If Christ Were To Return Tomorrow - How Many Would Accept Him???

I don't know what to say. How anyone could read the OT and say it doesn't foretell Christ just boggles my mind. That's what it is about from beginning to end. From the forming of Adam, the seed line through which Christ would come, clear to the end. Who is Psalm 22 talking about? Was David just making up stories? It tells the very words Christ said on the cross. The examples are many but I suspect your mind is closed.

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Dear Math, it is time you grew up and solved your own problems.

Are we really talking about executing Jesus DURING the rapture? Really? He will have came to save us, but apparently we are, instead going to save him. Bwhahahahaah

You know, just as you can't lump all Christians into one category or group as regards belief in Christ, especially the minutia, so too is it impossible, or inadvisable to lump all Jews into one category of thought as regards the coming of a Messiah and what/who he is expected to be.
Does Isaah, chapter 25 not describe some of the events of the coming of the Messiah?

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Our website is www.thequeensblessing.com

If someone comes to rule and reign on earth in human form... It's not Christ. It is a human with the small 's' spirit of the antiChrist. There is no "new revelation" contrary to the Word of God.

Unfortunately, if that happened, I do believe many would follow the person because some of the very elect would be deceived. But it is not Christ. David Koresh was not Christ, Joseph Smith was not Christ or a messenger of Christ, and many other people claiming to have a "new revelation" are not Christ..... Mary Baker Eddy, Ellen White.... People who write their own bible full of new revelations are not carrying a message from God. It is that simple. They are false prophets. If anything, anyone, claims is contrary to bible teaching it is not of God. There is no "new revelation" Jesus said, "it is finished". That is why the teaching of the rapture is not biblical, that is why all the "ask Jesus into your heart" stuff is not biblical, that is why Momonism is not biblical, Christian science is not biblical..... If it isn't in the Word of God it isn't biblical. There is no 'New Revelation". It is that simple.
Salvation comes the way the Word of God says it comes..... Repentance, water baptism, and the infilling of the Holy Spirit. The pattern was repeated over and over in Acts. That is the biblical blueprint. There is no other new revelation, there is no other "new" way. It isn't about some "new" bible or "new" word.

Now, the question comes, does that mean those people are not going to heaven? that they are not believers? Do I think that little girl with a dream who started the rumor of the "rapture" went to spend eternity without God? No. I don't. But it was and is a false teaching because it isn't in the bible.

So, if anyone shows up tomorrow and claims to be Christ, run from him not to him because that is not Christ. It is just not biblical for Christ to rule on this earth until the new heaven and new earth come after the dead in Christ rise and the living together them go to meet him in the clouds.

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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

amen

Are you refering to the text of Jerimiah that deals with the New Covenant?


Jeremiah 31:31-34

New International Version 1984 (NIV1984)



31 “The time is coming,” declares the LORD,
“when I will make a new covenant
with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah.
32 It will not be like the covenant
I made with their forefathers
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they broke my covenant,
though I was a husband to[a] them,[b]”
declares the LORD.
33 “This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time,” declares the LORD.
“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34 No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,”
declares the LORD.
“For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

Paul claims that text in support of his gospel although the OT is translated "law" Which would seem to indicate the "LAW" and Paul translates as "laws" Which he seems to indicate as generally the will of God?



Hebrews 8:7-13

New International Version 1984 (NIV1984)



7 For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8 But God found fault with the people and said[a]:

“The time is coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant
with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah.
9 It will not be like the covenant
I made with their forefathers
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they did not remain faithful to my covenant,
and I turned away from them,
declares the Lord.
10 This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11 No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12 For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”[b]

13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

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Some folks are well off. I'm just a little off.

Have y'all noticed how the non believers try to turn this into a political rant!!!!
I know where I am going on judgment day and it will not be hot!!

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Deo Vindice O I'm a Good Old Rebel and thats what I am, I don't want no pardon for what I am and did

Luke 13:24-28

New International Version 1984 (NIV1984)


24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’

“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’

26 “Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’

27 “But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!’

28 “There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out.

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Some folks are well off. I'm just a little off.

In case anyone wonders how Abraham, Isaac and Jacob get into heaven without accepting Christ.

He also went and ministered to them.


1 Peter 3:18-19

New International Version 1984 (NIV1984)


18 For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, 19 through whom[a] also he went and preached to the spirits in prison

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Some folks are well off. I'm just a little off.

What if he was born in Hawaii?

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"For if you start dancing on tables, fanning yourself, feeling sleepy when you pick up a book... making love whenever you feel like it, then you know. The south has got you.”

Let me guess, you do not study Hebrew, you rely on misrepresented, mistranslated, deliberately distorted and out-of-context scripture, you grew up Christian, always believed without question, have always used the Christian OT to support your views, and listen to everything your pastor tells you. Maybe I dont have it all right, but even if I have a small portion right in that statement, there lies your answer. So, really....perhaps we should rethink who's mind is closed?

