As a Church Should You Say No?

Thank the Lord I have never really been hungry or have worried about a place to sleep.
Having said that, I am more careful than I used to be in donating money or goods.

I think that if possible people should pay something for their needs. They need to attach some value to the product they have received.

It is not helpful to provide someone all their living needs, at some point this will end and the person is worse off than the beginning.

It IS much easier for me to help out an older, perhaps retired person. It is very hard for them to have prepared for in their earning years for the crazy expensive world we live in today. One c-t scan alone could set them back a months groceries.

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misera est servitus ubi jus est aut incognitum aut vagum
(miserable is that state of slavery in which the law is unknown or uncertain)

How poor are those claiming to be poor. It really annoys me that folks can buy the things that want but not the things they need and expect a hand out. I understand but dont care for the way my church handles donations but we do tithe some but the rest we put away and for some one truly in need we will help out.
I do like that our church and local help center has a pet food pantry, being in rescue I have placed several dogs and cats to folks who could not afford to feed them but I arranged for food to be available as many times that pet is all that person has and that person is all that pet has. 100 cats the AC needs to get involved as there is no way thats healthy for anyone.

I would have filled her tank her being on SSI if I know shes not a wasteful person, meaning theres not a pile of lottery tickets in her car or shes not in all fancy upped at the time.

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I'm a goat person, not a people person,
De @ Udderly Southern Dairy Goats
we will be adding a new breed in the spring

I agree wholeheartedly with this poster. Yes, we are to be charitable, but we are also to truly help people, not just keep putting bandaids on. Several years ago, I was a member of a medium sized church and we had several folks who hung around the fringes and always in need. One family in particular comes to mind. The husband worked at a low paying job and they were on public assistance (food stamps and CHIP) but never could seem to make their food last the month or pay their utility and phone bills. Finally, a few people from the church went over to the house to see what the problem was. We ended up working with the mother to help her stretch her food out and make better buying choices, and fixing up the house to save on utility bills. Also told them to either reduce their super premium cable service to the lowest package or stop asking for help. They were the kind of people who really wanted help, and ended up becoming integral members of the church and really bettering themselves. Another family we attempted to help in a similar way blew us off and ended up at another church for assistance.

So, yes, churches need to be wise on how to spend their charity money. My "rule" is members and regulars first, and the general public second. But to limit financial help to the basic necessities and teach people to provide for themselves instead of always coming with a hand out.

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I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it. Attributed to Voltaire

The church, just like the goverment has a duty to make sure it's donations/taxes are not wasted.

My thoughts.

Man has dominion over the animals. So when all the hungry people have been fed, we can start feeding the animals. Now the woman who has 100+ cats needs mental care I think.

As for those who are planning their emergencies in advance, they should be exposed to limits, just like the rest of us. If you need fuel in Sept. here is $25, check made out to the fuel supplier; might be a good approach. Many need help.

There's a big difference in helping and supporting. If a family has hit hard times help maybe a few bucks but it also maybe someone showing them how to help themselves.

IMO, any family who needs "help" month after month after month I think I'd have to say you are supporting them, not helping.

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Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!

Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett

Rather than giving money. let church members that are so inclined give her their surplus cat food if they wish. I have a problem with people getting money for pets when there are children going hungry nearby.

Our church has some guidelines on income already in place, with amounts of help available if we have it.

BUT--if you are able bodied you will be offered work instead. We comply with all the labor laws and taxes to do this.

You'd be surprised how many decide they don't need the help.

If they are believers we also counsel them that they should be working to become givers rather than takers. That applies to believers at all income levels. You might not have money but can offer a service to another person.

But basically if you are physically fit, mentally able, and jobs are available we don't help except in extraordinary circumstances. Surprise medical bill--we help. Spent your money on cable and can't pay the light bill--we don't.

90% of people can help themselves pets cant. A child can get fed at school, or speak on hunger, critters get shot for hunting food.

Dont get me wrong I would feed a kid over a critter hands down, seen too many starved pets and fat kids in poor communities so maybe my perspective is a bit diluted

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I'm a goat person, not a people person,
De @ Udderly Southern Dairy Goats
we will be adding a new breed in the spring

I agree with this. There are plenty out there who are more than willing to take advantage of the Church.

Having said that, I recently heard a preacher say that if the Church were taking care of the needy as Christ commanded, there would be no need for government welfare programs.

It is incumbent upon the Church to help the truly needy but church leaders also have a responsibility to be good stewards of God's money.

Well, maybe it's more responsible for her to ask for help, if she's gonna need it, in the summer when the costs of propane are down a little than once it's already cold. Think a church has to look at the whole situation and decide what they can do, for who, and when.
Just cause you know your bills are gonna be $X doesn't mean you're going to have $X, and if there's some legitimate reason why she doesn't and won't have $X, I think it's probably better that she asks the church in advance of the day she needs it. If the church can't help, then it can't, whatever the reason why, but wouldn't you rather have a couple months to decide, as a church, if this is a place to help, then to have to decide when the weather's below freezing and the propane tank's already empty?

