The job market has certainly changed

Bellyman · #41 11/19/14, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willow_girl

It's supply and demand. All the young folks want to work with computers nowadays; it's all they know. A "job" is something you do sitting at a desk and staring at a screen.

Gotta find a way to make it work for you. I discovered that in my locale, there is a shortage of housecleaners. No one wants to get their perfectly-manicured, keyboard-ready hands dirty! I can charge $20 a hour for housecleaning, far more than I'd command in an office setting these days. So be it ... I don't miss "office politics" anyway!

Very good point! Often a job no one wants to do is one that pays decently.

Once upon a time, I had a little janitorial business. It wasn't bad. I only worked part time but made a living at it.

Bellyman · #42 11/19/14, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevada

I disagree, because economic bubbles are almost always the result of weak regulation. As we've seen, economic disasters like the great depression and the current recession can result.

But the problem with blaming Obama for a slow recovery is that recovery is dependent on residential real estate prices recovering. Homes in my neighborhood are still about 35% of what they were in 2006. I don't know what the president or congress can do to make that recovery go any faster.

Real estate prices are not going to recover if people don't have the money to spend on mortgage payments. People won't have money to spend on mortgage payments if they can't find jobs or are moving from good paying jobs to lesser paying jobs to try to make ends meet.

The president and congress have plenty of power if they'd just use it wisely. I think we'd be amazed at the difference that could happen if nothing more than enforcing current law happened.

MO_cows · #43 11/19/14, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevada

That's true of taking care of workstations, and even network connectivity to some extent, but server configuration & administration and network troubleshooting is an art of its own. If you need a stable server and network then you need someone who really understands that stuff on a fundamental level.

Yes, the higher levels and engineers who design systems mostly earn every penny they make. But I was remembering the early days of "every business has to go on computer", there was an army of "IT techs" who knew barely more than the "terminal operators". Most people now are more computer savvy than those "techs" were in their day. Ebb and flow.

Yvonne's hubby · #44 11/19/14, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevada

What did you think a recession was going to be like?

Ok, the "recession" is over... the stock market is once again closing at all time record highs. The job market however is quite stagnate. I think we need to look at why that is instead of just hollering "recession". Companies are making big bucks, but they are doing it by utilizing two things... shipping the jobs overseas where labor is cheap, or having robots perform the same tasks here in our own country. Perhaps the unions should entertain those thoughts before they start demanding higher and higher wages and bigger and better bennies. I am quite sure having a job is much better than the high wages and great benefits tied to a job that no longer exists.

big rockpile · #45 11/19/14, 07:52 PM

This is why I feel so sad for my wife. She has went to College for years to better herself, getting into Health Field and Computers. Only to find people not wanting to hire women or wanting younger people.

She is now Semi Retired got into a program where she is working with DHS part time. They was surprised with her knowledge and skill, wanting to work her full time. She is telling me she is Happy part time, she enjoys the work but wants to spend time with me and traveling. I tell her don't do it then.

What is so bad seeing people making so much less than I was 30 years ago.

big rockpile

willow_girl · #46 11/20/14, 08:09 AM

Quote:

My husband has been in the construction field for 15 years and we have been looking for a job for months now. We just cannot wrap our heads around how employers think they can pay 10/hr for 1099 position,

If he's going to be a subcontractor, why not be a contractor? Quit looking for a job, and line up jobs to do instead!

In my own business, I've found that if you do a good job for a reasonable price, your clients will quickly refer you to all of their friends and family, and you'll have more work than you know what to do with. LOL

nostawmama · #47 11/20/14, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willow_girl

If he's going to be a subcontractor, why not be a contractor? Quit looking for a job, and line up jobs to do instead!

In my own business, I've found that if you do a good job for a reasonable price, your clients will quickly refer you to all of their friends and family, and you'll have more work than you know what to do with. LOL

We have done that as well, and my again in the future but in our current case- we just moved to a new state (from de to nc) so the local population doesn't know us. Having a reasonable rate doesn't get us hired over the other contractors that offer to do the work for a pittance because they hire subs on at ridiculously low wages.

