Have I Missed More on Zimmerman ??

Darren · #41 04/17/12, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pearl B

I just think with the emotional climate the media has stirred up, facts arent going to matter to anyone. I dont think 12 impartial jurors can be found unless its people from another country that have never heard of this case.

I bet the prosecutor just sees a chance to make one heck of a name for themself and is going to give it all they can.

The parts about T's behavior's/actions will be minimized substantially.

It's the job of the defense attorney to see that any relevant information that may indicate any deviancy in Trayvon's character, his less than acceptable behavior and any other issues such as drug use are presented to the jury. In all likelihood he will try to prove to the jury that Trayvon had started emulating the gangsta lifestyle not only in words but also in deeds.

Once he's done that, it's not much of a leap to see the encounter as an attempt by Trayvon to bolster his gangsta image. That is why I think the Lawyer should try to subpeona the NSA recording of the conversation between Trayvon and his girlfriend. Like Zimmerman's father, I think the girlfriend lied.

I think if the recording was not made public but made available to the judge, the prosecutor and the attorney it would settle the issue of who attacked who. At that point, the prosecutor would have a real problem. She would know Zimmerman was innocent but dropping the charges would have serious reprecussions. Hopefully a year from now during the trial, Trayvon's death will not be a national issue.

If someone in the networks was also made privy to the recording, they could move to limit or stop coverage of the trial and the result. Similar things have happened before.

O'Mara has to portray Trayvon as a someone other than the angel presented by the media. Trayvon's parents were upset by the negative things that were made public. IIRC, they never discussed his problems at school in their attempt to whitewash their son's image.

Sonshine · #42 04/18/12, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pearl B

I just think with the emotional climate the media has stirred up, facts arent going to matter to anyone. I dont think 12 impartial jurors can be found unless its people from another country that have never heard of this case.

I bet the prosecutor just sees a chance to make one heck of a name for themself and is going to give it all they can.

The parts about T's behavior's/actions will be minimized substantially.

This isn't the first high profile case. OJ Simpson's was all over the media. The jury found him not guilty. The Casey girl in the same area of Florida was all over the media, found not guilty. That's why I find it so strange that everyone thinks Zimmerman will be found guilty even if the evidence may show him innocent.

Darren · #43 04/18/12, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonshine

This isn't the first high profile case. OJ Simpson's was all over the media. The jury found him not guilty. The Casey girl in the same area of Florida was all over the media, found not guilty. That's why I find it so strange that everyone thinks Zimmerman will be found guilty even if the evidence may show him innocent.

I can't put my finger on it. But I don't think that many in the Black community are the only ones who have been brainwashed. I've always thought the most qualified should get the job not withstanding the original need for affirmative action.

Now we seem to be conditioned to side with the weak, the unfortunate, the disadvantaged and others marginalized by thought or deed without question. Zimmerman in that context is a throwaway to avoid confronting the prejudice that exists in everyone's nature. The sacrifice of one for a larger community, while acceptable in some situations such as a soldier throwing himself on hand grenade to protect the others, is not rationally acceptable in others.

We seem to be well on the road to sacrificing the individual and their liberties in this country for the seductive allure of protecting the larger body when that body is becoming a festering mass.

The thought expressed by some that Zimmerman will automatically be found guilty is a symptom of that.

It's easier to make a prejudiced decision than consciously weed out the misinformation and critically examine the facts as known.

Zimmerman is the real victim here. What is astounding is that people can ignore the blatant attempts by the media to lynch him. That alone should trigger at least an uneasy feeling. Yet it hasn't. People are still using prejudice without realizing it to reach their opinion.

While they may think they are contributing to a better situation for some. They have accepted the condition without considering the consequences of that same opinion by many in this country. What's more, history is showing something's wrong. Yet they continue with the same general outlook. That by definition is prejudice in the most general sense.

Don't get me wrong. There is nothing inherently wrong with prejudice. It's a basic factor in human nature. It makes our lives much simpler. Where we go wrong is when we don't understand the reality and necessity of prejudice. Without an understanding of prejudice as part of human nature, we can't truly engage in critical thinking.

