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  #1  
Old 10/31/07, 08:30 AM
Gailann Schrader's Avatar
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Chimney alternatives for woodstove...

I had a massive chimney fire (my own fault really) back in March or so... Well, it cracked the liner to where the chimney unusable (the handsome firemen told me so) to use the woodburner again.

Estimate from a chimney place? To "sleeve" the inside? $1800. OR I can put double walled - stainless pipe in as a "kit" from the same people for $700.

My question is this: the chimney is still in good shape - the LINER is cracked/split/damaged (I haven't actually gone up there and looked at it, btw - the handsome firemen told me this). I want to know why I can't put 8" (my woodstove's flange size) black pipe from the woodstove up through the chimney, securing it so it stays in the CENTER of the existing chimney - to minimize the heat from the stove pipe. I've been told the black pipe will rust out and fail almost immediately. My Fisher stove doesn't have a baffle, btw.

It would be much cheaper (my pipes for the water to the house have also failed so I have to come up with at least $1,000 to repair it) and I could get by and have a warm house (my furnace quit YEARS ago so I have few options).

The specs? It's a single-story ranch home. The chimney is in the center of the house (keeps warm), and is a straight shot from the woodstove flange to the top of the chimney.

Thoughts?

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  #2  
Old 10/31/07, 08:45 AM
 
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I think your best bet is going to install a new metal chimney, the $700 price you quoted is about right for a ranch house.

Alternatively, you can put an insulated liner in your old chimney, but I think that'll end up costing just as much. Would save the roof work though.

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  #3  
Old 10/31/07, 08:53 AM
 
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I'D GET A DIFFERENT CONTRACTOR TO GIVE AN ESTIMATE. Sounds plenty high to me.

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  #4  
Old 10/31/07, 10:01 AM
 
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for comparison, a 25' 6" stainless steel flexible insert is around $500, plus installation. If you are having someone do it, $700 sounds like it's in the park; a little high, but in the park.

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  #5  
Old 10/31/07, 10:15 AM
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Not even $500 sitting on the ground. If it's a straight drop in no bends it's pretty brainless to install. $700 installed plus taxes if the contractor is fairly local would be about right on a single storey house. Steeper roofs, bendy runs, 2 storey or if the existing liner needs to be removed first and the price goes up but if you were local to me that's what I would charge. Chimney needs to be swept first make sure that's in the price!!

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  #6  
Old 10/31/07, 10:32 AM
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The handsome firemen actually swept the chimney clean for me after they finally got the fire out...

And I'm thinking the span from top of fireplace insert to top of chimney is no further than 15' (top of fireplace insert is ~2' off the floor. The ceilings are 8' and the attic is approx 4' at the point the chimney goes through the roof. The chimney is then approx 3' tall at best ABOVE the roof .) Soooooo, 6+4+3 = 13'........ sooooo 15' tops.

If I put a candle or light source in the firebox of the stove and look down from the chimney, it's a straight shot down to the candle.

I won't be removing the old chimney, btw.

And what is the benefit of using double walled metal stove pipe in a brick & lined chimney?

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  #7  
Old 10/31/07, 10:39 AM
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I ran regular stove pipe up my chiminey 3 years ago, it has rusted a bit, but is still solid, if I had sealed the top better, there probably wouldn't even be any rust. It cost me around $50. I will probably need to replace it at some point, but for now it is doing the trick. If you don't want to deal with the rust, you may be able to find stainless stove pipe for less than a liner cost.

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Old 10/31/07, 10:43 AM
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I'm only finding one place in town. The "kit" is actually $627 - not $700, sorry. When I told her how HIGH I believe it is? She told me I would need to cut the pipe. And that installation was not "easy" as it took two guys to do it. Don't you just mate up each piece, have a rope tied to a piece of 2x4, lower it down, mate it, and be done? I know that whatever feet of double wall is going to be somewhat heavy, but????

I still think 15' of double walled pipe with strapping to keep it centered wouldn't cost $627 to put together.

5' sections are ~$91 at Menards. Mate-up flange is whatever. Strapping to keep it centered at in the existing chimney & I have an existing chimney cap that is a LARGE chimney cap...

????

Am I missing something?

I guess I'll just pitch a tent and use Sterno to keep warm???

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  #9  
Old 10/31/07, 11:53 AM
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Interesting idea. My chimney is damaged at the top(where it goes through the attic). And the previous owners just knocked part of it down (left the bricks in the attic.) They installed a skylight in the roof. I guess it was the cheapest fix at the time, so I can't blame them.
I REALLY want a wood stove, when the electric goes off our propane furnace doesn't work at all. Not to mention, I just love looking at a woodstove on a cold night.
I haven't gotten an estimate yet, but was wondering what it would cost to rebuild the top of the chimney, and put in a proper stove pipe. The house was originally heated by wood stove using that chimney. It will be quite a while before I save up enough money to tackle that, but I will have a chimney/stove person do the work. I'll do just about any home improvement job, but I left installing the new fuse box to an electrician and I'll leave the stove and chimney to someone with that kind of experience too. Mary.

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  #10  
Old 10/31/07, 12:07 PM
 
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You have a Menards? They sell the flexible liners (special order). I just noticed it when i was in there last week. I think the price for the shorter one (you would need) was $350ish. You can't be that place for prices.

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  #11  
Old 10/31/07, 12:19 PM
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Keep shopping around Frank's price should be easy to find. There isn't a huge difference from 15-25 feet. I'd run a 15 foot flex liner off a shallow pitched ranch by myself if it's a nice straight drop. If I was to use a stainless sectional liner I'd want help. There's no benefit to to runing a double walled pipe, or stove pipe it's probably not to code and could void your insurance.
The price you have for 5 foot sections must be insulated chimney not double walled pipe............ or that's nutz! I'ts high for B or L vent too. (gas or oil venting) You'd want to be sure it's rated for wood burning.