There are just too many people out of work nowdays, most employers lean toward hiring uneducated, cheap labor because that is better for the bottom line, at least on a short term basis. Short term is what matters in our instant gratification loving society.

Nevada · #48 11/20/14, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bellyman

Real estate prices are not going to recover if people don't have the money to spend on mortgage payments. People won't have money to spend on mortgage payments if they can't find jobs or are moving from good paying jobs to lesser paying jobs to try to make ends meet.

The president and congress have plenty of power if they'd just use it wisely. I think we'd be amazed at the difference that could happen if nothing more than enforcing current law happened.

Low real estate prices have put banks in a bind. The problem is that they still have a lot of toxic assets on their books. They've been handed enough money by the Fed to show that they're solvent, but that money has to be paid back as real estate prices rise. The bottom line is that banks aren't in a mood to lend, and they won't be in a mood to lent until those toxic assets aren't toxic any longer.

But bank lending is at the center of this recovery. People can't buy the things they need (new homes, cars, and refrigerators) without being able to finance them. As a consequence they rent homes, repair their old cars, and buy used refrigerators. In other words, without financing there is no consumer demand. We'll stay in recession until banks start lending again.

So you see, the recovery is all about residential real estate prices, and there's not a lot the government can do about that.

But the government can do a lot to make the recession more comfortable for Americans. Those at the bottom get help with food and housing. Many businesses stay afloat from public works projects. Those kinds of things can keep the economy from completely stalling.

Yvonne's hubby · #49 11/20/14, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nostawmama

My husband has been in the construction field for 15 years and we have been looking for a job for months now. We just cannot wrap our heads around how employers think they can pay 10/hr for 1099 position, and they don't provide tools, equipment, tool trailer, and insurance! We would LOOSE money taking that kind of job!

When I was doing construction the highest wage I ever got was 8 bucks an hour, but I stayed busy, and seldom "lost" any money. Ok, let me say I didnt lose money working.... but I did lose quite a bit in a couple of divorces.

nostawmama · #50 11/20/14, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yvonne's hubby

When I was doing construction the highest wage I ever got was 8 bucks an hour, but I stayed busy, and seldom "lost" any money. Ok, let me say I didnt lose money working.... but I did lose quite a bit in a couple of divorces.

Lol, fortunately no divorces in our future!

If we got paid 10/hr on a 1099 we would have to pay out of that
-taxes (2x normal since employers wouldn't pay any)
-fuel (close to $20 per day because distance and hauling tool trailer)
-tools (most we have but they wear out, break, need replaced)
-saw blades (many contrators see these as tools even though they aren't, saw blades are 40-60 bucks each, after the other stuff comes out that would be most of an entire day to pay for 1)

Where do we find money for bills and groceries out of that!?

It just isn't worth it for us. We will keep looking for someone that wants to pay a real wage, pick up the odd job as we can, and probably look for work outside the construction industry.

ErinP · #51 11/20/14, 03:28 PM

Well the "recovery" years have been very good to us.

The US is in an unprecedented petroleum boom.
Everyone from young men with strong backs to seniors with clean CDLs are working in a various parts of the drilling/fracking/service/construction/etc. industries in any of the dozen gas and oil fields around the country.

Nate_in_IN · #52 11/20/14, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nostawmama

Lol, fortunately no divorces in our future!

If we got paid 10/hr on a 1099 we would have to pay out of that
-taxes (2x normal since employers wouldn't pay any)
-fuel (close to $20 per day because distance and hauling tool trailer)
-tools (most we have but they wear out, break, need replaced)
-saw blades (many contrators see these as tools even though they aren't, saw blades are 40-60 bucks each, after the other stuff comes out that would be most of an entire day to pay for 1)

Where do we find money for bills and groceries out of that!?

