How are your kid's teeth?

Haecklers · #1 12/03/05, 08:42 AM

I've been reading up on Weston A. Price, a dentist who toured the world in the 1930's looking at the teeth of people eating traditional diets and comparing them to the teeth of people eating commercial foods. He found that the traditional folks had nice wide dental arches with straight teeth and few or no cavities. They also had wider nostrils and fewer health problems (that's an understatement!). I'm wondering how homesteaders compare. So how are your kid's teeth?

Jenn · #2 12/03/05, 09:06 AM

Much better than mine- 1 cavity vs my several even by 12 yo. Is it flouride from water (not here in UK) or in toothpaste which we use better than I did as a kid? Faces not fully developed- won't know if they'll want braces like Dad had or not need them like me- adn I bf one not other supposed to develop faces better.

MaineFarmMom · #3 12/03/05, 09:42 AM

How does diet effect the width of someone's mouth and nostrils? Wouldn't genetics be responsible for that? I'd sooner think the gene pool in areas contributed to this far more than what people ate.

What commercial foods were available then? I never gave any thought to commercial food that many years ago. Now I'm curious.

willow_girl · #4 12/03/05, 09:53 AM

Quote:

"Holistic Dentistry": A Brief Overview
Stephen Barrett, M.D.
William T. Jarvis, Ph.D.
A significant number of dentists have gone overboard in espousing pseudoscientific theories, particularly in the area of nutrition. "Holistic dentists" typically claim that disease can be prevented by maintaining "optimum" overall health or "wellness." In the dental office, this usually involves recommendations for expensive dietary supplements, a plastic bite appliance, and unnecessary replacement of amalgam fillings. John E. Dodes, D.D.S., an expert on dental quackery, has remarked that "wellness" is "something for which quacks can get paid when there is nothing wrong with the patient.

Historical Perspective
Much of "holistic dentistry" is rooted in the activities of Weston A. Price, D.D.S. (1870-1948), a dentist who maintained that sugar causes not only tooth decay but physical, mental, moral, and social decay as well. Price made a whirlwind tour of primitive areas, examined the natives superficially, and jumped to simplistic conclusions. While extolling their health, he ignored their short life expectancy and high rates of infant mortality, endemic diseases, and malnutrition. While praising their diets for not producing cavities, he ignored the fact that malnourished people don't usually get many cavities.

Price knew that when primitive people were exposed to "modern" civilization they developed dental trouble and higher rates of various diseases, but he failed to realize why. Most were used to "feast or famine" eating. When large amounts of sweets were suddenly made available, they overindulged. Ignorant of the value of balancing their diets, they also ingested too much fatty and salty food. Their problems were not caused by eating "civilized" food but by abusing it. In addition to dietary excesses, the increased disease rates were due to: (a) exposure to unfamiliar germs, to which they were not resistant; (b) the drastic change in their way of life as they gave up strenuous physical activities such as hunting; and (c) alcohol abuse.

Price also performed poorly designed studies that led him to conclude that teeth treated with root canal therapy leaked bacteria or bacterial toxins into the body, causing arthritis and many other diseases. This "focal infection" theory led to needless extraction of millions of endodontically treated teeth until well-designed studies, conducted during the 1930s, demonstrated that the theory was not valid.

Melvin Page, D.D.S., one of Price's disciples, coined the phrase "balancing body chemistry" and considered tooth decay an "outstanding example of systemic chemical imbalances." Page ran afoul of the Federal Trade Commission by marketing a mineral supplement with false claims that widespread mineral deficiencies were an underlying cause of goiter, heart trouble, tuberculosis, diabetes, anemia, high and low blood pressure, hardening of the arteries, rheumatism, neuritis, arthritis, kidney and bladder trouble, frequent colds, nervousness, constipation, acidosis, pyorrhea, overweight, underweight, cataracts, and cancer. Page also claimed that milk was "unnatural" and was the underlying cause of colds, sinus infections, colitis, and cancer.

The human body contains many chemicals, ranging from water and simple charged particles (ions) to complex organic molecules. The amounts vary within limits. Some are in solution and others are not. Legitimate medical practitioners may refer to a specific chemical or a balance between a few chemicals that can be measured.
But the idea that "body chemistry" goes in and out of balance is a quack concept.

