 |
|
11/01/06, 07:01 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 33
|
|
|
mountain lions!!!
Has anyone ever had problems with them and what are some ideas on how to keep them away from the farm. 2 big brown mountain lions were spotted about 1/4 mile from our farm about 3 weeks ago well last night our neighbor lost a calf to the cats. We have goats and cows and now I am worried that they will attack some of our stuff. Last deer season a black panther was spotted near our place and we think that it killed one of our dogs but now we have these 2 cats. Any ideas on how to keep them away? We live in western Arkansas near the Ouachita mountains.
|
11/01/06, 07:09 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,012
|
|
|
Livestock guardian dogs would do the trick. At least 3, maybe more, based on your post. Unfortunately, it may be hard to get 3 trained adult dogs at one time. Until you have trustworthy guardians, I suggest locking your stock up at night & installing electric fence.
Good luck.
|
11/01/06, 07:27 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Washington State
Posts: 4,107
|
|
|
We have been spotting at least one over the past several years here. One summer it was a female and cub(s). So far nothing has been lost to the cats, knock on wood. My sheep are close enough to the house over the winter for me to feel relatively comfortable, but I know over the summer when they weren't here I was pretty nervous.
LGDs do appear to be the best way to deter the cats, but as stated, tough to get trained dogs. If your property is small enough, lighting may help. I've got a couple of small but noisy dogs here that can at least alert me to anything going on outside that's not the norm. I do believe the fluffly one frightened off a cat in the middle of the night (something large, at least, went crashing through the trees, and the cat was spotted twice over the next couple days.)
|
11/01/06, 08:17 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 37
|
|
|
When you say "trained livestock guardian dogs" what kind of training do you mean? Is it more than just the typical homestead watch dog?
|
11/01/06, 08:32 PM
|
 |
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: far north Idaho
Posts: 11,134
|
|
|
We have 2 Great Pyrenees and they needed no training to guard my livestock or property. Most breeders recommend you don't train them...they are bred to guard livestock and in my experience with 3 of them, they do it instinctively.
They also started deterring cougar and bear at about 6 months just by marking their territory and barking. We had huge cougar tracks around our cabin and sheep pasture till we got the boys and they've kept grizzly bears moving on too.
There are several specific breeds that have been developed over hundreds of years to protect livestock. Great Pyrenees, Anatolians, and Maremmas are just a few.
Last edited by LisaInN.Idaho; 11/01/06 at 08:35 PM.
|
11/01/06, 08:35 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: AR
Posts: 146
|
|
|
a couple of great pyrs allowed to grow up with the family and the livestock can be more than enough deterrent for a big cat or two. If the cats decide to jump on the dogs, you need to have the firepower handy to back the dogs up. I have found the pyr to be a wonderful dog
|
11/01/06, 08:39 PM
|
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,278
|
|
|
Just about any barking dog will convince a cat or bear to move on. Nothing special required.
Pete
|
11/01/06, 08:59 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,058
|
|
|
To some dogs are just one more'project' on the homestead and wisely don't take on too much. Dogs need a lot of attention/work/$$$ etc.
I would second the idea of making sure you have good secure night time quarters for all the critters. That solves most problems (except eagles, some coyotes, domestic dogs...)
|
11/01/06, 09:00 PM
|
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: far north Idaho
Posts: 11,134
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by RedneckPete
Just about any barking dog will convince a cat or bear to move on. Nothing special required.
Pete
|
Maybe where you are, but here where we have big predators, other dogs get eaten, and often. Pyrs have a bigger bark and the bulk to back it up. If they went head to head with a cougar or bear, they might well be killed but they'd do some damage along the way. The predators just don't want to bother messing with them. Our house dog's yapping did nothing to deter the predators here. It took the LGD's to do that.
|
11/01/06, 09:11 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 37
|
|
|
What about Mastiffs. My daughter is talking about getting one of them? I've had german shepherds, labs, and other large mixture dogs. There are of cougars around here but we've not had any trouble....yet.
Last edited by MountainRonda; 11/01/06 at 09:21 PM.
|
11/01/06, 09:19 PM
|
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: far north Idaho
Posts: 11,134
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MountainRonda
What about Mastiffs. My daughter is talking about wanting one of them?
|
Well, Tibetan Mastiffs are LGD's. Here is a website about LGD's:
http://www.lgd.org/
|
11/01/06, 09:30 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ozark Mountains
Posts: 130
|
|
|
The best thing you can do is to kill them by gunfire! The Pinerises will do the job but they will not stop them unless you fire on them. There are no Mountian Lions in Arkansas. That is from the Game and Fish comision. They lie to. Kill them and not tell anyone about them. I also live in Arkansas and if one comes around here it will be the last time that it will harrass anybody.
__________________
"Have faith and be of good cheer." God, June 23, 2000
Laugh loud, laugh often
|
11/01/06, 09:48 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Central Washington
Posts: 1,194
|
|
|
Don't feed any other wildlife - it makes them bait for cougars. If you don't have a secure indoor shelter for your goats, at least be sure they are not tied up - that also makes them an easy target. Last year a goat was killed by a cougar at the property next to where we boarded our horses; poor goat was tied to a tree down in a ravine (they were clearing) and it had no escape.
Seems our area is one of not many that not only admits to having cougars in the area, but promotes education as the best way to deal with it.
|
11/01/06, 09:50 PM
|
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: far north Idaho
Posts: 11,134
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Mrs. Vet
The best thing you can do is to kill them by gunfire! The Pinerises will do the job but they will not stop them unless you fire on them. There are no Mountian Lions in Arkansas. That is from the Game and Fish comision. They lie to. Kill them and not tell anyone about them. I also live in Arkansas and if one comes around here it will be the last time that it will harrass anybody.
|
It isn't necessary to kill them if the LGD's can keep them away from your livestock. How exactly do the Pyrenees "do the job" but don't stop them?