It just isn't worth it for us. We will keep looking for someone that wants to pay a real wage, pick up the odd job as we can, and probably look for work outside the construction industry.

My wife just went through this learning curve this year. She switched from a wage to being paid for delivery of jobs as a 1099. She thought she was bringing in a lot more money as the checks were certainly larger. Then she went to pay taxes and found out what the true tax rate is on income. She couldn't believe it and was totally disgusted.

BTW she used to be a consistent Democratic vote, I think this experience may have pulled the wool from her eyes.

Nevada · #53 11/20/14, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP

Well the "recovery" years have been very good to us.

The US is in an unprecedented petroleum boom.
Everyone from young men with strong backs to seniors with clean CDLs are working in a various parts of the drilling/fracking/service/construction/etc. industries in any of the dozen gas and oil fields around the country.

No doubt about it, more has been done to end our dependence on foreign oil during the Obama administration than under any previous administration. We're even putting the squeeze on Saudia Arabia & OPEC with the new production.

plowjockey · #54 11/21/14, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevada

What did you think a recession was going to be like?

It's not even about the "recession", which is just a really pretty word, to describes what was a near,total collapse of the global economy.

It's a fundamental shift of the labor market.

Cisco Systems has profitable years but they lay off 12,000 anyway. Other employees can pick up the slack.

Many businesses discovered on 08' that they simply had too many employees, accumulated over decades.

Factories that laid off $16/hr workers in 08' are booming and hiring again, just not calling those $16/hr workers back. they are employeing automation and "temps" for $9/hr.

If you can get a law school graduate to make Starbucks coffee, verses a 16 year old high school-er, why not?

The Middle class was built on Union jobs, but they are being busted ASAP, so now we can rely on the benevolence of the employer. They'll take care of us, right?

The economy can do whatever, but until the labor pool demand, exceeds the supply, not much will improve wage-wise.

Nevada · #55 11/21/14, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by plowjockey

It's not even about the "recession", which is just a really pretty word, to describes what was a near,total collapse of the global economy.

It's a fundamental shift of the labor market.

Cisco Systems has profitable years but they lay off 12,000 anyway. Other employees can pick up the slack.

Many businesses discovered on 08' that they simply had too many employees, accumulated over decades.

Factories that laid off $16/hr workers in 08' are booming and hiring again, just not calling those $16/hr workers back. they are employeing automation and "temps" for $9/hr.

If you can get a law school graduate to make Starbucks coffee, verses a 16 year old high school-er, why not?

The Middle class was built on Union jobs, but they are being busted ASAP, so now we can rely on the benevolence of the employer. They'll take care of us, right?

The economy can do whatever, but until the labor pool demand, exceeds the supply, not much will improve wage-wise.

Things won't be the same as before 2008 because the country is evolving, but a recovery will bring back a lot of high paying jobs. People took service sector jobs during the great depression also, but the better jobs came back eventually.

plowjockey · #56 11/21/14, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willow_girl

It's supply and demand. All the young folks want to work with computers nowadays; it's all they know. A "job" is something you do sitting at a desk and staring at a screen.

Gotta find a way to make it work for you. I discovered that in my locale, there is a shortage of housecleaners. No one wants to get their perfectly-manicured, keyboard-ready hands dirty! I can charge $20 a hour for housecleaning, far more than I'd command in an office setting these days. So be it ... I don't miss "office politics" anyway!

This is the great failure of America IMO. No desire to do real work.

Elderly people around here - with money, cannot get anyone to do odd jobs like cleaning gutters and minor carpentry, fix-it. etc.

The Amish won't even return calls, since they are swamped with $5000 roofing jobs.

A friend cleans houses and offices, swamped 6 days a week.

Good luck finding an electrician for minor work.

Clean out a sewer and charge a kings ransom. If they don't like the price tell them to call somebody else. They are charging the same.

The worst thing is that immigrants legal and illegal, will gladly do what are lucrative, but considered "undesirable" jobs