Psalm 22 is not about the crucifixion of Jesus. It is interesting that none of the NT authors reference this supposedly *most important* passage? Dont you think? Perhaps it is because this psalm was CHANGED DELIBERATELY by the early church in order to install support for their religion.

The theme of the psalm is the plight of the Jew who prays for an end to Israel’s exile from its land and from the Temple. The original Hebrew shows King David describing his own anguish and longing during those horrible times when he was a fleeing from his enemies. This is an historical, NOT a messianic psalm. When he refers to himself as a worm, a helpless creature, whose only salvation can come from the One God, it is quite clear that the author does not consider himself to be someone who can provide salvation, or one who is divine.

The most gasped over and perhaps most telling example of deliberate mistranslation within this psalm, one that every Christian probably places a large portion of thier faith on, is the verse (in Christian):

"For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet."

In Truth, the verse does not read this way at all, the Hebrew states:

"For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers encompassed me; like a lion they are at my hands and my feet."

The Christian translations have the word "pierced" which was changed from the true Hebrew "like a lion" (ka-ari) (God's word, not mine!). The word "ari" means lion. There are other verbs used in the Hebrew Bible to describe piercing: daqar, hadar, naqav, palah and ratza. None of these root verbs resembles the terms ka'ari or ari.

The common Christian rendition, "they pierced" in the "Christian Old Testament" (and arent we clear from just *this one example* that there is Hebrew Torah, given at Sinai by God through national revelation to his people, and a "Christian OT" which has had the One God's chosen words plucked from it and twisted to support some "means to an end?" Oh what more did the scribes do to God's words in their hidden chambers??)

--Anyway-- quite obviously, the words "they pierced' came after the New Testament was written, or else the authors of the New Testament would have referenced such an important supportive Christian passage!? really now, don't you think?? They were simply and obviously unaware of this future revision where the Church changed God's words to create a better fit with the crucifixion (can anyone say CORRUPT??). After all, there was NO REASON and they DO NOT mistranslate the term "ka'ari" where it occurred in other places in the Bible. (Numbers 23:24, 24:9, Isaiah 38:13, and Ezekiel 22:25) After all, these verses werent valuable to the fashioners of Christian theology.

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Chris

2 dogs, 1 parrot, 2 horses, colorful flock of egg-layers, peafowl, dairy goats, porchful of hummers, and a garden full of monarchs

As many as do and no more than that.

Yes I am referencing this passage when I say that there will be Universal Knowledge of God.

Also here is Isaiah and Zechariah:

Isaiah 11:9 - "They shall neither harm nor destroy on My entire Holy Mountain; for the earth shall be full of knowledge of the L-rd, as the waters of the sea cover up [the sea floor]."

Zechariah 14:9 - "And the L-rd shall be King over all the earth; on that day shall the L-rd be One, and His Name One."

Obviously there is no world peace and there is no knowledge of God that covers the earth, or missionaries would not be spending millions of dollars running around the planet trying to tell people about their Christian god. There IS NO SECOND COMING in scripture.

This part of the passage is the Christian translation of verse 33:

"But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my lawin their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people."

This is the same verse in the Hebrew:

"For this is the covenant that I shall form with the House of Israel after those days," says the L-rd; "I will place My Torah within them, and I will inscribe it upon their heart; and I will be their G-d and they shall be a people for Me."

The new covenant does not mean that Jesus of Nazareth is a savior and the Torah can be disregarded. This is a messianic prophecy that is YET TO COME. It is the SAME TORAH BASED covenant only The Torah is inscribed on their hearts not only placed in thier mouths as was the case when they were led out of Egypt. Jeremiah's new covenant differs only from the original Sinai covenant in that it was placed in the mouths of the Israelites. It will be a new covenant, in a new time, not like the one when they were taken by the hand out of Egypt--that one has been broken--but the new one will be unbroken because it will be on thier hearts, not just in thier mouths:

As in Exodus 13:9 - "And it shall be to you for a sign upon your hand, and for a memorial between your eyes, in order that the Torah of the L-rd shall be in your mouth; for with a mighty hand has the L-rd brought you out of Egypt."

The contract at Sinai was verbally agreed to, it was not yet a part of them, how could it be, they were so young as a people.

But according to Jeremiah 31's new covenant God says, "I will place My Torah within them and I will inscribe it upon their heart" The new covenant will be placed within the people. They will know it deeply and carry it integrally as part of themselves. As will be the case in the messianic age. Obviously we do not all have the Torah written on our hearts, so messiah has not yet come.

