What would you do?

[famer_manda]

We currently own 2.24 acres out in the country but someone is developing a subdivision around us on three sides. The front side is the road. Then there is a lot to the east.. to our west runs the road for the subdivision with lots on the other side of that road. And behind us is a lot. So in a way we are surrounded.

We dont have a whole lot of land but with some good fencing, we can make due. The land around us is for sale currently BUT, it has "no farm animals" restrictions on the properties so they are not of interest to us. I would not buy land if I could not plop a chicken coop or a couple of animals on it :P Plus the land that touches us, neither of them are really profitable for animals. One has a really high water table and its a mess. The other one, half of the land is a pond. Just not something we want. But someone might and we take into consideration that maybe one day we might have neighbors.

But to be honest, I am not in favor of having neighbors. The subdivision had plans but didn't even have a road when we bought our property 6 years ago. We regret not looking ahead far enough but we also didn't think much when we built our house.

So anyways here is the situation. Being that I know that the land around us has "no farm animals" restrictions among a bunch of other tight restrictions to "insure quality throughout" , I am wondering if i should continue adding animals.

Right now I have ducks, chickens and goats. I am in the process of putting up a pig pen. I have ever right to add as many animals as I want. :P But you see, its my father in laws subdivision and he and I dont get along. I am wondering if my animals are causing a tension between us. If he could, he would toss every animal I have off my property because he thinks our property is preventing people from wanting to build on his lots.

I really love my property. Its small but beautiful. It has character. My husband and I are determined to have our home paid off within 3 years by paying extra on the principal. And after that time, we do need to build additions because well.. we have a big family growing here now. We moved in with 2 kids and currently have 5 with hopes and dreams for more. We could build on additions and we need a garage. Township restrictions prevent us from building a barn because we own less than 2 1/2 acres unless we attach it to the house which isn't going to happen

So here is the question. Would you build on additions, stay here and keep adding animals despite knowing that you are the biggest thorn in your fil's side and maybe, truthfully, you are hindering him selling lots in his subdivision but yet you have a passion and love for animals.

Or would you sell your home and move right away??

Or would you pay off your current home, do lots of research and move onto bigger property surrounded by farm land where your animals bother no one?

Or would you just not care and keep on doing things the way you have been doing them and not care about anybody else?

[Dutchie]

I had a similar situation on the east coast. Three acres agri zoned and then development started moving in.

Here are your options:

Keep living the way you do and keep adding animals. The bad news will be that the people who will be moving into the subdivision surounding you will start complaining because they failed to look at the zoning of the properties next door to the one they bought. You can pretty much tell them to go pound sand if you can stand it.

The good news is that your land will becme more valuable and you will eventually be able to sell out to a developer for a tidy sum and ,ove away to some acreage where you will be able to do whatever you please.

Hang in there.

[Dubai Vol]

Seems to me you may be able to make a nice profit on the land when the subdivision is built. As lovely as it is you may end up being able to parley it into something bigger and nicer. On the info you've given, I'd hold tight, maybe put it on the market for a ridiculous sum, and see if anyone bites. You'd be surprised how much that 2.24 acres might be worth to the right person. Dependng on your age, you might consider putting expansion plans-both family and house-on hold for a bit.

Start looking at 10-20 acre parcels in less commercially attractive areas, figure what it would cost to build your dream home on that land, and price yours accordingly. If nobody bites, you can always stay where you are.

In any case, paying off the mortgage early is always a good idea.

Just my not very valuable opinion....

Whatever happens, best of luck!

[okgoatgal2]

hmmmm, let fil buy your house and use the money to buy something in the country.

[sancraft]

Well, you'll probably be grandfathered in to have animals, but your new neighbors will more than likely turn your dream into a nightmare. I'd look into selling and building futher out.

[famer_manda]

My land wasn't bought from my fil so he has never had say in what we have here and he never will. He has had the properties up for sale for about 2-3 years now and he just finally had someone buy a back lot. It is the farthest from our property at the end of the road. The whole subdivision is 2-5 acre lots. 10 of them. I would say its roughly 35-40 acres worth of land. PLus he owns another 40 acres but its not right by us. It is on the other side of of the current subdivision.


