Chimney sweeping question

[hassette]

This is actually with regard to my sister's house. Her husband frequently builds fires in their fireplace during the colder months. They have owned the house for 8 years and have never had the chimney swept. I told her she needs to have it done before the house burns down but her husband rules the roost and he said it doesn't need it. He claims creosote only comes from burning pine. I've seen him throw all kinds of questionable wood into the fireplace, i.e. painted wood, pressure-treated wood, etc. so I doubt he's limiting his wood burning to non-pine varieties. BTW, he has a masters in chemical engineering

I suspect his resistance to having it done stems from the fact that I suggested it. My last suggestion was that they have their irrigation system drained before winter (a system that came with the house but they weren't going to use). This was when they bought the house. He pooh-poohed me and sometime around Thanksgiving that year all their outside pipes froze and burst.

I would really like some input on this from those of you who have experience with this. The worry about my sister and nieces is keeping me up at night.

Thanks!!

Ellen

[Cabin Fever]

If it is truly an "open fireplace" and not an "airtight" woodburning appliance (woodburning stove, fireplace insert, etc), I would tend to agree with your brother-in-law.

[hassette]

Sorry, I should have been more descriptive. The fireplace is between the living room and kitchen, accessible from both sides and has glass doors. Would that qualify as open?

Thanks for the response.

[Cabin Fever]

Originally Posted by hassette

Sorry, I should have been more descriptive. The fireplace is between the living room and kitchen, accessible from both sides and has glass doors. Would that qualify as open?

Thanks for the response.

Are there air controls on the glass doors?

[uncle Will in In.]

If the fireplace draws ok, that is doesn't put smoke back into the house, it is probably OK.
Any wood smoke will put out creosote if it gets cool in the chimney.

[hassette]

Originally Posted by Cabin Fever

Are there air controls on the glass doors?

No. There are no controls. I don't know if smoke is being drawn into the house but there is a really strong smoky odor and the glass is usually coated in a sticky residue.

[haypoint]

All wood produces creosote. Cooler smoke from damp wood and slow fires produce the most. There can be enough creosote build up to crack the chimney yet still be able to have a good drawing fire. A fireplace tends to burn hotter because there is little control over the fire as you would find in an air-tight stove. You could offer to keep your sister's family photos at your house, so she'd still have them after the fire.

[mowrey1999]

I would agree that if there isnt any smoke coming back into the house it is probably working but it doesnt insure that it is working as efficiently as it could, If your relation is throwing all kinds of wood and material into it I would probably have it cleaned yearly just to make sure it is free of any buildup that may cause a internal fire, I cleaned my neighbors chimney who had installed it 1 year earlier and probably removed about 1 pound of debris out of it and they mainly only burned good hardwood so it does accumulate debris,

[Boss Cooker]

Four words come to mind "Dumber then a box of rocks" All chimneys should be swept and inspected yearly or more depending on usage. He is right pine produces more creosote. All woods produce it. And burning the trash wood is right there with the box of rocks.
Be safe, clean and inspect the flue. And don't burn soft or junk "Painted" wood and oh yes the pressure treated stuff. Hmmm, Isn't that the stuff that has arsenic in it?? All wood out gas while burning. That is what makes the creosote. "Dry seasoned hard wood" Is part of the answer. The other part, Inspect and clean.
Keep this in mind. A lot of homes don't survive a chimney fire. How about the folks in side?
Sorry about the rant. I am a chimney sweep and know what I'm talking about. I love a good safe wood fire in my home. It keeps me warm and saves a few bucks.

[goatlady]

creasote forms as the smoke rises in the chimmy and cools as it rises. Pine burns real hot and fast and in a fire place does not produce much creasote nor in a woodburning stove IF the fire is flaming and hot most of the time. I lived in an area where there was NOTHING but pine to burn for 17 years, cleaned the pipes once a year and they really didn't need it as I burned a HOT fire all the time. Here in AR. I burn primarily oak in an airtight stove and the chimmy gets cleaned twice a year at least and it needs it!

