Creating new pasture - how to

[CJ]

We are continuing our search (and it's not going well!) for a small acreage in Pope/Johnson counties of Arkansas. We are looking for around 50 acres of mostly woods for privacy and firewood, but figure we'll need 5-10 of pasture area.

If we end up buying something completely wooded, what are the steps to create pasture? We've always been lucky enough in the past to find land that already had nice pastures on it.

It's not very likely we'll run livestock anymore, but I'm not ruling it out. If we did, it would be sheep or goats, no cattle or horses, and only a handful.

The pasture area would be for an orchard, gardens, bees, chicken area, etc.

We do have a 48 hp compact utility tractor, but I don't know what if anything it can do in the pasture creation process.

Can anyone advise me please? I'd like to be able to estimate the additional cost to the land to create a pasture area if needed.

Thanks!

[Scrounger]

After you clear the land (and remove the stumps), you can either - (1) see what grows, (2) Till the soil and seed, or (3) over seed. If you get any snow, you can "frost seed".
If you aren't planning on baling the hay, or tilling, you don't have to remove the stumps.
If you have a place that has pasture, but it is weedy, mowing a couple times a year, will help get rid of the weeds.

Depending on the size of stumps, be REAL careful pulling them with your tractor.

[CJ]

Sorry, I guess I should emphasize my dumbness a bit more. I know the land would need to be dozed, stumps removed, and eventually seeded. I'm inquiring about the steps between dozing and seeding that need to happen.

What tools are used to remove all the roots, rocks etc? Smooth the dirt out and make it somewhat level? Does it need to be disced, plowed, tilled.... none or all of those?

[Scrounger]

Once you get the stumps, rocks, roots, etc out - a good "grub" rake or "york" rake works great for getting the rocks, etc - you can till it with a disc. After tilling, smooth with a harrow, or even a length of chain-link fence (with weight on it). Then, either drill seed or broadcast it on. Most of the time - depending on the seed and where you are - seeding is done in late summer, early fall (Aug or Sept).

Some roots, rocks, etc will have to be dug out or cut out by hand.

If you broadcast the seed, go over it with the chain-link. This will help cover the seed so it will germinate and not be exposed.

[texican]

The first summer after the "rough cleaning" you'll end up with every tenacious tree root left in the ground resprouting... you'll have to remove these totally, as they'll come back forever... My land was cleared in the 50's. Oaks are still sprouting each year... The only cure is to get a backhoe (I wish) or a shovel and dig up the roots. You'll also have ten zillion weeds attack.

Being around while the timber was being cleared would help... emphasize you want all remnants of the trees removed... some just shear them at ground level and call it cleared... I'd rather spend a little more and have the dozer remove roots and stumps, or have a trackhoe go through and do it right......

Goats would help keep everything down...

Unless you're going to pour lots of money on your pasture... I'd figure you're looking at two seasons to get it the way you want it.

[DamnearaFarm]

We were quoted approximately 3000.00 an acre to convert woodlots into grass pasture. With both of us working six days a week, we didn't have the time to do it ourselves, so we didn't buy the property, lol.

[CJ]

Thank you! That's what I was wanting to know. We don't have a york rake for our tractor, or a disc, but we can certainly pick them up. We would hire out the dozer/stump removal work, and then I could do the rest myself. I just wasn't sure what implements for the tractor we'd need.

If the ground on whatever we buy has decent soil (no all bedrock, LOL) then we may add a backhoe to the tractor. First we have to find the land though.

[clsmith15]

I had some land cleared last spring for $1500 per acre. This included removing all the stumps that he could without taking too much top soil. I cut down the small ones with a handsaw. I had someone come in with a rock rake and tractor. I then took soil samples to the Ag Extension office for a test. They told me that as far as soil amendments go getting the soil ph correct is the most important thing. I then limed the area. Due to extreme drought I could not plant until late this fall. I seeded at the end of November and got a nice stand.

[Maura]

If the land is in woods, maybe there is a reason. Woods are often left because the ground is too poor to bother with, even for pasture.

[CJ]

If it'll grow woods, it'll grow fruit trees, and blackberries, and I intend to garden in raised beds. All of that requires sunshine, so the trees gotta go where I plan to grow

[texican]

Reckon I should have mentioned, that if you weren't interested in a 'hay meadow' type of pasture, you could do like they did in the good ol days... just cut down the trees, leaving high stumps, burning out all of the limbs and underbrush... then letting grass grow amongst the stumps... goats would eat down the sprouts the next summer... and later on, if you want, you could have the stumps pulled (leave the stump high if you're using a dozer, otherwise a trackhoe or backhoe) when money is available.