My husband told his father to make an offer on our land and he said he didn't want it. I guess if I added pigs and maybe a few less desirables for potentional owners then he would reconsider not considering :P Our land currently is worth about 120K and we only owe 47K on it. We are finishing our basment which I would assume would increase the value? And we are working on our yard to make it more appealing such as putting up retaining walls and making a more solid lawn.

I have been doing a lot of land scaping. Pig manure would help in my ventures to grow grass

We are only in our upper 20's age wise. We planned on putting the addition on hold until the house was paid off. But I would think it would be easier just to start over and take the 130-150K and buy some land with a nice barn or something

But I just dont know. I love it here but yet, the subdivision and the shrinking house keeps me thinking about the future.

[michiganfarmer]

Originally Posted by sancraft

Well, you'll probably be grandfathered in to have animals, but your new neighbors will more than likely turn your dream into a nightmare. I'd look into selling and building futher out.

I tend to agree. Get out if you can get enough money to buy somewhere els.

[Ravenlost]

I'd move. No way will subdivision neighbors let you keep farm animals. They will hassle you to death. Once houses start going up around you that two and a half acres of yours is going to start feeling awful small. Sell your place, move somewhere that better meets your needs and start over. You're young and have plenty of time and energy to do so.

[Jennifer L.]

I would look at this as a family problem as much as a subdivision problem. When your husband offered the land to your FIL and he said he didn't want it, was he actually saying "I don't want you to move away"? How well does your DH get along with FIL? You don't want to put stress on that relationship if you can help it. Family is important.

On the other hand for what you want to do you are on too small a piece of land. And you already said you don't want neighbors. Nice as you've made the place, I think you need to be somewhere else. Does FIL own any other land that you could trade the house and 2 A for? Maybe you could trade your current house for X number of acres and X amount of money, and then he could sell the house you are in now. Just an idea.

Good luck with it!

Jennifer

[famer_manda]

Jennifer,

My husband also works for his dad so he knows we wouldn't go far. They dont have a good relationship though. Its a love hate kind of thing. They love each other but hate to be around each other. We would stay in this area if we were to sell this home.

My fil owns some other land but it is also divided up and being developed into another subdivision. This one allows horses but no other farm animals. I wouldn't want to be under any of his rules anyways. I would love to buy land far from my fil's land and not have any borders connecting to something he owns. In the past he has caused problems for us.

Like ooh back in early May we had a big situation develope. My fil went and planted I believe about 100 small tree sapplings. They are the red pine i believe so not pretty spruces or anything. He dug them up from one property and then planted them along some property lines here on the subdivision bordering our property. From a prior incident we decided that we did not want our water being used to water those trees all summer long. So when I left that day, I shut our water off from downstairs and left for the day and hoped I would avoid any issues with them. I came home and forgot to see if they were still planting the trees and they came right over promptly to get water. He went right to my outside faucet and tried using it. My 8 yr old told him that her daddy said they couldn't have water and we shut it off. He started yelling for me and i hid in my room trying to call my husband.
Well, when I wouldn't come out, he went down into our basement, without asking , and turned the water on himself. He proceeded to take what I figured was about 500 gallons of water and sent his wife in to corner me on the subject. I let it go because I couldn't get ahold of my husband because his cell phone had a bad signal. We just didn't want them using our water for those trees. 500 gallons at a time adds up to be a lot if they wanted to water them all summer long. They draw lines at their resources and we wanted to draw a line on ours in places where we didn't want to just let them do as they please.

Well it only added to problems. My fil doesn't respect the fact we own this property and he has no rights to it at all. When he was putting in the road, he had the company put a big water basin thing in a corner of our property to catch the water when it rained. We made them fill it back in because he didn't have permission and he had to have them dig a ditch instead. He will drive on our property to access his property like if he is cutting down wood and wants to get his trailer closer to fill it up.

