Hunter Etiquette re: land owners

DixyDoodle · #1 07/14/11, 01:17 PM

A few friends and I are in disagreement about what the etiquette is in regards to the hunter's responsibilities when it comes to "sharing".

Here's what happened on our property: We've been allowing some acquaintances of ours to use our 90 acres to hunt on every autumn, for deer. What initially was his dad and himself has turned into a group of maybe 6 people. Not a big problem really, except I'm not really keen on the fact that sometimes the friend isn't here, and it's just the buddies, but I can live with that for a week, if it means vension in the freezer for us.

Every other year they have been hunting here, we have received a piece of the meat, ie, a few steaks, a roast, maybe other delicacies. Every single year, they have bagged at least one deer on our property.

However, this last fall, even though they bagged yet another deer here, they did not share this with us. I say that as the landowner, we should receive at least a few steaks. I mean, I understand that there are several hunters that have to share the prize, but in all honesty, they would not have bagged it at all, if not for access to our land. I don't expect half the deer or anything.

A friend of ours says, no, the hunters come first, and we get some if there is any left over. He says the hunters did all the work and it was their ammo, time, etc. We should only get a share if there is a reasonable amount of meat for everyone......keeping in mind, these guys do not just hunt on our land, but others as well during this period, and typically get several deer in all.

I say, no meat, no more hunting here.

I'm not sure if this is an oversight on the acquaintance's part, but at this point (8 months after the hunt), if we were going to get meat, we would have, and if letting hunters be on our land with nothing to show for it but a bunch of ATV tracks and a lack of a week's privacy in our own backyard, then this year I may just let other people use the land.....and this time, it will be a pay-for-use deal.

I think it would be rude to call the guy up and ask if we were going to get any meat, or even hint at it, so what else can we do? I say, lock the gate and let new hunters at it.

Am I being selfish?

DixyDoodle · #2 07/14/11, 01:19 PM

And on that note, if I were to rent the land out for a week to hunters, what would be a reasonable amount? I've seen ads with people saying they will pay $500, but that seems a bit extreme.......and what kind of expectations should I lay out?

Immaculate Sublimity · #3 07/14/11, 01:28 PM

as I see it... hunting private land is a PRIVLEDGE that you GIFT to them- they REALLY should be considerate and reciprocate with either cash or meat. Bringing 'friends' to the party without your express permission is a foolish thing for them to do and you to allow... if one of those friends has an accident, they very well could hold you responsible - stranger things have happened. Firstly I'd put my foot down on the group forays and ABSOLUTELY NOT allow the friends there without your relatives. You need to know who -exactly- is on your land, and when they are there... this means they check in, and out. if they cant manage to follow a few simple rules, they can hunt public land or find some other sucker. tell them flat out - we pay taxes and insurance on the land, we're allowing you to harvest off it. we expect some form of compensation whether it be cash or meat. or lease the hunting land to someone who will pay cash for the privledge of not havingto share with 200 other hunters opening day.

Lada · #4 07/14/11, 01:34 PM

Are you letting the friend use your land because he's your friend, or because you expect something in return?

Answer that question, and you'll have the answer.

Lease the land out for hunting if that is your goal. If that's not your goal, then be generous; accept any offerings, but don't expect them.

mandidawn · #5 07/14/11, 01:38 PM

I would go another route - sit down with the original two people that you gave permission to use the land and tell them what you expect.

If they think you expect meat, they will make sure to give it to you - they may not realize you look forward to it every year.

also lay down a few rules regarding visitors/friends tagging along, whatever you feel comforatble with.

DixyDoodle · #6 07/14/11, 01:41 PM

Lada, we didn't have a contract written in stone, but the gist was, "if you'd let us hunt on your land, we'll share some of the meat with you." I said, that's great.

The second year, the acquaintance introduced me to another friend of his, he asked, "you don't mind if J comes along?" I didn't mind, as a hunting party is a hunting party.....but it seems to have expanded as the years go on. I hate to say no to that, as they are part of a "group", you know?

I can't help but feel like we're being taken advantage of a bit. I have other people, including family, that would likely be able to use the land (they are not serious hunters though) and like I said, people have posted looking to pay to hunt. I guess given the circumstances, I would rather get a couple hundred bucks for sure, as opposed to maybe meat and maybe not every year.

DixyDoodle · #7 07/14/11, 01:45 PM

Here's the other thing, though, like we were arguing about: should the landowner be "last on the list" to receive meat.....or should the hunters take a smaller portion each to assure that the landowner also gets some?

I'm thinking that maybe a lot of the time, they will "not have a lot" and we will be left getting nothing each time, but they will continue to stock their freezers. They seem to pull a deer or two out of our fields every year, all the same.........