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  #12  
Old 10/31/07, 01:18 PM
 
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I just priced 6" double walled pipe at lowes the other day. $66.00 for a 3 foot section. 66x 5 (3x5=15) = $330. Add a few $$ for a cap and rings for the ceiling and roof and you should come out to around $400 , give or take...
That is if you are planning on doing it yourself.

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  #13  
Old 10/31/07, 01:38 PM
 
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Did the handsome fireman officially tell you not to use the chimney?

I am on our local VFD. Anyone with a chimney fire gets their chimney condemned until they fix whatever deficiencies we find, even if it is just a cleaning.

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  #14  
Old 10/31/07, 02:09 PM
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Oh! I didn't even think about that...

No, the handsome firemen (there were about 12 by the time it was all said and done) just said that the liner was cracked and it shouldn't be used.

I will check it out!

You mean I'm just keeping warm by THINKING of using the woodburner (or thinking of handsome firemen)?

*sigh*

I'll check it out! Thanks!

I'll shine a flashlight down it and see if it's in decent shape or whether it's just cracked at the top.

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  #15  
Old 11/01/07, 03:34 AM
 
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Well, the obvious answer is to use PVC pipe. Much cheaper. And, when you have a second chimney fire, you can see the handsome firemen again.





Sorry, couldn't resist.

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  #16  
Old 11/01/07, 07:08 AM
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Or I can just hang out at the Volunteer Fire Department as a groupie...

There are some REAAAAAL handsome ones...

Mostly too young to be anything but eye-candy...

*sigh*

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  #17  
Old 11/05/07, 09:38 AM
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The chimney has been cleaned properly and I had my first wood fire in the woodburner last night! Warm house again! Yeah!

Turns out that the only broken/cracked liner is the one at the TOP. And it's badly cracked but still intact. My friend told me that even using putty to "re-line" it would be useless. The liner is too intact for the putty to adhere to. He said that I could eventually take a chisel and remove the broken liner and push a new one down to replace it.

It also turns out that the woodburner has NO flange at the top. It's a Fisher with the stove-within-a-stove build. No flange.

AND the chimney that I THOUGHT was straight down to the woodburner? Isn't. It drops 12' 9" to a flat "plate" and then 90's over to a 3-4" slit and then to the woodburner top. ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TO SLEEVE THAT CHIMNEY WITHOUT A CUTTING TORCH AND A JACKHAMMER. What the ???

AND there is no clean out for whatever dumb reason. Sooooooo, we spent HOURS up there cleaning and scraping with a 13' pole duct-taped to a metal floor scraper. My friend said that a mega shop vac would have been ideal.

I at least have an EXCELLENT working knowledge of how the stove works now. AND understand why it took the handsome firemen so long to put out the chimney fire.

Just thought I'd give an update. The flat "plate" seems to extend UNDER the chimney area... AND that a million candle output flashlight can sure illuminate very well, thank you....

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  #18  
Old 11/05/07, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gailann Schrader
I'm only finding one place in town. The "kit" is actually $627 - not $700, sorry. When I told her how HIGH I believe it is? She told me I would need to cut the pipe. And that installation was not "easy" as it took two guys to do it. Don't you just mate up each piece, have a rope tied to a piece of 2x4, lower it down, mate it, and be done? I know that whatever feet of double wall is going to be somewhat heavy, but????

I still think 15' of double walled pipe with strapping to keep it centered wouldn't cost $627 to put together.

5' sections are ~$91 at Menards. Mate-up flange is whatever. Strapping to keep it centered at in the existing chimney & I have an existing chimney cap that is a LARGE chimney cap...

????

Am I missing something?

I guess I'll just pitch a tent and use Sterno to keep warm???
Tractor supply has cheaper double walled stainless pipe (at least here in GA. I priced it at 86.00 per section). They did have some kits too that were made for going through a roof, but that wouldn't work with your situation.

Have you got a neighbor who could put the pipe together for you and help for a few bucks? Why would you have to cut the pipe? Would it matter if the pipe "stuck up" a bit over the top of the chimney as long as the pipe had a chimney cap on it?

Stainless will last longer than regular black pipe and overall, be less hassle. I am switching to stainless double wall next year (but I really, really wish it came painted black..lol. just for aesthetics of it.

I am tired of dealing with the single wall black pipe (and it will rust and you do have to repaint it periodically or it will rust away after a while - course it's cheap to replace, but who wants to crawl into the chimney to do that???).

Just some things to think about.
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Last edited by sidepasser; 11/05/07 at 11:34 AM.
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  #19  
Old 11/05/07, 01:02 PM
Gailann Schrader's Avatar
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Thanks, but there isn't really anyway to put a liner in the chimney without a cutting torch (to remove the old 1/4" metal baffle) and a jackhammer (to make a proper entrance into the chimney...)

I don't know WHO designed the chimney? But it darned sure wasn't a woman or anyone who ever wanted access to clean it out...

Ya just GOTTA make it difficult, don't ya?

I need caffeine and a masseuse...

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  #20  
Old 11/05/07, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew Lindsay
I ran regular stove pipe up my chiminey 3 years ago, it has rusted a bit, but is still solid, if I had sealed the top better, there probably wouldn't even be any rust. It cost me around $50. I will probably need to replace it at some point, but for now it is doing the trick. If you don't want to deal with the rust, you may be able to find stainless stove pipe for less than a liner cost.
Sealing would help with the rust, but condensation is the major culprit on black pipe that's confined.
Thats also why they suggest a double wall SS.
That would be the route I would go.
Liners work, but have to keep an eye on them.
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