Questionable Low Flying Plane???

[YoungOne]

For the last two weeks we have heard (at night) what sounds like a plane fly in, land on the state trust land boardering our property, idle as much as two hours and take off. This was odd but since we couldn't see anything (no lights) I figured I was being paranoid. Today that same sound started up early in the morning so my wife called me up to say that while she was outside listening a small plane (by description I say cessna bush plane) flew over the jouse and cleared the hills on the state trust land by very little. She said when it flew over the house it was so low she could almost make out features on the pilot. When she called me she said as usual the sound had continued for a minute and then lowered to an idle and just sat stationary.

I am trying not to be paranoid but that just screams drugs to me. Any other ideas? Any SAFE ideas on finding out what's up?

The nearest airport is 30 miles.

[Highground]

Get all "camo'd" up and get close enough to take pictures.

[Ruby]

Report it to the DEA.

[texican]

Discourage them from flying low... I did it by 'glassing' with my Redneck Groceries credit card. Saw the pilot a few months after 'glassing' him a few times... Once he found out I was using my RG cc, he turned green, and said he'd stop flying over real low.

Glassing helicopters spraying poisons on right-of-ways will also discourage them from flying over.

Of course, glassing is most probably illegal...

I'm not doing drugs, or anything else illegal... I just hate any dang body looking at my place... I guarandangtee you if I were to walk around their back yard, just a looookin', that they'd be calling the law dogs on me purty danged quick! Besides, I might not be properly dressed in my top hat and tails (or anything) when they fly over.

[Spinner]

I'd be looking up the area on one of the online ariel maps. I looked up my property a few months ago and found a landing field in the woods a few miles from my house. Weird that nothing is anywhere around the area, just a landing field out in the middle of the trees. It's not close enough to bother me, but it was interesting to see from the sky what all is around my area.

[mousebandit]

As someone who lives in an area where there's TONS of pot being grown in the forest around us - DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES GO LOOKING FOR ANYTHING UP IN THE WOODS!! You could easily be shot and ditched and NEVER found - no kidding, I am 100% serious. That kind of stuff happens around here all the time, unfortunately. Locals know to watch for signs of *patches* and avoid them from late summer through early fall (harvest). If you're out in the woods, watch out for trip wires, or other booby-traps (trip wires connected to guns are the trap of choice in our area). There are almost always armed caretakers, and it's very common to have some warning shots fired at you when you're out and about in the woods.

The plane could be a grower, or it could be DEA looking for patches. Hmm, wait - you're in Arizona - so maybe it's transporting stuff coming over the border? I don't know your area very well, so I don't know what the possibilities are. As far as grow operations, it's not likely a grower would land the plane and get out and hang around on a regular basis. They just fly over, drop supplies to the *caretaker* and make one big harvest in Sept.

But, if they're sophisticated enough to be using planes, they're sophisticated enough to off you.

I loathe drugs and druggies, but I'm big on live and let live, especially when the alternatives theaten my continuing heartbeat!!

Seriously, don't mess with drug runners. If the low-flying bothers you, I would maybe red-dot them with a laser scope one night - make sure it's on the pilot's dashboard so he can see it, but not right on HIM, kwim. That's not threatening the product directly, but lets him know he's attracting your attention. They don't want attention. Other than that, the maximum I'd do is call the local sherriff and let him know. (ALthough, if your county is like our county, the local deputies may already know all about the situation, LOL!)


Good luck and stay safe!!!!

Tracey Mouse

[Jim S.]

Oh yeah, Tracey, you got that right! Sigh. It is NOT like it was in the '60s and '70s...people will kill you over pot now, the price has gone up so high. Stupid gubmint. But what can ya say, they make out like bandits confiscating and selling people's stuff when they bust them. So BOTH sides are profiting from the so-called War on Drugs.

They busted a guy growing it in a CAVE in TN a couple years ago. Had the whole big cavern strung with lights, etc. It was the big electric bill at the farmhouse that caused suspicion. Those folks were armed to the teeth. Growers also like to keep pit bulls trained to attack.

The plane could be anything. I'd report it to the sheriff, and let them handle it. If you're real nice, they might tell you what they find out.

There are also FAA regs for minimum altitude over homes.

BTW, "glassing" and "red-dotting" are both federal crimes, and are felonies, I think.

[coalroadcabin]

Could be perfectly innocent, could be drugs, could be guns, could be illegals (heck, it could be Al Queda) Don't try to play detective yourself. You could end up getting hurt or dead. I vote to call the FAA. Tell them what you've observed and leave it at that.

[Michael W. Smith]

"Glassing and red dotting" please do tell what exactly these mean.

I would assume since the air strip is on state lands it certainly shouldn't be an individual.

Surely a call to the FBI, local drug force, or state police should be called in.

[Jim S.]

"Glassing" is using a reflective item to put sun glare up there. It can look from a plane like you are using a scope. Worrisome.

Red-dotting is using a laser pointer to put a red dot on a plane. Also worrisome, as it could be a targeting laser.

I'm sure Congress made both illegal about a year ago.

[Jim S.]

Wow, longer ago than I thought! Here's a 2004 article...

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/31/aircraft.laser/

[AngieM2]

Does it have it's navigational lights on? Can you see the N number on the tail?
and AGL 1500 over populated areas is legal height for a non-airport, landing setting.

Angie

[bbbuddy]

Originally Posted by YoungOne

Today that same sound started up early in the morning so my wife called me up to say that while she was outside listening a small plane (by description I say cessna bush plane) flew over the jouse and cleared the hills on the state trust land by very little. She said when it flew over the house it was so low she could almost make out features on the pilot.

