserves growing taller, & never builds a good root system. It will be weeks behind all summer long then, & like I say yield cut in half - even if you get around to killing the weeds later. Too late.


To recap: Your soil is way low on basic fertilizer to grow much more than 75 bu per acre corn. The weed competition is also very badly hurting your yields.

I had the 2nd driest year ever in my life last year, and got 170 bu corn. Dad used to grow 90 bu corn on a good year. I'm still using the same tractors & equipment he did for the most part! Learning how to use fertilizer properly & when & how to control weeds is _very_ important for corn. I'm spending $60 an acre more than dad did, and getting 80+ bu return which is $160-320 more income per acre.

Even on 8 acres, with the high price of seed, fert, and the grain you produce, it's wise to figure out how to do this better, and even spend more per acre to get it right. You could increase your income $3500 on those 8 acres in these high-price years...... And wouldn't it be nice to have to drive the picker real slow because so much corn is going through it instead of weeds........

I hope we are helping, please keep asking questions.

--->Paul