[hassette]

Thank you all for your replies! I have passed the info on to my sister. Hopefully they will either get it swept or stop building fires.

[Terrabus]

me n' me mates will sweep yer chimney for a bowl of hot porridge, ma'am.

[HilltopDaisy]

This reminds me of a real life story. My ex worked for the Fire Dept for 20 years, and he thought he knew it all! He insisted our fireplace and chimney were fine and that I was being silly. Imagine his surprise when the very same Fire Dept showed up with sirens blaring in the middle of the night, because we had a chimney fire. A neighbor had seen the flames and called it in. He looked like a fool. Get this ~ his brother was a professional chimney sweep. Better safe than sorry, I say.

[Cabin Fever]

This issue is kinda like the septic tank pumping issue. Well, I'm gonna tell you that I know several people who have "open fireplaces" in their homes that were probably built back in the 1950s to late 1960s and have never had the chimney's swept....and have had no chimney fire. There may be a thin layer of soot in these chimneys, but no creosote buildup. Creosote build up occurs when you damp down a fire so it burns slowly. A slow burning fire is a cool burning fire. Creosote will form on the inside of chimneys when the smoke is cooler than about 250ºF. With an open fireplace you have no control of airflow. Consequently, the fire burns as hot as possible....the smoke is going to be hot....creosote doesn't precipitate out of hot smoke.

People, when you share your experiences of creosote and chimney fires in this thread, please make sure you inform the reader if your experience is with open fireplaces or with an air-tight woodburning applicance.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

My parents had a open fireplace we used 50+ times a winter for 20 years. We would always inspect it with a flashlight from the top and bottom every season, it never got any more than a thin coat of soot, it never needed cleaning. It did have doors with draft control, but we usually left them open until we went to bed. A big difference from my woodstove that needs it 2x per year, even though it is not an airtight, cannot be dampered down, and I never burn pine. My conclusion is that every wood burning device is different, and no matter what wood you burn you may get creosote, so just check the chimney every month or so while in use and clean as needed. After a while you will get a feel for how often yours needs cleaning and you will be set.

Duh!

[tinknal]

I cleaned chimneys for several years. I never found any kind of accumulation in open fireplace chimneys regardless of the type of wood burned. Generally the amount of creasote deposit depended upon 2 factors. The first was the efficiency of the stove/fireplace. As CF stated, creasote precipitates out of smoke at around 250 degrees (I have heard that it is closer to 240). A stove that burns very efficiently will tend to leave more creasote in the chimney as the smoke is cooler when it leaves the stove. Some of the better free standing fireplaces will also create a good accumulation.

The second factor is the length of the chimney. A longer chimney will have greater accumulations, as there is more cooling going on within the chimney.

I inspected hundreds of conventional fireplace chimneys and never found any kind of accumulation. If you want to inspect your own chimney it is quite simple. Just let the fire burn out during daylight hours and hold a mirror in the flue or cleanout. Angle it so that you can see up the flue. If you see clear straight surfaces all the way up there is no creasote. A thin accumulation of soot is normal and is nothing to worry about. If you notice any kind of constriction (even if it is just in a small section of the chimney), it is time to clean the flue.

[uncle Will in In.]

Tinknal and Cabin Fever get my vote on this subject.

[hassette]

Again, thank you all for your responses. I spoke to my sister this morning and the chimney sweep will be there March 1.

[GREG VT]

If it were me, I'd spend the hundred bucks on a brush and some rods, climb up on the roof and sweep the chimney once a year then fall peacefully asleep next to the warmth of the fire.

[Auric]

Originally Posted by GREG VT

If it were me, I'd spend the hundred bucks on a brush and some rods, climb up on the roof and sweep the chimney once a year then fall peacefully asleep next to the warmth of the fire.

But get off the roof before falling asleep, right? (Sorry, I had to...)