Hey M, as you know we live about 3 miles from you. We have had planes fly over low for the last 3 years, I always thought they were "developers" looking for more land, or ranchers out looking at their cattle. The one this morning flew real low over us and around the valley, like they were "looking" for something.

With all the recent rains, I thought they might be scoping out the riverbottoms for cattle/cars washed away, and how much water is flowing in the rivers.

I never knew they landed over by you! That DOES make me suspicious!...hhmmmm

[YoungOne]

There is a fairly good road on the state trust land and I suspect it uses it but have no evidence.
The big concern is that I suspected a plane but don't know. My wife says it is the exact same sound that we hear at night sometimes. At night (if it is the plane) it is not using lights. This all started about three weeks ago for us when I could have sworn I heard a plane circling but when I went outside it was pitch black with clouds and although I heard something overhead, no lights.

I figure if it happens in the day again We'll get it on video and let the pro's deal with it. My wife is proficient enough with the guns and the dogs let her know if anything comes within about a 1/4 mile of the house, and I mean anything. Yesterday she used a shotshell on a Tarantula that the dogs warned her about almost 200 feet from the house. LOL

[boren]

Wow, the comments on this thread are just scary. Shinning lasers at airplanes has very long jail terms and is just stupid:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6775100/

There are a couple other examples. Interfering with aircraft operations is also very illegal. They have the right to use the airspace above your house.

The nearest airport is probably much closer than 30 miles, and it sounds like you may have one right behind your house. In many states you can land anywhere you like as long as you have the property owners permission. In other states you need to notify the state, and others actually need you to fill out a form. There are many many back country airports out there. Idaho for example is known for them and people fly there for that reason alone.

There's no altitude restriction on landing or departing airplanes. Crop dusting, and other operations also get around this rule.

If you have any questions it sounds like calling the land owner, or trustee would be the first step.

[AJ Williams]

Originally Posted by YoungOne

At night (if it is the plane) it is not using lights. This all started about three weeks ago for us when I could have sworn I heard a plane circling but when I went outside it was pitch black with clouds and although I heard something overhead, no lights.

At night with NO LIGHTS...warning...warning...warning....stay away from the area and call the Authorities. You have some serious law breaking going on. I would call FBI or DEA. Locals may be part of it. Be extremely careful. Most criminal types carry automatic weapons and you don't matter to them.

[boren]

Just to remind people, there are only 3 lights required to operate at night. A green, red and white tail light. They aren't even that powerful. Unlike a commercial airliner that's lit up light a christmas tree GA is not required to be illuminated to the same degree. A landing light is NOT required, nor is a strobe light(s).

The military is allowed to fly lights-out in certain locations. Not all military operations are jets either. Information:

http://www.aopa.org/asf/publications/sa21.pdf

That PDF also has a picture showing a plane flying with just it's position lights.

[UpstateNY]

I am learning to fly. At times I have wondered if the people on the ground are wondering what tht plane is doing up there. I fly lots of circles, do stalls, practice landings, (but use a chosen altitude not dirt) etc. Basically just a lot of manuvers without any direction or purpose other then to practice them. Now, I also do this in an area that has a small airport where other pilots practice and learn. There are also private owners who have built small grass runways for personal use. So I assume that local residents are not surprised or wonder about another plane up there just flying around for no reason.
I used to live near an area that had 1.) airspace designated for aerobatic practice. On the other side 2.) airspace restricted to military test area. So I got to watch to some interesting stuff. Either way I would mention it to the state police (I have found them to be more competent then some of our locals) and ask if they could give you an answer about what they find out. You may have someone who regularly flys that is now your new neighbor. Or you may have drug dealers. Either way best to know. If the cops come back and say you have a new neighbor then go up and say hello, maybe get a ride and take up flying yourself. If it is drug dealers then ask for a reward, use it to buy a plane and then learn to fly lol.
oh one other note. I have often observed that sight and sound of a plane from the ground does not always match the location and movement of the plane. The runway could be farther away then you think. Give the police a direction from your house that you are seeing and hearing the plane (if you have hills like me hearing can be way off echo echo echo). Good luck

[YoungOne]

Originally Posted by UpstateNY

oh one other note. I have often observed that sight and sound of a plane from the ground does not always match the location and movement of the plane. The runway could be farther away then you think. Give the police a direction from your house that you are seeing and hearing the plane (if you have hills like me hearing can be way off echo echo echo). Good luck

That is a very valid point. My dad said the same thing when I talked to him at lunch (he's had his licence for YEARS, LOL). He also said that he doughted they where on the state trust land because we would see the dust from landing and taking off (this is az desert). He said when he did a property fly over in March he thought he saw a small strip next to a cattle tank a few miles north but didn't bother to check it out (he is definately limited in his fly alt). He did offer to rent an Ultra-Light next time he's up here and do some low fly-by's to photograph and check things out.


Thanks for all the comments, I'll go up with him next month some time and get some good photos up the property while I'm at it .

The night thing bugs me but he said that several planes are all but invisible at night from the ground since there running lights are pointed out for air visuals from other planes.
BBBuddy - After hearing my dad talk about the tanks and strip I think you were on the money.

[bbbuddy]

The tank north of you could be the one real close to us, and it does NOT have a landing strip anywhere near it, just a small dirt road that I wouldn't even use for an ultralight.
I don't know of any other tanks around here that would be north of you unless on the other side of the 180.

For those of you from not around here, tank = pond. Manmade.