Violent crime rates.. US vs Canada

People keep saying availability of guns don't play a part in the murder rate. On what is that statement based? What are the stats between gun availability in Canada and the US? What are the stats of murders committed by gun in both countries?
NRA nor the anti-gun groups are not reliable sources of stats but it would be good to hear if there are any reliable authorities on this.

Well it should not make you unpopular, since you're just telling it the way most Canadians observe it and I think it's the truth.

USA started out fighting and it just never stopped, and as Haypoint said, "We have a destructive element in our population that doesn’t exist elsewhere." which is also true so I think it's an element that's become bred in the bone since the inception of the nation. But there's more to it than just being bred with attitude, there is also environment and lifestyle habits that contribute to attitude and general state of mind.

There have been studies done in USA, Canada and Europe on the physical and mental wellbeing of their populations based on population density, the effects of urban sprawl and the kinds of exercise and food habits their respective people have on a daily basis.

Walking makes a huge difference for the better in a person's state of mind because of the chemicals that are released into the walker's system and enhance the sense of wellbeing and compassion. Canada and the European nations are walking nations and America is not. The typical Canadian walks 500 miles more per year than the typical American, and the typical European walks twice as much as the typical Canadian. That's just the amount of walking done doing things like going to work, to school, to the store, and conducting ordinary chores around the residence. When it comes to daily walking for pleasure, (just one example, 30 - 60 minutes of strolling for the evening constitutional) the typical Canadian and European walks 1,000 miles per year more than the typical American. Typical Americans are always in a hurry to get somewhere and rely more on other modes of transportation to get them there quickly rather than using their feet and enjoying the walk.

One of the things I said in the other topic that prompted YH to start this topic was this:

I think it would be more important to address the question of why your society has 3 times more murders per capita than my society does and I don't think that having everyone carrying firearms is going to solve the question. Guns don't resolve violence, the problem of what causes violence goes deeper than what kinds of tools a person uses to commit violence.

I did some stats checking recently when somebody in another forum asked which of our 2 countries had a higher percentage per capita of police reported domestic violence and abuse. For Canada it was 12% and for America it was a shocking 40% - a little over 3 times more domestic violence per capita than occurs in Canada. This was shocking for me because those stats are based only on the incidents that are reported to the police and I have to wonder how many such incidents of domestic violence go unreported to the police. I'm sure it's probably double.

Firearms is not the problem, violence is the problem and more people carrying firearms is not going to solve the problem of violence in America. The American nation needs to get to the root of what is causing the violence in the first place and address the violence with something other than having more people carrying more firearms. Firearms isn't going to make the violence go away, it can only exacerbate it and make it easier to be violent without putting more physical or personal effort into it.

LOL
While I don't doubt you "read it somewhere", it's totally false


http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html

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You can find lots of answers here:

http://www.guncite.com/index.html

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I'm pretty much up in the white area NE of Edmonton and in my region most of the crimes are committed by natives because of the fact that most of them do not work, live on their treaty money and usually spend it within the first week on booze and drugs. (Ask any retailer in the area) The rest of the month they are broke and looking for their next fix whichever way they can get it.

But! Then only an hour and a bit away is Edmonton pop. 750,000+ , with the highest murder rate in Canada this year with almost double the normal number of murders. 43 so far at last count.

It's being blamed on the economic boom supposedly because the extra money is said to be spent on drug/sex related activities- which attracts the drug traffickers.
Most of the murders seem to be gang and/or drug related and young asian/foreign males.
I don't have any figures for any other crimes in the area.

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Dale, I've been thru Canada about 3 dozen times, but avoided the cities like the plague.... Do the large cities have large public housing areas, where there's nothing but multigenerational dysfunctional families on welfare?

I imagine if you erase the public entitlement crowd's crime from the US statistics, things would look a lot brighter.

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Texican, just out of curiosity, what population qualifies as a large city?

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Texican Toronto and Montreal both do, but I wouldn't say they're as large as in US cities, and more like scattered enclaves. Haven't been to any other major cities but I assume they do too. Toronto Community Housing is the second largest "social housing provider" in North America, almost 60,000 housing units with 170,000 residents.

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Ok, I want to first clarify that I agree with you... skin color alone does not make a person a criminal and MOST blacks in our country are decent, hard working, law abiding citizens. That being said however if one just looks at the numbers nationwide (I have not compared individual state stats) if a person removed the "black" homicides (nearly two thirds) our murder rate would fall in line with Canada. I also do not have the per capita black to white population ratio for Canada so havent calculated their rate if the black segment of their country were taken out of the equation. I dont understand why over half of our murders are committed by young black males either... but thats what the numbers show. Is it something in our culture? Guns are pretty much equally available throughout all fifty states so I dont think that has much affect. I also am positive that its not "bad blood", that whole genetics myth has been done away with years ago.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Reckon it'd be any city, that has enough of a welfare population, that they feel the need to keep all the poor folks in one place, public housing. I don't know about Canada's poor and housing problems... I do know, you don't want to be caught in one of "our" housing projects area... especially after dark... without a detachment of Marine vets...