Cornhusker · #44 04/18/12, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonshine

This isn't the first high profile case. OJ Simpson's was all over the media. The jury found him not guilty. The Casey girl in the same area of Florida was all over the media, found not guilty. That's why I find it so strange that everyone thinks Zimmerman will be found guilty even if the evidence may show him innocent.

This is the first one Obamaco has taken a special interest in.
Of course he doesn't care about the people involved, it's just an opportunity to further divide the people and attack gun rights.

Pearl B · #45 04/18/12, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonshine

This isn't the first high profile case. OJ Simpson's was all over the media. The jury found him not guilty. The Casey girl in the same area of Florida was all over the media, found not guilty. That's why I find it so strange that everyone thinks Zimmerman will be found guilty even if the evidence may show him innocent.

They rendered a non-guilty verdict. As badly as some of the evidence was compromised I dont think felt they had a choice, and I agree. It would have been criminal to find him guilty.

I think there was still some backlash invovle though. It was a primarily black jury, and they were going to find him not guilty no matter what. I think it was a payback of sorts to the high rate that most blacks are automatically found guilty by white juries no matter how flimsy the evidence it.

haypoint · #46 04/18/12, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darren

One of the mother's actions supports the problematic picture of Trayvon including truancy, the discovery of women's jewelry and a possible burglary tool in his backpack, the vandalism which led to the discovery of the jewelry and the marijuana baggie that was the final straw.

The action was her insistance in getting him away from his friends while he was suspended for ten days which set the stage for the confrontation. Was Trayvon hanging with the wrong crowd? In a matter of speaking she sent her son to his death. Martin was a young man that desparately needed supervison at that point in his life. Neither parent met the need.

While his tweets and facebook page could be construed as an adolescent's posturing for his peers, it fits with his problems at school. Trayvon was testing the limits but not in a good way. The mother can quote the Bible all she wants, the defense will have access to a lot of background material on Martin that will be relevant to understand his mindset. While his accounts have been deleted, they've been preserved.

The prosecution will try to conjure up an image of Zimmerman as having a depraved mind, while the defense will be presenting the background material on Martin that paints him as a hoodlum. The toxicology analysis on Martin's blood may provide additional support for the defense if it shows drug usage. If drugs were in his blood, that hurts the picture of Martin as an innocent that the media is pushing.

The mother's own statement that she thought the incident was an accident on national TV didn't help the prosecution. If I was the prosecution I'd keep the parents away from the witness stand. So far they've crapped all over the prosecution's case.

After all the trouble Martin's mom had that we know about (I'll guess it is just the tip of the iceberg), dad heads out on a date with his live in. I know that a 6'4" 200 pound 17 year old isn't going to tolerate a babysitter, but it is clear Martin needed a lot of direct supervision. Too bad it couldn't have been his dad.

Maybe if it hadn't been raining, it wouldn't have been so dark. Maybe the conversations wouldn't have been so sharp if it had been warmer out. Perhaps, a daylight meeting could have resulted in a mentoring friendship. Who knows. What we do know is that Martin isn't going to prison like too many young lost souls.

I worked in a prison that housed 1200 violent offenders between 17 and 23 years of age. I've read hundreds of case files. These violent crimes do not just happen over night. They happen with out of control angry young, mostly black men. Many have caring loving religous Moms or Aunts that tried their best. Often by the time they get to prison, they have broken the hearts of everyone they know.

Pops2 · #47 04/18/12, 08:33 PM

anyone have links to eyewitness statements & other "exonerating" information?

Bearfootfarm · #48 04/18/12, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pops2

anyone have links to eyewitness statements & other "exonerating" information?

