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  #21  
Old 02/21/15, 01:18 PM
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Volcanoes do not routinely emit that much volume of CO2, but they do emit sulfur dioxide. That is converted in the atmosphere into Sulfuric Acid - that's the killer there...

While sulfur dioxide released in contemporary volcanic eruptions has occasionally caused detectable global cooling of the lower atmosphere, the carbon dioxide released in contemporary volcanic eruptions has never caused detectable global warming of the atmosphere.
...and
The most significant climate impacts from volcanic injections into the stratosphere come from the conversion of sulfur dioxide to sulfuric acid, which condenses rapidly in the stratosphere to form fine sulfate aerosols. The aerosols increase the reflection of radiation from the Sun back into space, cooling the Earth's lower atmosphere or troposphere. Several eruptions during the past century have caused a decline in the average temperature at the Earth's surface of up to half a degree (Fahrenheit scale) for periods of one to three years. The climactic eruption of Mount Pinatubo on June 15, 1991, was one of the largest eruptions of the twentieth century and injected a 20-million ton (metric scale) sulfur dioxide cloud into the stratosphere at an altitude of more than 20 miles. The Pinatubo cloud was the largest sulfur dioxide cloud ever observed in the stratosphere since the beginning of such observations by satellites in 1978. It caused what is believed to be the largest aerosol disturbance of the stratosphere in the twentieth century, though probably smaller than the disturbances from eruptions of Krakatau in 1883 and Tambora in 1815.

More info here:

http://volcanoes.usgs.gov/hazards/gas/climate.php
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  #22  
Old 02/21/15, 01:50 PM
 
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I'l just quote someone else.

Quote:
The abundance of gases varies considerably from volcano to volcano. Water vapor is consistently the most common volcanic gas, normally comprising more than 60% of total emissions. Carbon dioxide typically accounts for 10 to 40% of emissions
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcanic_gas

The particulates and sulfur tend to reduce sunlight, which leads to a SHORT term drop in temps. Although thats not a factor in rising CO2 levels.
Anyway, fossil fuel emissions outweigh the year-to-year volcanic CO2 emissions by a factor of at least a hundred. As in, a HUNDRED times more. Thats some significant chemistry we're adding to the atmosphere year after year after year.
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  #23  
Old 02/21/15, 06:58 PM
 
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Poppycock. Look up the year without a summer. Your hundred-to-one ration pales into insignificance when you add up the periodic volcanic and other natural emissions. Every animal on earth emits carbon dioxide and every plant on earth consumes it. The oceans absorb it as well.

We have had significantly higher levels of CO2 in past epochs and the earth did not dry up and blow away. The hot air that environmentalist radicals are pumping out is mostly CO2 (though there is considerable methane in the mix.)

The one constant on earth is change; get used to it. If either the Dalton or the Maunder minimum comes to us there will be economic pain. Probably less in the US than in Europe.

It would be interesting to know how the climates of the Near and Middle East would be affected by the coming drop in temperatures. The temperature changes might well alter rainfall patterns. The N. African deserts and those of the SW US might turn into farmland.


A 200 year cold spell would mean much of Canada could not grow crops, possibly some of the Northern US as well. Some of the North that experiences winter snow cover now might find itself permanently snowed in.

Our Great Lakes might be frozen over most of the year, or all year. Greenland might have to be abandoned.

Life on earth will be interesting; I'll mention it to the grandkids.
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  #24  
Old 02/21/15, 07:05 PM
 
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Add in forest fires....
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  #25  
Old 02/21/15, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg273 View Post
The higher CO2 levels in the Eocene were caused by weathering and exposure of carbon rocks and outgassing of volcanoes as carbon rocks were subducted and spit out as magma and gas. Again, that is not relevant to the current situation, where volcanoes outgas roughly 300million tons of CO2 into the atmosphere... and humans, through burning of fossil fuels, account for 30 BILLION tons per YEAR. Thats anywhere from 100- 300 times the amount volcanoes are producing.
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Fea...ycle/page2.php
It doesn't matter, Greg. CO2 is insignificant compared to the water vapor in the atmosphere.
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  #26  
Old 02/21/15, 11:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren View Post
It doesn't matter, Greg. CO2 is insignificant compared to the water vapor in the atmosphere.
Co2 is LESS significant, not insignificant. Low-end estimates are the CO2 fraction of greenhouse gasses are responsible from roughly 10-25% of the total greenhouse effect. That is certainly NOT insignificant.
On what basis do you conclude CO2 is meaningless as far as climate goes? THats not what the data shows.
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  #27  
Old 02/21/15, 11:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oxankle View Post
Poppycock. Look up the year without a summer. Your hundred-to-one ration pales into insignificance when you add up the periodic volcanic and other natural emissions. Every animal on earth emits carbon dioxide and every plant on earth consumes it. The oceans absorb it as well.
Nothing I said was 'poppycock'. We are changing the atmosphere in a big way. CO2 levels are going higher than they've been in millions of years, that will certainly have an effect. It has every other time. The benchmark for polar ice caps has historically been around 700-900PPM. No ice caps means Miami goes (slowly) under water. Hey, I'm not even saying that would be a bad thing. Just recognize our actions have consequences.
The record is clear, that all the CO2 in the world, in plants and in the atmosphere, despite the hundreds of thousands of volcanoes that have erupted since then, has stayed relatively steady for the past 800,000 years. We're increasing it rapidly by burning fossil fuels. Period. Has nothing to do with AlGore or any of that nonsense. Just a straight up scientific fact that CO2 is rising, in a large way, DIRECTLY from our actions. And, the record shows CO2 and temp move in tandem, never more than a few hundred years out of synch with each other, and they are positively correlated.
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  #28  
Old 02/21/15, 11:44 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kasilofhome View Post
Add in forest fires....
What about them? All the CO2 released from burning plants was stored there to begin with...all the decaying and burning plants in the world don't add to the net CO2 levels. They can only absorb what is available.
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  #29  
Old 02/22/15, 12:23 AM
 
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Forest fires need to be counted if farts do then forest fires need to too. Nature it's self starts them...long be for man....and even n in today's normality time.

We if you are that worried then let's drill baby drill cause we are going to need heating fuel.
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Last edited by kasilofhome; 02/22/15 at 03:30 AM.
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  #30  
Old 02/22/15, 07:21 AM
 
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Greg; Do you discount entirely the original post, the approach of the solar decline? That report predicts a cooling, not a greenhouse.

The geological record shows that the earth has been both warmer and cooler in the past than today. So what is the big deal?

It seems to me that it would be more important to contain contaminants--trash, harmful chemicals and the like--keep these out of the oceans and the air--than to worry about events that are primarily dependent upon the sun.

If you look at it coldly, people on earth are like mold on an orange. They will slowly cover all the inhabitable surfaces of the globe. At some point this will become an unsustainable expansion and a natural event will stop the progression. People are not mindless; when the inevitable becomes widely, generally, accepted people will take steps to ameliorate the problem----The Chinese and their one-child policy are only a harbinger of this. The old, crude, method is war.
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  #31  
Old 02/22/15, 10:58 AM
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And now for the last 10 years the temps have gone down across the US. And many places in the world as well. This trend is not going to stop any time soon. Temps have gone down not up. No rise in the oceans have happened either. And WHERE are all these horrible hurricanes?
For a few years now they have been pretty much at bay. In fact some are not even predicting the number of hurricanes any more because so few have been happening throwing their predictions out the window.
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