Ravenlost · #8 07/14/11, 01:46 PM

You are being taken advantage of and not just a little bit! The minute his friends started showing up would have been the last time any of them set foot on my property to hunt.

We don't let people hunt our property, even relatives. To many problems.

Becka03 · #9 07/14/11, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Immaculate Sublimity

as I see it... hunting private land is a PRIVLEDGE that you GIFT to them- they REALLY should be considerate and reciprocate with either cash or meat. Bringing 'friends' to the party without your express permission is a foolish thing for them to do and you to allow... if one of those friends has an accident, they very well could hold you responsible - stranger things have happened. Firstly I'd put my foot down on the group forays and ABSOLUTELY NOT allow the friends there without your relatives. You need to know who -exactly- is on your land, and when they are there... this means they check in, and out. if they cant manage to follow a few simple rules, they can hunt public land or find some other sucker. tell them flat out - we pay taxes and insurance on the land, we're allowing you to harvest off it. we expect some form of compensation whether it be cash or meat. or lease the hunting land to someone who will pay cash for the privledge of not havingto share with 200 other hunters opening day.

Totally Agree

GoldenCityMuse · #10 07/14/11, 01:52 PM

There is nothing rude in talking to your friends about what is happening. Communication is the best way to prevent broken friendships.

It is hard to do, talking about something, but it is better in the long run.

Have a heart to heart talk, because it IS your land, you pay the taxes on it. No doubt you could be sued if one of the friends hurts himslef on it while hunting.

Lada · #11 07/14/11, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DixyDoodle

Here's the other thing, though, like we were arguing about: should the landowner be "last on the list" to receive meat.....or should the hunters take a smaller portion each to assure that the landowner also gets some?

I'm thinking that maybe a lot of the time, they will "not have a lot" and we will be left getting nothing each time, but they will continue to stock their freezers. They seem to pull a deer or two out of our fields every year, all the same.........

I think you'd be further ahead to just start charging them to hunt there.

If you expect meat, you are at the mercy of whether or not they get any for themselves. Unless they are just sport/trophy hunters, they're not going to want to spend all the time/ammo/etc. getting a deer just to have to split the dang thing 8 ways. So, I guess I agree with your friend. It would seem that the appropriate thing to do is to have something set out before the season starts. Say...you and your dad can hunt here, but I want 1/4 of the meat you get, or I want 1/4 of a deer, period and if you bag any more than that then you can have them.

If they feel that you are allowing them to hunt there as a favor, then they are not "required" to pay you anything. Yes it would be nice, and if they have extras then they will, but if they don't have extras then they don't feel they have to give you any.

bluemoonluck · #12 07/14/11, 01:55 PM

Well, here's my two cents....

If I were you, I'd research and write up a "waiver of liability" contract to present to the friend you initially told could hunt your land. That waiver should state in no uncertain terms that:
1) You are not responsible for any injuries to anyone that are incurred while they are hunting your land.
2) You are expressly giving permission for (Friend's name) to hunt the land. If (friend's name) chooses to bring other hunters with him, then (Friend's name) will be solely responsible for any injuries/etc to the members of the hunting party that he invited along.
3) (Friend's name) will be physically present each and every time any member of his hunting party is on your property. Violations will be subject to a $500 fine per occurrance.
4) The cost for (friend's name) to hunt your land shall be either $300 per season or ___ pounds/cuts of meat from each deer harvested from your land. Amount to be paid by X date.

I think everything needs to be spelled out very clearly in writing, both to cover yourself and to make all the expectations for both parties crystal clear.

Tracy Rimmer · #13 07/14/11, 02:26 PM

Call the friend and tell them that, times being what they are, you need to start charging for the use of the use of the land.

Then, do so (from him, if he agrees, or with someone else willing to pay), with a contract and injury waiver and all nice and legal-like.

Use the fee to buy meat for your freezer.

Gregg Alexander · #14 07/14/11, 02:34 PM

You need to have a contract for liability purpose's . Bluemoonluck has it on the right track. The friend is taking advantage of the free land to hunt on and bring his friends. I don't know the country that your land looks like but 90 ac is getting crowded for that many hunters. I own 260ac of pasture and timber land , rent another 125 ac that joins me on 3 sides. There are no more than my self and 2 other guys that hunt on my land and lease, that works out to around 127 ac per hunter. They help put in greenfields, shooting houses ect. I have had these same friends hunting here for over 25 yrs. We always know where the other is and neither comes hunting with out calling me and letting me know. They are not allowed to bring a guest that gets into a stand other than the one they are hunting out of.
Again you need to protect your self , and don't worry about hurting their feelings.