Last month, we had a rash of burglaries... (Our Sheriff has a weekly report each Friday on the local radio station). Told folks to be vigilant. Three weeks later, one of the deputies while on patrol saw a truck he'd never seen before, on a back roads... stopped them, questioned them, arrested them... shouldn't have had stolen goods stacked in the back of their truck. Found their 'home', with several million in loot.

Harder to be a bad guy out in flyover country... there's little anonymity...

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

Stats for both countries.

Canada ethnic demographics for 2006:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogra...nada#Ethnicity

Homicide stats for Canada from 2006 - 2010:
http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/legal12a-eng.htm

USA ethnic demographics for 2010:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogra..._and_ethnicity

USA all crimes rate (note that all crimes in USA have dropped significantly since 1993):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

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Also note gun ownership is at an all time high

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Yes, I noted that on the map as it changes:




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Ok, Thanks to Naturelovers handiwork I think we can pretty much eliminate gun availability as a connection to higher crime rates. The more guns in the hands of JQ Public, the less violent crime we have assuming other things being somewhat equal. We eliminated "bad blood" a good many years ago. This brings us down to environment/culture. I noticed Canada had a much lower percentage of black population than the US (a bit over 2 percent compared to nearly 13 percent) which indicates to me... so far anyway... that there must be something going on in the black culture of the US that is causing our murder rates to be so much higher. When one looks at the percentage of our black population vs that of Canada... it puts our murder rate almost dead even... if one pulls the black portion of both countries stats out of the equation. The French, German, English and all other european and asian folks seem to be killing one another at about the same rate. We know from the stats that black folks are basically nonviolent.. with the exception of some of the young males and a few of the young females.... what the heck is their problem?

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

The reality is that 70-80% of our violent crime is committed by poor blacks. Canada simply does not have that demographic. Native Americans in Canada cannot be compared.

If all the poor blacks suddenly migrated to Canada, they would have the same problems we do.

I'm not suggesting that skin color makes someone good or bad. But there are decades of cultural conditioning, economic circumstances, social conditioning and etc that are at work here.

According to the numbers provided by the fbi files, only a bit over 60 percent (slightly less than two thirds) of our murders are committed by blacks... lets not make things appear worse than they are. We do have a good number of whites and asians along with other minorities committing violent crime too... at about the same rate as elsewhere. Now since the majority of those crimes committed by the black segment of our society are in the 18 to 25 year old male category.... what might we do to change their "attitude" besides letting them grow out of it? The violent crime rates do seem to drop pretty rapidly with age. I am also pretty sure that even most "poor" black youth are NOT prone to violence. again, we are dealing with a very small segment of the black populace which is only a bit more than 12 percent of our total.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

I said 'violent crime', not just murders.

No need to soften your statement of the facts by telling us that whites and asians commit crimes too. Your original post was about trying to ascertain the cause of the USA/Canada crime rate difference and I think we can all safely conclude that black crime accounts for the disparity.

As to HOW we might change that, hm. Thats a tough one, but it cannot be done without first identifying the cause of increased black violence.

Not quite. I don't have stats to show this, just going by memory of news accounts over the years. In Canada the majority of Canadian blacks are not poor or violent and very few murders are commit by blacks in Canada. As regards homicides or man slaughter by Natives, more often than not they are unplanned and/or accidental. The majority of deliberate homicides committed in Canada are by whites and in recent years planned hits by rival Asian gangs killing members of other Asian gangs. We have a problem with white serial killers/rapists in this country, most notably in B.C.

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Ok, I think you misunderstood something, because what I was trying to get across is pretty much in agreement with you. Let me rephrase... if we take the "black" stats... out of both countries... the remainder will appear almost identical as far as murders are concerned per hundred thousand of population. I would also state that in the United States that most blacks are nonviolent. The black population here consists of roughly 13 percent of 310 million people. That translates to roughly 40 million black folks. Since there were only (Hmmm only!) 1.4 million violent crimes committed in 2010 and if blacks committed ALL of them, which we know they dont, that would still leave 38.6 million fine, hard working, law abiding black folks in this country. Its obviously NOT a black problem... its a very small segment of the black population. Why that small segment? who are they? what is so different? what sets those few off into violent crime while most blacks here seem to avoid it?

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

A few bad apples can skew the stats really hard.

http://mynorthwest.com/?nid=11&sid=551174

http://www.monkeygumbo.com/wee/news/henryearl/

Henry has been arrested right around 1000 times. So if you average his arrest record with my spotless arrest record, we are averaging 500 arrests each.