Witness Says Trayvon Martin Attacked George Zimmerman

George Zimmerman's 911 call transcribed - National unsolved cases | Examiner.com

EYEWITNESS STATEMENT SAYS TRAYVON WAS BEATING UP ZIMMERMAN | 2 Way Street Politics

The Martin/Zimmerman timeline [Reader Post] | Flopping Aces

Bearfootfarm · #49 04/18/12, 09:21 PM

Judge In Trayvon Martin Case Recuses Herself Due To Conflict Of Interest

Quote:

The judge who was set to preside over the trial of George Zimmerman in the killing of Trayvon Martin has stepped aside.
Jessica Reckseidler's recusal from the trial comes after Mark O'Mara, Zimmerman's attorney, suggested that her husband's job as a partner to Mark NeJame, a CNN legal analyst covering the trial, represented a conflict of interest.

BobDFL · #50 04/20/12, 10:43 AM

Anyone else watch the Zimmerman bond hearing (just ended)?

One of the lead investigators was left squirming trying to explain the language he agreed to in the Arrest Affidavid. The SA also was totally un-prepared, they were just standing on the Arrest Avidavid as a reason to not allow bond.

Florida law requires the state to prove why they don't want bond and there actions show they don't have the evidence to ask that.

They also left themselves open when the lead investigator admitted on the stand that they never asked or saw GZ's medical records from that night (aka, the broken nose and skull injuries), so GZ's lawyer kindly gave it to the SA right there in the court room.

If this is how the trial is going to go, it will definetly be another Casey Anthony fiasco for the State of Florida.

Bearfootfarm · #51 04/20/12, 11:30 AM

Quote:

If this is how the trial is going to go, it will definetly be another Casey Anthony fiasco for the State of Florida.

I think that's their game plan.

They made (a portion of) the public happy by charging him, and it relieves them of blame

BobDFL · #52 04/20/12, 11:36 AM

Another important point that came out at the hearing is that the Lead Investigator came out and admitted on the stand that they had no evidence that disputes GZ's account of who was the agressor.

ryanthomas · #53 04/20/12, 12:33 PM

Anyone have a link to the entire bail hearing? All I can find are short clips of the parts the media likes, such as the apology.

unregistered168043 · #54 04/20/12, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pancho

Thanks, and I hope you will finally do some research and find out the true facts and rely less on Jackson and Sharpton for your "facts".

OK official apology. Found out more about the case and it seems as if it is not as cut and dry as I thought. Zimmerman, may in fact, have been defending himself.

It appears it was me who spoke without knowing.

pancho · #55 04/20/12, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darntootin

OK official apology. Found out more about the case and it seems as if it is not as cut and dry as I thought. Zimmerman, may in fact, have been defending himself.

It appears it was me who spoke without knowing.

Just glad you are finding out more about what happened.
No need to apologize to anyone.

Bearfootfarm · #56 04/20/12, 02:01 PM

Quote:

OK official apology. Found out more about the case and it seems as if it is not as cut and dry as I thought. Zimmerman, may in fact, have been defending himself.

It appears it was me who spoke without knowing.

We all do that sometimes.
It's the ones who ignore the facts while arguing against them that need to learn from your example

BobDFL · #57 04/20/12, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanthomas

Anyone have a link to the entire bail hearing? All I can find are short clips of the parts the media likes, such as the apology.

The entire hearing took over 2 hours so I'm not sure if you'll be able to find it anymore (most news sites won't keep something that big on there sites). I've checked all the local Orlando TV station sites and they only have the clips now.

ryanthomas · #58 04/20/12, 04:34 PM

I guess I don't really want to watch 2 full hours anyway. Thanks for looking. What's interesting to me is that many of the news stories say Zimmerman apologized to Trayvon's parents for shooting him. Anyone who saw the apology knows that just isn't true. He apologized for the loss of their son.

Bearfootfarm · #59 04/20/12, 04:41 PM

I thought it was pretty low the way Martin's lawyer, Crump, complained about the apology as being "unfair" and "self serving", but there has been little talk about the prosecutor Corey, having a "prayer meeting with Trayvon's 'sweet parents'"

ryanthomas · #60 04/20/12, 05:47 PM

And Martin's mom has been saying in interviews for weeks that she wanted an apology, but when Zimmerman's attorney reached out to them to speak in private, they declined. I think it was a trap to get him to apologize in court or at least in public and hopefully admit guilt. Since he didn't admit guilt, they're saying he's "insincere."