Black Locust tree usage...

thegriffiths · #1 06/15/06, 10:39 PM

I have many black locust trees on our acreage and I am going to use them as the poles for the pole barn.

Do I need to strip the bark? Let them Dry completely?

Is this a bad idea?

Thanks much.

comfortablynumb · #2 06/15/06, 10:53 PM

the dry bark is really good kindling.

locust posts last forever. without the bark.

MELOC · #3 06/15/06, 11:15 PM

c.numb is right. it makes excellent kindling. the wood is awesome for firewood as it has higher btu's than oak and you can burn it greener than most other woods. not recommended for open burning in a fireplace as it sparks.

i asked my brother in law about seasoning posts as i wanted to use some i have let grow for a grape trellis. he told me he never worried about seasoning the posts. he always planted them green. personally, i would season them for several months if i could but if i couldn't i would just go for it.

logs will shrink in width...not so much in length

i am unsure about stripping the bark. when i cut it for firewood, i usually wait for the ones that die and those normally have all of the bark coming right of in sheets. i do not know if the bark will stay tighter if they are cut green or if it will easily peel off when the logs season. if you could find suitable dead locust with the bark coming off, i would not be afraid to use it for the pole barn. it is very tough, very hard stuff. as long as it is solid it should be good.

boonieman · #4 06/15/06, 11:22 PM

Black locust is an awesome wood and you are lucky to have some. They make great fenceposts and last a long time even with ground contact. I do know that it is prone to warp though and I'm not sure how that would come into play on your poles for the barn. I wonder if you could swap some of your locust for some cedar poles? Or sell some of the locust posts and use the money to get some treated poles. We have lots of old barns around here that used cedar for the poles. We have black locust available here so I'm wondering why the old timers didn't use it for the barns. They usually had a reason for everything. At any rate, have fun building the barn. I'm in the planning stages of mine and I already have the cedar poles seasoning. Later!

seedspreader · #5 06/16/06, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thegriffiths

I have many black locust trees on our acreage and I am going to use them as the poles for the pole barn.

Do I need to strip the bark? Let them Dry completely?

Is this a bad idea?

Thanks much.

It's horrible stuff, very dangerous, you cut them, I will come take them off your hands. I mean, because we are friends and all. No, I mean it.

PineRidge · #6 06/16/06, 07:06 AM

lol ZYG, I'll help you haul it away

I don't have any locust on my property so when I was visiting a relative I took some seed pods, and now have about 10 black locust seedlings going. I never thought growing some thorny trees would make me so happy.

Are your locusts big enough to use for poles? Most of the larger trees I see have some sort of wind damage once they get big. But if they are the right size I would use them above anything else that grows around here. I have used them green before, but only for a grape arbor and a small shed. I would try to let them dry for a larger building.

Hey, I just realized your in Charleston, I'm just north of you in Roane Cty, so "howdy" from a neighbor.

Paula · #7 06/16/06, 07:47 AM

I thought the ones with thorns were Honey Locust?

bob clark · #8 06/16/06, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paula

I thought the ones with thorns were Honey Locust?

yes they are . they are still good ,but wow all those thorns

thegriffiths · #9 06/16/06, 09:06 AM

Thanks for all the input everyone.

Zeal Youth Guy ... Its so good you are looking out for my welfare. lol.

Pine Ridge ... Most of my trees are about 4 inches in diameter although I have one section of my woods with sizes between 6 and 8 inches. I am sure I will have thick enough ones. Its good to see a fellow WVian on here.

These are definitely black locust and most of them are straight, no storm damage.

I am going to take a few down today. I have a layout for the barn that is 30 by 30 so its not too huge. I will strip the bark, might put some preservative on the very bottom and then into a hole and filled with cement. I figure I need about 20 poles so this wont take too much.

Its the holes that I dread digging. The ground around here is filled with rocks.