Since I actually have Pyrenees and have seen them work at protecting the stock, I would have to disagree with you. We haven't ever had to kill a predator since we got the Pyrs.
|
11/01/06, 10:18 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: No. Illinois
Posts: 1,447
|
|
|
Pyrs, anatolian, kuvaz(sp), komondor...There are LGD's that will keep them away.
|
11/01/06, 10:19 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: SE Oklahoma
Posts: 188
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by mtn_gin
Has anyone ever had problems with them and what are some ideas on how to keep them away from the farm. 2 big brown mountain lions were spotted about 1/4 mile from our farm about 3 weeks ago well last night our neighbor lost a calf to the cats. We have goats and cows and now I am worried that they will attack some of our stuff. Last deer season a black panther was spotted near our place and we think that it killed one of our dogs but now we have these 2 cats. Any ideas on how to keep them away? We live in western Arkansas near the Ouachita mountains.
|
There have also been mountain lions reported in central Oklahoma (northern Pottawatomie Co, ~30 miles east of OKC)..... killing cows & calves. I came across an article on it recently (various sightings, numerous reported stock losses, & one rancher who anonymously admitted that he'd trapped & shot 2 regular mountain lions plus just shot a black panther.... all last winter).
Get some large dogs... they needn't be "trained guard or attack" dogs. Anything that'll bark loud & fiercely enough WILL scare off a panther nine times out of ten or better..... at least if they outnumber it & are big enough that the cat won't consider them snack food. Back in the 19th & early 20th century, mountain lions were typically hunted with just a pack of hound dogs.... sometimes even a pack of medium-large mongrels. The dog pack would pursue & tree the cat in fairly short order (enter a lion hunter with a rifle, exit one big cat). This is what wiped out mountain lions in most of the western United States....
Mind you, if your stock is out in a pasture away from the house, dogs of ANY type won't do much good.
|
11/01/06, 10:24 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Idaho
Posts: 4,124
|
|
|
I don't think they like electric fence, because they never bothered our goats even though we had a lot of lions around. Of course, they could probably just leap right over, but I read somewhere that electric fence is a definite deterrent, and that seems to have held true.
Edited to add: Forgot to add, we didn't have dogs, either....yet I never once lost a goat to a predator. Coons and skunks preyed on the ducks, but the ducks weren't surrounded by electric fence.
Last edited by chamoisee; 11/01/06 at 10:28 PM.
|
11/01/06, 11:25 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 395
|
|
Well, my flock of sheep is in a pasture well away from the house, we have mt. lions around here, & my pair of Anatolians keeps them away. The neighbor down the road has a huge flock of llamas (over 100) & runs a pair of Pyrenees w/them. Some friends just had coyotes carry off their house dog, & so they went & got a young adult Anatolian from a shelter to protect their goats & future pets. Here's more info on how LGDs are different from other sorts of dogs & what breeds are LGDs http://lgd.org/ and here's info on where to find adult Anatolians & Anatolian X Pyrs (even an Anatolian x Komondor) http://www.nasrn.org/
Mess with my sheep - I dare you!
|
11/01/06, 11:55 PM
|
|
Dutch Highlands Farm
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Along the Stillaquamish, Washington
Posts: 1,642
|
|
|
Had a friend who lived about 3 miles from us who had a couple of sheep taken by a cougar with two cubs. He got a Highland cow to stay with the sheep. A couple of days after he got her he found her with blood on a horn, a scratch across her muzzle and and a trail of blood leading off into the woods. He has never had a problem with cats (or coyotes) in the four years since. Dogs aren't the only solution.
__________________
If angels existed, they'd probably be considered big game. (Don Swain)
Home schooling.........not just for scary religious people anymore. Buffy
|
11/02/06, 04:45 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,012
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MountainRonda
When you say "trained livestock guardian dogs" what kind of training do you mean? Is it more than just the typical homestead watch dog?
|
When I say training it is not in the normal sense. Well Guided may be a better word. Guided not to chase stock, guided not to roam, etc. Guarding is for the most part instinct. Many times throwing a lgd in with stock and just leaving them has a poor outcome and guidance is needed, whether it be from the owner or an older dog.
I've read many posts of new lgd owners frustrated because their pups chase livestock, fowl, they roam, ect. Not all lgd's do this, but it does happen for various reasons (for instance boredom if you have a solo puppy). Owner frustration, time, and of understanding the independance of the breed lead to rescue dogs in some cases.
We've had typical homestead dogs who did well, others that did not. Yes they protected the property, but not necessarily the stock. Lgd's will protect the stock, 24/7. In this case the purpose is to protect the stock, hence the suggestion of lgd's.
Undeniably so some lgd's need no training(guidance), as I'm sure some will post their experiences. My point is oftentimes it is needed, and a new owner should be forewarned.
HF
added line: This summer we introduced some baby ducks. After introductions they accepted the ducklings without question. Later, we introduced some adult ducks. For some reason, our lgd's for whatever reason thought these older ducks belonged in the water & were not allowed out to graze & mingle with the baby's. We had to train (guide) our dogs that the older ducks belonged & were a part of our farm.
Last edited by HappyFarmer; 11/02/06 at 04:54 AM.
Reason: Added line
|
| Thread Tools |
|
|
| Rate This Thread |
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:48 AM.
|
|