But he will honestly scream at my husband if my husbands tires touch his grass. So its a lot of family issues with this whole situation. You are right in that. It isn't just about the animal issues but family as well. But I do feel the animals are adding to it. But I honestly will not stop getting animals just because he is mad. He can buy our property if he wants. Then we will find an area where the neighbors have animals and we will fit in LOL. No one else has farm animals within a mile except for the pig farm down the road a bit.. maybe quarter of a mile. Its mostly just people who own dogs and otherwise its orchards. I would feel more at home among chicken people or cows. Some place where my animals would be welcome. I dont feel they are welcome here plus I want more room to expand. Maybe a large fenced pasture. :P

[famer_manda]

Oh and we also had problems with his brothers coming into our yard and removing tools from our garage. At one point my husband did have tools of his dads so they said they were just retrieving some of the dads tools. So we didn't feel we could say much but we should have. My husband no longer has any of his tools but his brother still came over around MEmorial Day weekend and went into our garage (a tent type thing without any locking doors) and took out stuff that he probably thought was his dads and put them in the work truck. My husband found them 2 weeks later but hasn't been able to confront his brother. His brother took off for 18 month thing where he is teaching English in China. But I just think, if we didn't live here, i would have kept an eye if I saw him in the area. But being that he could be in the area and have a reaosn to be there, I didn't pay attention and as a result, he stole stuff from our garage.

his family dont repect our rights... and i would think if we moved away, that might improve and if it didnt, at least we could have a garage we could lock and they would have no business in the area unless they were visiting us which is something they dont tend to do anyways

[Jen H]

Maybe it's just my innate temper, but if any family member just barged onto my property and started helping themselves to my things without my permission, they'd be kicked out and the locks would be changed. If they continually drove onto my property without my permission, I'd be flattening tires and confiscating car keys. I love my in-laws, siblings, and parents - but there's a respect that has to go along with being on my property.

I'd probably start looking for different property to buy. Even if your animals are included in the zoning, those new neighbors are going to start bringing nuisance suits against you. They'll be calling the county and coming to your door demanding that you keep the animals quiet, that you stop them from smelling bad, etc. Of course, my ornery side would have me buying the loudest, smelliest animals I could think of until I found a different property...

[goatlady]

Based on your last 2 posts you really should consider selling your current property. The other comments on the subdivision folks complaining about your animals will be true and it will cost you time and $$ proving your rights. don't futz around, just list the property, sell for a decent price, get more land elsewhere, and have a nice life.

[Pink_Carnation]

Move.....as fast as you can.

Things are not going to get better. The other thing would be to put up no tresspassing signs and call the cops on them. That will create issues in the family which isn't a good thing.

If you stay the people who buy the other houses can complain and sue over the animals, doesn't mean they will win but it is a hassle. Your in-laws will continue to use your place and stuff until they have no reason to be there.

If you move to somewhere they don't have anything to "do" around there they shouldn't show up much, I wouldn't borrow anything from them. You might be able to get a place with more space and zoning to allow for a barn etc.

[famer_manda]

Originally Posted by Jen H

Of course, my ornery side would have me buying the loudest, smelliest animals I could think of until I found a different property...

hence my desire for pigs lol

[famer_manda]

Well I guess I was hoping that buying smelly animals would keep people from moving there in the first place and then I wouldn't have any neighbors causing problems LOL

But alas, now I am getting a neighbor and thus far, he hasn't been trouble but he also hasn't moved in yet. He is still building. We have two dead trucks in the front part of our yard. They aren't full trucks. One is just a shell and one is just the front end and the under carriage. Both are gutted though.

My FIL "warned" my husband that we would be receiving a letter from the township supervisor that having junk trucks on our property is against the township ordinances. He said he saw the letter himself that would be sent out to area residents. But that was nearly a month ago and we never received any letter from our supervisor. I think my fil was just trying to get us "Scared" so we would take care of the truck parts. It might have worked if we were scared LOL. But the supervisor is a neighbor so he could easily have walked over here if there was actually a problem.

I think we have enough problems with my fil. I can't imagine dealing with idiots I dont even know

[Freeholder]

Originally Posted by michiganfarmer

I tend to agree. Get out if you can get enough money to buy somewhere els.

I agree, too. You are still young enough to start over and build your dream place somewhere else. Having 'no-animals' neighbors will make your lives a living hell in short order, and for your husband's sake it would be nice to be on better terms with your FIL, too. It sounds like right now (if you can sell BEFORE the real estate crash really gets going), you have enough equity to do something. So now would be the time, if you are going to do it. The only thing I would add is to pay cash for your next place, even if you have to live in a tent or a travel trailer or a ratty old MH for a while, until you can build a new house (for cash as you go).