The Price-Pottenger Nutrition Foundation of La Mesa, California, is the repository for many of Price's manuscripts and photographs. It was founded in 1965 as the Weston Price Memorial Foundation and adopted its current name in 1972. Its newsletter, book catalog, and information service promote food faddism, megavitamin therapy, homeopathy, chelation therapy, and many other dubious practices.

http://www.quackwatch.org/01Quackery...isticdent.html

TnAndy · #5 12/03/05, 10:36 AM

I got kids ??????? Wow....and after all these childless years.......

ahahahahahaaaaa

sullen · #6 12/03/05, 10:58 AM

Terrible!!!!!
Everytime I look at my ds 9's mouth, I could cry. His teeth are so crooked his head looks crooked. The right eye tooth is behind the front teeth, so he looks lopsided. I keep putting off the dreaded call to the orthodontist, but it's gonna have to happen. There goes finishing the house! No, we will do both, we are just gonna be broke for the rest of our lives. (I got 2 other kids) Ds 7's left eye tooth is behind his front teeth. Now if we could just put them together, and fix only one mouth.....

seedspreader · #7 12/03/05, 11:17 AM

Cavity free, though my daughter (7 yr. old) has crowding on her bottom teeth (like mine... I had a third tooth come up on my bottom row and crowded the rest) Nothing braces won't fix.

Haecklers · #8 12/03/05, 12:58 PM

What Price said in his book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration is that if parents before conception eat lots of healthy fats, like from seafood or grass fed animals (ie milk/butter/cheese) they'll get plenty of the right kind of vitamin A, retinol, that contributes to healthy bones structure and healthy teeth. In the book he said he could stop cavities that had already formed from progressing and fill in the pulpy part of the tooth with hard dentin by feeding the kids the following: cod liver oil, butter from grass fed cows, whole grain rolls, soup made with bone broth, and vegetables. I figured that if anyone was still eating that kind of stuff, it would be homesteaders, as what home farmer pasteurizes his milk for the family??? I have a relative by marriage who grew up on a farm who has perfect teeth and the wide nostrils that Price describes.

He says it's not hereditary, but could be a passed on form of malnutrition that causes the deformed facial features and that if we were all well nourished we'd all have very wide dental arches and wide faces in general. He cited the Alpine Swiss and the Irish who in the '30's still didn't have much contact with the outside world because of their location as examples of what well nourished caucasians would look like.

Another fellow, Pottenger, found in his cat studies that parents who are not well nourished can pass on to their children a need for more of certain vitamins to maintain health than if they were well nourished. So for instance a child of a zinc deficient mother may need 10 times more zinc to stay healthy than a child of a well nourished mother. If that child eats very healthy, his/her child could be born normal. (with normal needs)

Now I live near the Amish in PA but they all have narrow faces and mostly crooked teeth, but then again they use white flour and vegetable shortening and sugar, so I guess they aren't all that well nourished although they do have access to good homegrown food.

When I was pregnant with my daughter we lived in a restaurant area and ate out often (lots of cream and butter in those places) and she had a very beautiful head and so far very good teeth.

romancemelisa · #9 12/04/05, 06:02 AM

my parents have a total of 3 cavities, they were both raise in rural areas, and neither seen a dentist, till my father was in the military. my sister and i have both had upper dentures since we were in our mid 30's, 7 years now. i'll be getting lower once on the 27th., both of my youngsters 12, and 6, have no cavities.

Pony · #10 12/04/05, 06:57 AM

When I was pregnant, I was so darned sick, I could barely eat anything for 3 or 4 months. Lived on salty foods and vitamins. My kids teeth are way better than mine, a couple of cavities over the years (they're 19 and 22 now), but not the horrible dental caries I've dealt with.

Both kids had braces. DS' top teeth were all shifted over 1 space and he had a gap between the two front teeth; also grew new bilateral lower canines toward the end of orthodontia, so he had oral surgery to remove those. DD was a thumbsucker, so had VERY protruding front teeth. She is very careful to wear her retainer, and her teeth still look mighty nice. She had to have her wisdom teeth removed.

I'm curious about this root canal thing, as I"ve had a few in my time. So far, no arthritis, so what's the deal about that?

Pony!

lynpea · #11 12/04/05, 08:01 AM

Our kids (27, 23, 16) have always had "whole foods" and we are vegetarian. The last one has been eating this way longer than the others. They had very little sugar and NO at the flouride, either in the water, toothpaste or treatments at the dentists. Between the three there are 2 tiny cavities that probably did not need to be filled. Two of them have had braces. I have read some of Price's work and I think that maybe through a couple of generations you might see some changes, but gentically if my hubby has a narrow mouth, then so could some of the kids......

