Abusing the system

So you both feel like you should not have to pay taxes?
Then none of us should have to pay any taxes.
Who fills in the pot holes on the highway?
Who pays for the military?
Who pays for the public school system?

Or would you like to privatize every last thing so that you must pay a toll to drive to town. So that a company can profit from every single thing you do or have?

As for the assumption that i feel it is OK to cheat, that was not my point at all.
My point was you seem to only point out when the underprivileged cheat as abuse never when the wealthy or average person cheats.

The fact that almost 1000times more of your hard earned money in the form of taxes goes to big corporation then foodstamps is what should outrage you. Not the mere .10 a day.

Well I admit it is a matter of proximity in that I only know two people who I know are really wealthy and I have never heard or seen evidence they are cheating anyone. But I have met dozens of people on welfare and frankly most are obviously engaging in fraud- some minor, some major.
. For all the protest about it being only welfare people who "picked on", it is not volume of the individual dollar amount that is a worry, but the effect of getting some thing without producing anything that creates the evil society. It makes ever increasing burdens of obligations while ever decreasing the people to pay for them.
You keep bringing up "corporate tax breaks" in a mish mash of poltical, emotional and ideological evils. If you object to corporations getting a
tax writeoff then I would love to see debate about it.
However a welfare fraud is as to corporate greed as Bernie Madoff is to Apple. Apple may push the writeoffs to the level of ugly and abusive but they still produce some society finds usefull and will obey laws if Congress could stop being so venial and writes effect tax laws. They do something hard to do, make a successful business, produce income for many people.
While the person who steals from the welfare system produces nothing as everything they get has been taken from someone else in the first place. And the very attitude of calling on sympathy to excuse their behavior makes it able to grow like cancer. It is easy to give up the daily struggle and demand everyone provide- anyone can do it, unlike running a business. These are the Bernie Madoffs taking what they find too hard to make on their own.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

Apparently has much more to do with compassion and morality than anything else.
To continue would be pointless as those without compassion rarely understand compassion.

IMHO there is compassion and than there is enabling. There is only so much money to go around and if the abusers were removed from the system the turely needy could be better cared for.

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When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.

Ah- the insult and run gambit . I agree that compassion might be part of your argument, for I don't want to insult you, but morality is being confused.
Demanding the goods of others for your own use is not morality.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

Yes, it's quite easy to be compassionate WITH OTHER PEOPLE'S MONEY.

I have no problem with paying taxes to pay for our highways.... that everyone can use. I have no problem paying taxes for our military that defends all of us. I have no problem paying taxes for our police depts and our fire depts that benefit everyone. I do however have a problem paying taxes that benefit only select groups.

I am quite compassionate, and have always been willing to help out someone in need. I have given plenty to the needy, and will continue to do so. I give of myself, my time, my money regularly. I do not however rob other people in order to pay for my charity.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Interesting that nearly all the posts, are about ratting out fraud, committed by the poor. Apparently the poor are the only problem.

What about the rich? Are they better, because they can use their influence to legally buy politicians, to set regulations and tax codes, to stifle competition and set taxes, to get them more money?

Farmers can justify the endless subsides as necessary, while the dealer is unloading a new $300,000 tractor, at their farm.

Small businesses don't cheat, where they can?

Government Contractors are huge fraud and waste perps.

https://www.google.com/#q=Government...ors+overcharge

I saw where a IN state contractor, was repaving a highway section, with asphalt, when the temperature was 39 degrees. That certainly ought to last a long time.

I just seemed ironic that people cheating on food stamps is a problem (which is certainly is), whereas the big stuff goes on - constantly, without even being mentioned.

.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/03/15/news...0/halliburton/

For sure, fraud need reigned in, but how about we reign it in, where it all adds up very quickly?

From a purely practical POV - it cost taxpayers a whole lot less giving this couple $500 a month, than it did to prosecute them and then keep them in jail. If we are going to complain about how many of our tax dollars are wasted we should at least do the whole audit. A fine and a repayment requirement would have been a much better deal all around.

Mary

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In politics the truth is just the lie you believe most - unknown

Isn't that the truth. You know, there is a certain part of any society who will, if offered, take it for free rather than work for it. I will stop there lest I veer off into a passionate lamentation for an America that is long gone.

Which is exactly the problem with most welfare programs- to prosecute a person who is fraudulently getting a couple of hundred dollars a month will cost much more than will ever be recovered. So it does not get done.
Which is why the laws need to minimize payment to minimum possible and require something from the recipient to keep getting it. To minimize the loss from the inevitable abusers. Right now the object is to minimize requirements to encourage signing up- as if people will chose starving to death over bringing in a utility bill. Which just encourages abuse- in fact begs it to happen.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

If you want to open a thread on these subjects, feel free. But asserting that fraud is justified by saying someone else is a worse crook doesn't work when you were in elementary school, much less now.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

LOL, nice spin.

My point was people are "outraged" by welfare fraud, but if a defense company, rips off the taxpayers for a couple of hundred million dollars, no one raises an eyebrow.

Why the double standard?

I was taught that it was all stealing - when I was in elementary school.

I dont care much for thieves... rich or poor. Apparently some eyebrows are being raised regarding possible overcharging by Haliburton.... at least according to the article you posted.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

It's just my observation, that the poor, taking advantage "the system", is discussed here, on a regular basis, whereas the many other venues of people stealing taxpayer money, not such much.

Unless of course, it's a Democrat related deal.

Well the dems are in charge these days. one might expect it will be them with their hands in the cookie jar.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

So bring up some things in other threads.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

Typical liberal to take a serious thread and bring in their own out of this world spin and try to take away the seriousness of the abusing that is happening in ALL Government programs some of the poor now raise another generation up and that generation knows NOTHING else then living off the system, and doesn't want anybody to take anything form them or make them even TRY to get of the rut that now is generations old.

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You're not giving it...it's being taken away from you by force and essentially at the point of a gun should it come down to it.