Eyes Wide Open · #15 07/14/11, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lada

If you expect meat, you are at the mercy of whether or not they get any for themselves. Unless they are just sport/trophy hunters, they're not going to want to spend all the time/ammo/etc. getting a deer just to have to split the dang thing 8 ways.

Yeah, but it's only the OP's generosity that we're talking about splitting anything 8 ways. The OP originally only granted permission to one friend. Then a second.

It's not the OP's problem that they brought the whole dang town to hunt and only bagged one deer.

I think friendship is about give and take. If a friend was only taking, I'd take steps to protect myself. Either making it clear that I expect some give too, or letting the friendship drift away. I don't think it's fair to say that the OP has some selfish motives for granting use of the land, yet feeling miffed when it became an "all give and no receive" scenario.

pheasantplucker · #16 07/14/11, 02:37 PM

I don't know what state you're in but in Ohio...it isn't necessary to have them waive liability in the event of an accident, etc. Ohio land owners who grant written permission for others to hunt are not responsible for damages or injuries. As a hunter, who formerly had to ask permission to hunt, the hunters need to be the ones who go out of their way to express their gratitude to you. Not only should they share in the venison, but IMO they should be helping to come out a few times in the summer to help you with chores such as fixing fences, splitting firewood, digging holes, etc. Your giving them the privilege of hunting on your property is something they must be coming to taking for granted. I would also limit the number of their guests. In reading your post, I am embarrassed that fellow hunters should be so self serving. I'd tell them straight up, they need to share game 60/40 and limit guests to x number. Also, I'd be interested in meeting and talking with prospective "guests" to see that they had licenses etc. If they don't agree to sharing the venison, then I'd tell them, that they can hunt for $50 per hunter per day. Good luck.

ChickadeeL · #17 07/14/11, 02:43 PM

I agree with the liability waiver. I also think you are being taken extreme advantage of.

The hunters have it all backwards. Let them find another place to hunt and save yourself the possible potential lawsuit and aggravation.

7thswan · #18 07/14/11, 03:03 PM

No Way, I'd boot these Rude people,acting like THEY are doing you a Favor

. You are asking for trouble with these kinds of folks.

OkieDavid · #19 07/14/11, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pheasantplucker

Ohio land owners who grant written permission for others to hunt are not responsible for damages or injuries.

Same thing in Oklahoma except our state went one step farther and included the statement "with or without the landowners consent" so even someone poaching is prevented from bringing suit. Regarding the OP- sad you have to even ask the question. Around here, offering a portion of the dressed game (any game/fish/fowl) is considered standard fare for permission to hunt/fish. I was also raised to trade out a day of work for a day of hunting.... We would help work cattle, build fence, plant/harvest crops etc. in the off season when the landowner needed help. Guess it's different there. Personally if I felt the need to write up a contract to let someone hunt/fish, I'd want some cash in hand for all the effort.

Michael W. Smith · #20 07/14/11, 03:24 PM

To let a friend hunt on your property isn't being taken advantage of.

But when said "friend" brings another friend along (and probably brings it up when everyone is standing there) "You don't mind if X hunts, right?" And then some more friends join them - now you ARE being taken advantage of!

I'm going through a similiar situation. I have a 132 acre farm and several church friends hunt there. Not a problem because most of the time, they are only hunting there for a while and then move on. But some other people asked if they could hunt, and I said "yeah." (Being a farm, I rent the land to another farmer who raises crops, so I hate to refuse hunters because of the farmer's crops getting eaten even more.)

However the "other people" that are hunting are now up to 4 people. My son and myself have taken up hunting and after last year when we hadn't gotten any (and they did) and they mentioned they would get us one (but never did and nor did we get any meat), well it's got to stop. Besides, I heard from the next door neighbor that when deer went running through the field, these people just opened fire on them.

I used to have people sign waivers that they were allowed to hunt on my property, but I was NOT responsible for any accidents or damage. Also, if they didn't keep their garbage cleaned up (wrappers from lunch, etc) they wouldn't be back.

I think at this point, you should tell the friend that due to the economy, you have to charge for the hunting, and if your friend doesn't want to pay, you'll just have to find someone else who will pay. Also, make sure you have signatures that YOU are NOT RESPONSIBLE for any accidents or injuries that occur and state how many people MAXIMUM can hunt.

As for the amount, you'll have to check around and see how much similiar rented land is bringing. It's certainly not going to pay the taxes - nor is a group of 4 hunters going to pay a total of $200.00 to hunt - at least local people. However, you might get a city person to pay.