"My Torah" is different than "my laws" as the Christians always enjoy describing God's guide to life, distilling it down to a series of meaningless hurtles that should be cast aside. Yes torah can mean rules, or statutes. But Torah means different things in different contexts. Jeremiah was referring to THE TORAH--at least the five books of Moses. Meaning, NO, we do not throw out what is written there for a whole new theology. Christianity was seeking to destroy what they viewed as "difficult and dead" even though it says in Dueteronomy that keeping the Torah is "not too difficult or out of reach." In actuality, Torah is a guide to life and a means to connect with the One God, a structure for spiritual connection given by the Creator.

I find it exceedingly interesting that the only messianic prophecies the Christians say Jesus has fulfilled--and I am setting aside the legitimacy of those claims in themselves--the only messianic fulfillments that Christians can point to are those that cannot EVER truly be known. They are stated as fact in the "NT" but they are nevertheless unknowable and must be simply be accepted without question (this is not faith, although you might call it so). However, most importantly, according to prophecy, the real messiah will rebuild the 3rd temple (not done), usher in world peace (still not done), bring forth Universal Knowledge of God (hello??), resurrect the dead, etc etc. All these acts, if they occurred would be UNDENIABLE. You would LOOK OUT YOUR WINDOW and know the messiah had come, no faith or acceptance required. I know, i know...Christians look to the "second coming" for these happenings to occur, despite the fact that prophetic support for a second coming does not exist anywhere in the Bible and in truth, the real messiah will bring these forth at once, and only once.

The Christian texts RELY on Jewish texts. Without the Hebrew, they cannot exist. Therefore, if you believe Christianity to be true, then the Hebrew MUST be true. So you cannot simply throw out what does not agree with you, whether you are a common person, or a scribe, an early-church leader, or an author of the NT gospels. Judaism as a religion may have just as many blocked and confused people as any other religion, but the messianic age is the age when all of those blockages will be removed so God's people can know and understand deeply. This is the new covenant of the new messianic age, a covenant where the God's Torah is inscribed on every righteous persons heart, an intergral part of every person -- a Universal Knowledge of God. But Christianity came along and said, the Jews make this too hard, lets get rid of it. What Christianity did was throw the God of Israel away in return for another golden calf.

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Chris

2 dogs, 1 parrot, 2 horses, colorful flock of egg-layers, peafowl, dairy goats, porchful of hummers, and a garden full of monarchs

To be clear with universal knowlege would come obediance and therefore the long awaited promise made to Abraham?

The unconditional promise made to Abraham, God must fulfill but which has been awaiting rhe perfect obediance required?

If this obediance is not possible without an intervention from the divine then God will intervine to make it so. Therfore the imprinting of his will directly on the hearts and minds as per the text of Jeremiah?

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Some folks are well off. I'm just a little off.

Absolutely. Obedience however implies there remains a desire to do other than the Creator's will, which would be impossible with a Universal knowledge. That kind of knowledge means absolute love and desire to do the will of the Creator without any desire at all to turn away.

When you speak of "perfect obedience" you are speaking from a biased Christian perspective. The word which in Christian texts is always translated as "commandments" actually means "means to connection." So each of the 613 mitzvot are deeds which bring the doer into connection with the Creator. This is why they were established, so the people would have a means and structure by which to stay connected to a vast and unknowable God. This is not a god you can carve from wood, cast in gold or paint on a canvas. The One God is not an idol to be seen, or held in any way, shape or form, not even symbolically. Living a Torah based life connects you to the God of Israel. There are 613 "ways to connect" offered by the Creator in Torah. There are positive commandments and negative ones. Most are not even applicable to every day life. I know many orthodox Jews who live a Torah observant life. They are connected. It is not impossible. It is not out of reach. I know this because I know it is done by good happy people every day. Even though I do not accept that jesus is the Jewish messiah, I can see that he was at least trying to make the strict and judgement filled Pharisees (who understandably were digging in thieir heels in response to the rapid assimilation of the Jewish people into the throbbing pagan Greek culture)--he was trying to make them see that the nature of the law was spirit of intent and not unreasonable and imhumane strictness. Still though, even according to Jesus you should not throw any of it out, not a yud, it is everlasting.

As we are human and imperfect, we will always fail, but we can keep the Torah perfectly in the spirit of intent, this is easy to see. Deuteronomy states that it is not out of reach to keep the Torah. "To sin" is not to have a cloud of hellfire hanging over your soul. To sin, in Hebrew, is "to miss the mark." The essence of that word implies that *you do your best.* You may miss the mark, but if you are connected to God and doing your very best, you then have the Torah on your heart. You may miss the mark but you do better next time. You try to love your God with all your heart and soul by remaining connected to Him through a Torah observant life. Not because if you don't you will go to hell (no such place in Torah), but because you desire the connection. If you fail, through God-given free will and tripping over "stumbling blocks" in life, there are means to atone that do not involve a Temple or ritual slaughter of animals by priests. It is only Christianity that sets up Torah observance as being impossible to keep and requires impossible obedience. This is another example of distortion in Christian texts. If God really wants us to keep the Torah and not worship idols, are Christians doing alright?