[rambler]

Time = money.

How fast do you need this to happen? Getting it from trees to bare plantable land nice field in one year is expensive, as others have said.

As Texican says, there are other ways to do this. Take longer, take more hands-on cleanup, but don't cost much. But will take years. You can have some grass (hand or scatter seeding) pretty soon, but it will have stumps & roots scattered through. Critters won't mind, but it won't be a garden or field for years, and little less pasture than a clear field.

--->Paul

[CJ]

I have nothing but time. No hurry to make it happen, but I wanted to have in mind what the dollar amount would be roughly that we'd need to add on to the price of wooded acreage if that's all we find. Thanks for all help!

[HillsideHouse]

You guys are lucky!! Out here it cost us 5k per acre to clear & grade. They mulched everything except 3 HUGE stumps that they put back in the woods. I understand even though the contract says EVERYTHING is removed. They put the 20 foot tall mulch pile in the wrong place, now we have to move it since it's right by the back door & in way of the septic guys. It's so huge in order to move it and save (since time is money!) we have to bring in (rent) the big stuff !!Needless to say we could only afford the 1/2 acre for the drive then the acre for the house. This is in disbute since our measurement equal LESS then 3/4 of an acre (for house). Might be piddly but when you are paying that much for clearing, it kinda sorta counts!

KAT

[travlnusa]

Originally Posted by texican

Reckon I should have mentioned, that if you weren't interested in a 'hay meadow' type of pasture, you could do like they did in the good ol days... just cut down the trees, leaving high stumps, burning out all of the limbs and underbrush... then letting grass grow amongst the stumps... goats would eat down the sprouts the next summer... and later on, if you want, you could have the stumps pulled (leave the stump high if you're using a dozer, otherwise a trackhoe or backhoe) when money is available.

Without any doubt, this is the way to go. Our pasture was cleared this way many years ago. They left about 15 oaks for shade for the cows. Each year, another tall stump ro two rots off and falls over. If you need hay, save the $1500-5000 an acre in clearing cost and buy what you need.

[Wisconsin Ann]

Had a thought....(not common when I'm this tired, but here goes)

Texican's idea of just cutting down trees, leaving stumps....that gives you the sun you need (assuming you pull stumps in an area large enough for the garden). Goats would, indeed keep down the underbrush. BUT by leaving the stumps you could raise mushrooms on them. AND could use them as stools, tables, etc. AND could cut the shoots that come up every year or two for saplings...either wood for the stove, or making woven fence, etc. roosts for chickens. stuff.

that would save some money and time, if that's going to be an issue.

If you're going to be using the disc/other attachments for the tractor only the once (when you create the area), try contacting neighboring farms to see if they can do it for you, or let you "rent" the machinery. Some of those attachments are pretty expensive to just have sitting around.

[CJ]

While leaving the stumps would save a bundle of money, it would drive me bonkers, both aesthetically and when trying to work around them, planning the garden, putting in the watering system... discing the soil.

Hay we don't need, we won't be turning it into a hayfield, just open pasture. I would want the stumps and roots gone before I started planting a large orchard.

We could start with just 2 or 3 acres, and progress as needed I guess.

[stanb999]

Well you could also contract to have the land logged, trees chipped, and hauled. If your in a truly forested area. Here if you have more than 20 acre's cleared it's less than 1000 an acre. They will remove all the stumps too. This is how it's done here for commercial property. They can make enough between the logging and chipping to offset the costs. If you do it this way you will be shocked by the equipment. They have machines that grab the tree, cut it, Chip it, and blow it into the trailer. I mean 40" dia. Hardwood. All in less than 2 min. It's amazing.

[dheat]

I haven't done it, but what about using pigs? Visit http://journeytoforever.org/farm_pig.html and scroll down to "Raising pigs on soil in Japan". I think author Joel Salatin does this on his farm too. In a nutshell, the pigs clear the land, plow up and fertilize the soil, then they're sold or eaten.

[CJ]

I like the pig idea. It would take a fair amount of them to do 5-10 acres, but we could do a small portion each year, and sell the pigs for meat I suppose.

Lots to think about, again, thank yoiu for the great advice everyone!