Once we were asked to contribute 10% of our income to charity. We said absolutely not. If you are planning on being as independent as possible 10% was/is way more than we could or can afford and I believe that most people can afford. Independence involves living without consumer debt, paying off mortgage, loans and student loans and saving for emergencies, retirement, unemployment, disability and medical. We are middle income people who have had up and down times. We follow a strict and detailed budget. The most we could afford to give to charity and stay on track for ourselves and our family was 1% of our net income. There have been times when the most we could spare was .5% but we have been consistent in our charitable donations for over 30 years. I don't have the exact figure but this means we have given close to $40,000 to charity. I know there are people who are in great need but I also know that there are those who scam the system. It is hard but necessary to separate them. In the end even if we do not give to everyone who asks we are helping all because for us to take care of ourselves helps others in a different way. We are not taking.

I belong to the same church as Callislamb & have also held a position as a councelor to our Bishop for several years. it is a tough job to be in a position to have to make these decisions. alot of praying goes on for sure. most important is teaching. teaching & helping needy families to be self sufficient. its a must.
Church programs are not made to be long term.
help with NEEDS not wants. love them & respect them.
The Saviors mission was a mission of service & provided the greatest example of this, but he also Taught them.
its easy to sit in Church & pass judgement on the humbled people needing help but most dont truly know what they have been thru.
let your Bishop make those financial calls, you take care of lifting them up & make them feel they have WORTH. help carry that burden. YOU will get as much out of it as they will or more than them

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HBCH CH Gotta Go Freakin Deacon
CH Andrea`s Crybaby Emma
CCH Mtn Views Art of Deception
LPRCH LPCH Big Country MoJo

When my church helps someone financially, the money goes directly to the company who is owed. If the person asks for help on a regular basis, the church requires that they complete financial planning/management classes, and sets them up with an accountability partner. They have a list of those who will take advantage, and will turn them away when it becomes obvious that this is what is happening.

One the day will will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.

Not a word in the Bible is said about cats.

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Less barking! More wagging!

not that my humble opinion means much but.....

if you follow christianity and you are a christian and you believe in Jesus and his works and his teachings. You should ask yourself "what would Jesus do?". I believe that he would have helped anyone and everyone as much as he could. I dont believe he would be picking and choosing who to help, etc. I think the whole world makes a big deal out of everything, when its really simple. just help when/if you can, and whomever you are able to help. then, you cant feel like a bad person for doing that, and you cant feel guilty because you didnt pick and choose.

I've heard of churches turning down people for just a box of donated food, merely because they didnt go to their church, or saying that they have to sit through a church service at the church just so they could get rewarded with a box of much needed food.

charity is not supposed to be prejudiced or with strings. they dont have to give cash money out to anyone, if someone needs a bill paid, call the company and pay it. if the person needs money for something ask them what its for and maybe purchase it for them.
I think give cash could be a bit more complicated, that doesnt bother me, but Food? I would NEVER turn down giving the food out of my mouth to anyone that came to my door and was hungry. thats just how I was raised. My great-grandmother had a farm and alot of kids and she loved cooking (she had a restaurant).
my grandma (her daughter) told me that her mom would make trays of biscuits and lots of yummy cream gravy and other foods during the depression and people would line up outside her house just to eat cause they were hungry. even my grandma has done more than her share of giving food and money to help others. I absolutely HATE to see people or animals go hungry. it just really bothers me.

currently, I work part-time and am a college student with a small farm that I am allowed to live on free in my old motorhome (cause I caretake the land) except I pay my own other expenses and utilities, etc. needless to say I am poor and sometimes have to go to a food bank and yet I still cook and give food to neighbors that might come over hungry. I share. thats just what I was taught to do, and better yet, I just think its the right thing to do.

again, these are all just my personal opinions and experiences. nothing more. oh, and I also need to mention that I know absolutely NOTHING about running a church operation. I am just an individual.

Yup. Wise as a serpent, harmless as a dove.

Tough balancing act....but a worthy goal.

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Taxes, in excess of what are needed to fulfill the constitutionally authorized activity of government, are theft

Having several family members who make the rounds at the different churches in their area, getting help and then moving along when it is dried up, I am sympathetic to the dilemma for churches. With the way the economy is today, there are so many in congregations that are in bad places, and offerings are down. It is nice to say that you should help everyone, but when the church has limited resources, I do believe that they are responsible for using those resources as wisely as possible. Depending on the situation with the family in need, I don't see anything wrong with requesting some volunteer work or some kind of payback in time to the church. I think that offering financial planning classes is a great thing that church's can do to help their congregation. Trying to sort out those who are doing what they can but need a little extra help from those who make a lifestyle out of mooching is tricky.

As an aside, my sister had been attending a church regularly and they fell on hard times when her husband lost his job. She asked the church for help to pay a utility bill and they said they couldn't help her. But at the service the next Sunday they were soliciting money to help the pastor and his wife adopt a child from overseas. I agree with the people who said that there should be a standard policy on how help is given, and that it is applied fairly to everyone.

Our church has some rules set in place for this very reason. A plan of action before the need arise. No money is ever directly given out. Doesn't matter IF your a member or just attend church regular they won't keep helping month after month with out some pretty good reasons.

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"He who is harmony with Nature hits the mark without effort and apprehends the truth without thinking."- Confucius