Moshiach / messiah is a bringer of balance in a corrupted world. When balance is achieved you have the messianic age with all its signs and wonders. These signs will make the heart change. God is not going to beam the words of Torah into people's brains. He would have done that already. We are not programmable robots. The heart change will come from the reward of working with the creator to restore the balance through our own connections, our own works. We work with the Creator to bring about the messianic age, to usher in the messiah. I am certain that God is waiting for us and the promise of Abraham will be rewarded when we are all working for it. It wont happen through accepting a false and corrupted Roman-controlled doctrine which is vastly removed from it's roots.

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Chris

2 dogs, 1 parrot, 2 horses, colorful flock of egg-layers, peafowl, dairy goats, porchful of hummers, and a garden full of monarchs

Good posts Purple Martineer, very interesting to read what you've written.

.

Why would God need to use an intermediate?

Is the concept of a Messiah a spiritualisation of the promise to David which failed on the literal interpretation?


2 Samuel 7:10-16

New International Version 1984 (NIV1984)


10 And I will provide a place for my people Israel and will plant them so that they can have a home of their own and no longer be disturbed. Wicked people will not oppress them anymore, as they did at the beginning 11 and have done ever since the time I appointed leaders[a] over my people Israel. I will also give you rest from all your enemies.

“‘The LORD declares to you that the LORD himself will establish a house for you: 12 When your days are over and you rest with your fathers, I will raise up your offspring to succeed you, who will come from your own body, and I will establish his kingdom. 13 He is the one who will build a house for my Name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. 14 I will be his father, and he will be my son. When he does wrong, I will punish him with the rod of men, with floggings inflicted by men. 15 But my love will never be taken away from him, as I took it away from Saul, whom I removed from before you. 16 Your house and your kingdom will endure forever before me[b]; your throne will be established forever.’”


Was it not Solomon to which this text is literaly refering to

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Some folks are well off. I'm just a little off.

Daniel 3:25
He answered and said: 'Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the appearance of the fourth is like a son of the gods."

Nebuchadnezzar was a pagan king. He would have seen a messenger of God as a "son of the gods." This is the Hebrew. Not capitalized at all, just "son of the gods' is written. This "son of the gods" is commonly understood as an angel or "messenger" of God. Even some Christian translations print it as such. Some say "oh that is because they are the "satanic" penned versions. Well, if thats the case than the Christians that say that are calling the God of Israel Satan. Because God's language, Hebrew, has it written as "son of the gods." God sent a messenger to protect the 3 men who deserved protection for not participating in the pagan rites. Pretty simple. Christians twist the original language to make it fit their theology. Again. It's a common theme, unfortunately.

Ok, I assume you believe this is the so called "trinity." First of all, all I need to know to dismiss that whole idea is that Constantine, an un-baptized pagan, and the Council of Nicea, decided that when Rome was falling, 300 years after the death of Jesus, and apparently this was decided by ONE VOTE. So, you'll have to decide for yourself if that is enough for you to set your whole plan of salvation on. But if thats not enough for you...

If you search the Bible you will find that when God speaks of “us” or “our,” He is addressing His angels (messengers). In fact, only two chapters later, God continues to use the pronoun “us” as He speaks with the angels. At the end of the third chapter of Genesis God says to His angels that Adam and Eve have eaten from the Tree of Knowledge and must be prevented from eating from the Tree of Life as well; for if humankind would gain access to the Tree of Life he would “become like one of us.” The Creator then instructs the angels to stand at the gate of the Garden waving a flaming sword so that mankind is unable to enter the Garden and eat from the Tree of Life.

Again, if you are set on accepting the Constantine's "trinity," and want to support your theology by cherry picking bits and pieces from here and there to do it, you are taking things out of context (again on an already mistranslated text). If you start at the beginning, this is clearly the ministering angels.

I already addressed your assertion about Isaiah. The servant songs are about Jacob/Israel.

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Chris

2 dogs, 1 parrot, 2 horses, colorful flock of egg-layers, peafowl, dairy goats, porchful of hummers, and a garden full of monarchs

I accepted him on faith, I already made my choice he will make his and take me with him if I did my part while here on earth. If I am alive when he returns, God said the faithful will know....James

Well it would be simple right? If we go with mainstream theology then it's either the "ones that are missing" or the "ones that are left". We just count them.

The secret rapture, we are going to heaven and the rest of you will be punished.....


I hope you don't believe that crapola.

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I see a very dark cloud on America's horizon,
and that cloud is coming from Rome.
- Abraham Lincoln