Kathleen

[famer_manda]

Kathleen

I was thinking of that. I am not adverse to living in something small for a while and save up money like that. I would much rather do that than being a slave to a high mortgage.

I was thinking that a repossed double wide would be nice and cheap. :P

[rwinsouthla]

Originally Posted by famer_manda

Jennifer,

My husband also works for his dad so he knows we wouldn't go far. They dont have a good relationship though. Its a love hate kind of thing. They love each other but hate to be around each other. We would stay in this area if we were to sell this home.

My fil owns some other land but it is also divided up and being developed into another subdivision. This one allows horses but no other farm animals. I wouldn't want to be under any of his rules anyways. I would love to buy land far from my fil's land and not have any borders connecting to something he owns. In the past he has caused problems for us.

Like ooh back in early May we had a big situation develope. My fil went and planted I believe about 100 small tree sapplings. They are the red pine i believe so not pretty spruces or anything. He dug them up from one property and then planted them along some property lines here on the subdivision bordering our property. From a prior incident we decided that we did not want our water being used to water those trees all summer long. So when I left that day, I shut our water off from downstairs and left for the day and hoped I would avoid any issues with them. I came home and forgot to see if they were still planting the trees and they came right over promptly to get water. He went right to my outside faucet and tried using it. My 8 yr old told him that her daddy said they couldn't have water and we shut it off. He started yelling for me and i hid in my room trying to call my husband.
Well, when I wouldn't come out, he went down into our basement, without asking , and turned the water on himself. He proceeded to take what I figured was about 500 gallons of water and sent his wife in to corner me on the subject. I let it go because I couldn't get ahold of my husband because his cell phone had a bad signal. We just didn't want them using our water for those trees. 500 gallons at a time adds up to be a lot if they wanted to water them all summer long. They draw lines at their resources and we wanted to draw a line on ours in places where we didn't want to just let them do as they please.

Well it only added to problems. My fil doesn't respect the fact we own this property and he has no rights to it at all. When he was putting in the road, he had the company put a big water basin thing in a corner of our property to catch the water when it rained. We made them fill it back in because he didn't have permission and he had to have them dig a ditch instead. He will drive on our property to access his property like if he is cutting down wood and wants to get his trailer closer to fill it up.

But he will honestly scream at my husband if my husbands tires touch his grass. So its a lot of family issues with this whole situation. You are right in that. It isn't just about the animal issues but family as well. But I do feel the animals are adding to it. But I honestly will not stop getting animals just because he is mad. He can buy our property if he wants. Then we will find an area where the neighbors have animals and we will fit in LOL. No one else has farm animals within a mile except for the pig farm down the road a bit.. maybe quarter of a mile. Its mostly just people who own dogs and otherwise its orchards. I would feel more at home among chicken people or cows. Some place where my animals would be welcome. I dont feel they are welcome here plus I want more room to expand. Maybe a large fenced pasture. :P

All of this crap???? You betcha I'd be moving. Let FIL be a jerk without you and your kids present. Also sounds like your DH needs to have a talk with FIL. Settle the old fart down. FIL definitely has a control issue.

[famer_manda]

We had a talk with him about .. well a week after the water incident so about Mid May. We just asked that he respected our property. He was totally angry. He said "fine" in an angry bitter tone and said he would never come onto our property again.. and that my husband cannot even get water for work from their house. (as if 24 oz a day compares to 500 gallons)

He came around a lot less after that. He stuck to his word until he wanted my husband to weld up his church bus's exhaust system. So he did come into our yard twice.. Once to drop it off and once to pick it up. So at the moment its quiet. It was right after this that the topic of the township ordinance came up. I think maybe he said something to the supervisor as a way to try and get us to get rid of the trucks. No one can see them from the main road, you can only see them from his private road and they really aren't an eyesore unless you are the type of person that wants a perfect cute little subdivison.

I am looking around at properties. I think I would rather get land and put something on it so that I know the age and condition of the septic, piping etc. There is some nice older farm homes from the early 1900's but I would worry about termites and the age of everything..