victimless crime

I have looked up all four cases and none of them define the term Natural born citizen. They use common law to affirm the citizenship of various people but do not use it to deny any ones citizenship.

What MINOR V. HAPPERSETT, does say is "Additions might always be made to the citizenship of the United States in two ways: first, by birth, and second, by naturalization. This is apparent from the Constitution itself, for it provides6 that 'no person except a natural-born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of the Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President,'7 and that Congress shall have power 'to establish a uniform rule of naturalization.' Thus new citizens may be born or they may be created by naturalization."

Since the XIV amendment makes it clear that being born in the United States makes you a citizen. That would have to be a natural born citizen as opposed to a naturalized citizen.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark reenforces this when the court says "On the basis of the 14th Amendment, however, the majority opinion coined a new definition for “native citizen”, as anyone who was born in the U.S.A., under the jurisdiction of the United States."
While it didn't specifically say natural born citizen it did define what is required to be born a citizen of the United States.

Jim

A Naturalized Citizen never becomes a Natural Born Citizen.
here is a good lot of info for you, includeing the comments.http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2010/05/no...r-nations.html

There is no debate about the above statement. The only two types of citizen are natural born citizen (also referred to as native born) and naturalized citizen. There is no requirement in the United States for either parent to be a citizen to be a natural born citizen if you are born on U S soil. The XIV amendment makes that quite clear.

Jim

OK, so what does any of this have to do with the OP?

OK, here is my opinion. Legalize everything, and with those activities that tend to invite abuse (prostitution, drugs, alcohol, tobacco, gambling, etc) regulate and tax the heck out of it.

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Flaming Xtian
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Mahatma Gandhi


Libertarindependent

I think it had to do with Obama's eligibility to become president... which if a crime... certainly wasnt victimless.... there are roughly 300 million victims!

I am not sure what sort of "abuse" you are referring to here? Some folks have a propensity for abusing almost anything... couch potatoes are everywhere... should we regulate how many hours of tv folks can watch? what about gluttony??? how would you propose regulating how much we eat? I would propose that we simply repeal unnecessary laws.... those that are on the books to protect me from me. This would free up our justice system to deal with folks who break laws designed to protect me from thee. Prostitution for example.... its a simple business transaction like any other.... and there are no victims as long as both parties live up to their end of the bargain. alcohol use is another on your list... where is the victim? you are aware that millions of law abiding citizens use alcohol with no ill effects on anyone but themselves, right? Tobacco is the same deal... who is the victim when someone places a wager? and wins? Drug usage.... seems to be ok for folks to use drugs..... as long as big pharma gets their cut.... no victims there either.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

YK, you and I both know that many girls are forced into prostitution. In such cases it is no longer a "victimless" crime. I don't want drugs, tobacco, or alcohol to be sold to minors.

I am forced to pay a "sin tax" for tobacco and alcohol, so I don't see a problem with taxing the vices that I don't partake in.

__________________
Flaming Xtian
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Mahatma Gandhi


Libertarindependent

Not true,every president has been a "natural born citizen"eta (except those at the time of the writing of the constitution). There was even resolution SR 511 for McCain-it defines NBC. He had 2 US Citizen parents that were living on US soil in the Panama Canal when he was born. Tho many dispute this because the actual Birth Hospital was off the US Base. They did this to insure everyone understood that MCCain was a NBC,Obama even signed the Resolution. No Amendments have changed the NBC requirement for President of the US.

Last I heard its illegal to force anyone to do anything against their own will... Why shut down an entire legitimate business sector because "some" will abuse its potential? Thats like shutting down the auto industry to prevent "some" from stealing cars?

If you dont want drugs, tobacco, or alcohol sold to minors... talk to their parents... why should responsible adults such as yourself, and myself be denied our pursuits and pleasures because YOU think someones kids "might" be exposed? Why tax some folks vices while not taxing others? I havent heard anything about taxing or prohibiting sex for free.... whats the point of taxing or prohibiting the very same act just because a monetary exchange is involved?

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

YK, I think that if you reread my post that you would agree with most of it. I never suggested that responsible adults should be denied any of these pursuits. If sex is sold as a service why shouldn't it be taxed like any other service. I have to pay tax for my plumber, why shouldn't I pay tax for my ....ahem..... adult provider?

__________________
Flaming Xtian
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Mahatma Gandhi


Libertarindependent

I dont pay tax for my plumber... or my waiter or my doctor, or..... any other service provider... why should I be taxed for a hooker? Actually, this isnt about taxing... its about repealing goofy meddling laws.... if you feel the need to tax services... ok, but lets get rid of the criminal aspect. Rereading your post really doesnt help.... you were bringing forward the same sort of illogical logic that gets these laws on the books to start with. Some argue that drug abuse causes crime.... so punish people for committing whatever real crimes... the ones with victims.... that they commit. You brought up how some girls are forced into prostitution... so punish those who force the girls into prostitution... it does no good to make prostitution illegal.

__________________
"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

YK, it seems that you just want to argue. Buh bye.

__________________
Flaming Xtian
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Mahatma Gandhi


Libertarindependent

You might want to reread my post. I did not say there was not a requirement to be a natural born citizen to be president. I said There is no requirement in the United States for either parent to be a citizen to be a natural born citizen if you are born on U S soil. What this means is if Obama was born in Hawaii then the place of birth of his parents does not enter into his birth status. He is a natural born citizen of the United States. This was always assumed to be true under U S law, but the XIV amendment made it very clear.

Jim

I enjoy my share of cocktails now and then, but am adiment against driving afterward. Yes, many accidents are caused by sober folks, and (at least in Michigan) if you are in an accident while drinking, EVEN if the other person caused it, you are held liable and to blame. To me, that's wrong. Then again, I once got a DUI while riding a horse...

I do feel that most of what's wrong with many laws is that nobody is held accountable for their actions/consiquences. If things go arwy, then the public gets to foot the bill. That's just wrong. IMO. Many times, the police have zero or little intrest in "real crime"... all they are intrested in is "the money makers"... that's not what they are paid for.

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Agree 100%

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This was my point when I first included DUI in the OP. Having a few drinks does not have a victim.... in and of itself. While it may lead to accident that could have victims, simply driving an automobile while under the influence has no victim. I think whoever actually caused the accident is at fault, and should be held responsible.

DUI for riding a horse? Thats almost as good as a feller near here a couple years back getting arrested for DUI while in a wheel chair!

Yeppers, personal responsibility for ones actions and decisions has become a thing of the past. Isnt it wonderful to be so "progressive"!

__________________
"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Except for boredom related suicide!

Its obvous that you have a dislike for alchol.
You see driving drunk is never a problem. IT NOT being able to drive while drunk that IS the problem.
Alchool shouldnt have anything to do with it there should simply be a law against not being in control of the vehical.
I for one dont care the least why someone cant drive.But if they cant I dont want them on the road.

In Michigan, it's been law for many years that bars can't "give away" any alcohol. They have to charge something for it.

hehe... at least "his" vehicle had wheels!

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You're still forgetting the prohibition of a poll tax or any other tax to vote.

I didnt forget... just didnt see the need in foolin with it. I do think we could use some restrictions though. A person really should be familiar with American history, the difference between the various forms of government, and the basics of how our government works before being allowed to vote for incompetent and downright treasonous candidates. Tieing a couple years military service to voting might not hurt anything either... some skin in the game and like that.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

I can pretty much agree with that. Maybe make everyone pass the citizenship test before letting them vote.