Fourthistles · #12 12/04/05, 02:54 PM

My boys are 15 and 11, with no fillings yet. Dental decay is on the rise in the USA and the culprit is definitely diet, especially soda pop and snacking. It doesn't help that the schools install snack and pop machines. They are prostituting our kids health for economic gain. My kids may have 1 soda per week as a treat on the weekend. The rest of the time they drink water between meals and milk or juice with meals. I have a total of 8 teeth with fillings, none for the last 20 years.

steff bugielski · #13 12/04/05, 03:11 PM

EXCELLENT!!
Yes I am bragging. Both my parents still have all their teeth( both in their 80s). Both myself and my sister needed to have our front teeth pulled because the adult teeth were in and the baby teeth did not want to fall out. Both of my children had the same problem? My sister's kids were the same. Turns out our baby teeth have 1/2" roots. I vote on genetics although we never had soda or junk food. I have one cavity. My children have none. We have always eaten real- whole fresh foods.
Interestingly enough my ex-husband's teeth are terrible. He has already lost a few. Both of his parents were the same. Good thing the good tooth gen was passed down.
I live in Sullivan county NY and we have a joke here-Did you know the toothbrush was invented in Sullivan county- If it were invented anywhere else it would have been called a teethbrush.
Steff

MaineFarmMom · #14 12/04/05, 03:21 PM

sullen, you can probably make payments on the orthodontia. That's what we did for the portion insurance didn't pay for. We started almost four years ago with an appliance to widen DD's mouth (top and bottom) by an inch. She had a very narrow, pinched mouth with very little jaw. Her jaw was so small when she was born she couldn't latch on to nurse. She swallowed a lot of air. She has an appliance now that forced her jaw out, just like we do when we jut out our jaws, but holds it out. The bone down the side of her face into her jaw are lengthening as they grow. She has a chin now!

In April, which will be four years and two months after starting this work, she'll have the current appliance removed and braces put on for 12 to 18 months. Braces are the easy part. She's had drastic work. She had too many teeth for the size of her mouth. It was so bad that she had a tooth growing under her tongue because it had no where else to go. Thanks to all her new space she isn't going to lose any teeth. There's plenty of room now. Total cost: $4,000. I'm not sure how that compares to braces alone but it's a starting point for you. When you spread it out over the amount of time it takes for all the work your son will need it shouldn't be too costly each month.

We started this when she was only eight so that her bones were softer. Orthodontia doesn't have to wait until the last baby tooth falls out in all cases. Good luck!

albionjessica · #15 12/04/05, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaineFarmMom

How does diet effect the width of someone's mouth and nostrils? Wouldn't genetics be responsible for that? I'd sooner think the gene pool in areas contributed to this far more than what people ate.

What commercial foods were available then? I never gave any thought to commercial food that many years ago. Now I'm curious.

Genetics are definitely the culprit for those characteristics, but diet and daily habits would play a role in how many cavities/gingivitis/etc one has.

There really haven't been enough generations and segregation of populations for there to be any significant genetic differences due to diet in humans. We got the teeth and facial features we have from our distant ancestors, not from Coca Cola and Runts.

Carol K · #16 12/04/05, 06:24 PM

17 year old twin boys, never set foot in a dentist office and their teeth look wonderful. They hardly touch any pop, drink lots of milk and water. Mine are not good, so they didn't get them from me.

Carol K

Gayle in KY · #17 12/04/05, 09:15 PM

I just had my kids to the dentist last week. No cavities and their teeth are nice and straight. They probably got the straight teeth from me, but not the cavity-free teeth. I don't think I have one back tooth without a filling.

I was raised on junk food, fast food, and pop. They have very little of those. Most of their food is raised right here, on the farm. I believe cavities are from lifestyle and jaw shape is hereditary.

LisaInN.Idaho · #18 12/05/05, 09:49 AM

My oldest daughter (17) was at the dentist last week and though she takes very good care of her teeth, made gorgeous by orthodontia, he came up with 7(!) cavities and took panoramic x-rays that I specifically asked not be taken. She didn't have any cavities 6 months ago at her last checkup at a different dentist, so I'm a bit suspicious. We're going in for a second opinion. It's SO hard to find a good dentist! He wants $1100.00 dollars for filling these alleged cavities.

Jan Doling · #19 12/05/05, 11:01 AM

The older DD has more cavities than the younger one. The younger DD got braces at 9 and has to clean religiously. The older DD gets her braces in January. Oh, goody, both in braces at once. Sigh, they were both in diapers at the same time, too. I'm obviously not a good organizer!

The braces have done wonders for Shawnee. Her face seems reshaped somehow, and her smile is awesome now. Luckily insurance paid half. The father is supposed to pay 50% of the other half, but I'll never see a penny of it, I know.

Haecklers · #20 12/05/05, 01:04 PM

Hey Lisa in Idaho,

I went to a dentist years ago who said I had a cavity and pressured me to get it filled. I had no insurance and said I wanted to wait. Of course he said if I waited it would get worse and get painful. Actually nothing happened, in fact later when I went to a different dentist he found no cavities. Price said they can heal with good nutrition, so I don't know if that's what happened or if it's a scam. The holes don't fill but the soft part inside gets hard and stops the cavity from progressing. That's something he said he saw in several cases where people went from junk food to real food again. It makes me wonder if I should have gotten this last one filled. Hmmm.