The Griffiths.

vicker · #10 06/17/06, 06:49 PM

The small pole sized trees are better left to grow bigger. the posts will last longer if they are split posts. The heartwood is what lasts the best. Those small trees will be mostly sap wood, with a little heartwood in the middle.
You can get black locust saplingg from the WV State Forrestry Nursery for short money. But, I guess since you have some, you don't need more

They are pretty prolific

MELOC · #11 06/17/06, 06:56 PM

i was kind of wondering about size myself. i was wondering what the minimum pole size would be. most of the ancient locust fence posts on this property are 8-10 inches in diameter.

when part of one of my fields got over-grown i decided to let the locusts mature to post size as they were looking straight. i need to use some asap but they are still a bit small.

the only problem is that they are starting to branch out and that will cause some problems with making posts.

vicker · #12 06/17/06, 07:27 PM

Well, you want your corner posts and other bearing posts to be big and sturdy, but the line posts don't have to be that big. The problem with using too young trees for posts is; you go to all the trouble of cutting the posts, curing them, digging holes or driving them in and fastening the fence on them and using them because they are black locust after all, but they rot in 10 years or so and your fence lays down. I want to build a fence too, but locust on my place is too young. I'm trading work for the right to cut large locust trees from someone else. I wish I could use my own. They're too small.
I would say use the 8-10" trees and leave the smaller for later. when you cut the tree, look at the end and measure the width of the heartwood. That is the size of your post.

silverbackMP · #13 06/17/06, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paula

I thought the ones with thorns were Honey Locust?

In Missouri, the ones with the thorns are called black locust and the ones without are honey locust.

stanb999 · #14 06/18/06, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boonieman

Black locust is an awesome wood and you are lucky to have some. They make great fenceposts and last a long time even with ground contact. I do know that it is prone to warp though and I'm not sure how that would come into play on your poles for the barn. I wonder if you could swap some of your locust for some cedar poles? Or sell some of the locust posts and use the money to get some treated poles. We have lots of old barns around here that used cedar for the poles. We have black locust available here so I'm wondering why the old timers didn't use it for the barns. They usually had a reason for everything. At any rate, have fun building the barn. I'm in the planning stages of mine and I already have the cedar poles seasoning. Later!

I will tell you why they didn't use the black locust for lumber.
It's really just too hard to saw and work. One good size locust will toast your saw blade. also you must predrill and use screws. Nails and spikes will just bend. I used 10inch for the base of my goat shed. I didn't want to use pressure treated in with the goats. But the 60Ds bent after going in only 2 - 3 inches. So I had to drill then spike.

MELOC · #15 06/18/06, 03:10 PM

i think even if they didn't need to mill any lumber for a pole building, the old timers probably used what was most appropriate to the job. if a building is covered and the ground stays dry, i guess you could use many types of poles. they probably needed the locust for fence posts. jmho

Farmer Willy · #16 06/19/06, 04:06 PM

Stan hit it on the head, you let locust season and you got a great post, but it is the devil to drive a nail into, some real tough wood. They did use it in building though, made great pegs to join timbers. Drive them while they're still a little green so they'll flex and you got one tight joint.

Highground · #17 06/19/06, 06:59 PM

We replaced a black locust gate post a few years ago with a steel one. That post was big around as a basketball. Was talking to an old timer (92) a few weeks later and he said he was born on that property and the post was put in when he was about 12 years old.
The part above ground was all full of holes and starting to rot, but the 4 feet below ground was like new.
And locust will wear out a sawblade in short order.

ericjeeper · #18 06/19/06, 08:28 PM

about 25 years ago I cut my dad about 50 locust post for fathers day.. They did not last very long.. He claims you should cut them in the winter when the sap is down..
I just set 30 some post for my vineyard.. These were post My father and I cut about 22 years ago.. sold em to a neighbor who had horses.. he got rid of the horses about ten years ago called dad to see if he wanted to buy em back.. dad said no of course.. He ended up pulling the post giving them back to us.. They have been stacked for many years and they are still solid as stone.
Yes I am going to dread driving staples into them when I do stretch my trellising wire.

skruzich · #19 06/19/06, 08:36 PM

anyone got any seed? i would love to start around 200 of them. I'll just plant seedlings where i want posts in a few years

MELOC · #20 06/19/06, 08:53 PM

skru, i think a planted post will be far better than a rooted tree. unless you let the trees grow forever. the roots will rot away faster than the planted posts.

if you want a hedge/fence consider hawthorn or osage orange with no wire, just the thick hedge. hawtorn has got to be the nastiest stuff known to man.