How to size tractor equipment?

Bottleneck · #1 12/06/14, 12:41 AM

OK guys, I have a couple Minneapolis Moline z's that have been in the family since the 60's and the 70's. One is still up and running, the other needs work to be usable again, mostly replacing parts that were pulled for the other. One has a three point, the other has a loader (which has been it's primary purpose for about as long as I can remember.) The only time i remember it being used to garden was when I was little and my parents still did a garden. Unfortunately I don't still have the trip plow my dad used.

I looked up the specs and it has 32 horse at the drawbar, and can pull 2 or 3 14" plows, which is fine and dandy, but I have no clue as far as how big a cultivator, mower, etc that it can handle without just hooking up and seeing if it can. And dad ain't here to ask anymore. So I guess it comes down to this: how do I size attachments for tractors? Are the front assist tractors rated higher?

sammyd · #2 12/06/14, 04:03 AM

even the plow can be a problem depending on your soil. Most tractors were rated for pulling so many bottoms in nice sandy loam but if you have some clay you may need to count on pulling one less bottom. And pulling a trailer plow or a 3 point plow will change things as will the difference between old sod and corn or garden ground.
The newer small tractors are a bit lighter and the 4wd is nice to have to replace the weight.
I pull a 4 bottom trailer plow with an old Farmall 656 and when I pull that with my newer New Holland that has more ponies I have to have it in 4wd to keep going.

A 3 bottom mounted plow would probably work OK for garden ground, an 8 foot tandem disc, 6 foot brush hog.

I've pulled a 12 foot tandem disc with a 35 HP machine but in good soil when it dug in I was a little underpowered and had to lift the disc a little to keep going, especially on the hills.

rockyriver · #3 12/06/14, 07:11 AM

I don't know how big you can go...
but I think the following equipment will work just fine
6' rotary mower
6' finishing/grooming mower
6' box blade
I like the hint above about the plow, I'd suggest dropping to 2 blades to start with.
6' disc

I keep my eyes open for good used stuff... and sometimes very well worn used stuff!
new equipment is high priced for me... buying used, I can probably get most of my money back if I resell it!
enjoy the process

citxmech · #4 12/06/14, 04:20 PM

Your tractor has a pto and drawbar but no 3pt, right?

FWIW, My Massey with 45hp and pulls a 7' flail mower just fine. Might bog down every once in a while when I hit tall wet canary grass stands, but nothing raising the mower a bit and making a second pass doesn't fix.

I would think that front assist would actually reduce your available power a bit - more power used to move you rather than run the implement, right?

What's your source for drawbar mowers and cultivators btw?

Bottleneck · #5 12/06/14, 05:24 PM

Great info guys. I got to thinking and I remember dad running a big scraper with it, would have been at least a six foot.

One has a 3pt, but both have a PTO. If it's something I don't need very often, I'd probably just rent it until I find a cheap one on Craigslist or something.

There is an old 5 bottom plow and a single row disc that's on the new property, i think they are 14" plows and a 12 foot disc. not 100% sure on their sizes but with a little work they would be usable again. Then maybe I can find someone that would trade for something that's the size I need.

sammyd · #6 12/07/14, 04:21 AM

you might be able to pull that 12 footer if it's a single disc.

bigjon · #7 12/07/14, 07:09 AM

ah old tractors and their tools! I run 2 fergusons-1 a te20-with a loader,1 a to30.plow and plant with both.the 20 has 2 bottom 12's,the 30 has 2bottom 14's.use a 7 ft double disc behind either one.depending on your soil-clay-muck-rocky-old pasture?mine is sandy loam,a 20 or 30 hp tractor is all u would need for gardening-mines 2 acres.shop carefully for equipment,location-condition-can u get parts?if u need more help pm me please.

Bottleneck · #8 12/08/14, 02:12 AM

Uh, old pasture. The little garden I had this year I had to go over multiple times with my David Bradley's plow and disc to get it satisfactory...

And I measure that plow and disc today the disc is just over 8 foot, and yeah, just a single row. No clue on who made it though.

The plow is a case 5 bottom 16 incher, so probably not going to work. Also, neither the plow or the disc are 3 point, you say it changes stuff, but how so? Only difference I see is that it doesn't use the tractors weight.

Bottleneck · #9 12/08/14, 02:14 AM

How to size tractor equipment? - Shop Talk

sammyd · #10 12/08/14, 01:14 PM

what you have there is a disc plow which is totally different than a disc in the sense I was talking about and will require considerably more HP than your Z. Both those implements do the same thing and are for initial tillage. You may find some interest for the disc plow on certain collector sites such as yesterdays tractors. Been in and around farms for over 40 years and never seen one of those in use other than at the antique shows.

Quote:

Only difference I see is that it doesn't use the tractors weight.

Correct, mounting the implement on the 3 point and having the draft adjustment allows the tractor to pull the implement more efficiently by basically shifting the weight according to the books.

Bottleneck · #11 12/08/14, 05:32 PM

OK, this newbie didn't know that about the disc. I always figured that they were just different names for the same thing.

Maybe I should start a that in gardening about this, but if I have choice for what to look for as far as getting garden ground ready, what would you guys suggest? I have heard it's not good to over-plow because it kills the soil quality. From my readings this evening, it sounds like a chisel plow, and then a (non plow) disc or other harrow. I could rent a PTO powered rototiller, but I hear that's harder on soil than a mold board.

bigjon · #12 12/08/14, 05:50 PM

on your old pasture the tractor u put that rented tiller on better have down pressure or its going to bounce-a lot.breakage-not good.chisle plow requires horsepower(more drag)single bottom plow after a soaking rain should be easier.

sammyd · #13 12/09/14, 09:21 AM

For breaking old sod I would go against the no-till gurus. I would put a 2-14 behind that Z and find a nice 6 or 8 foot tandem disc to drag around after plowing. You could scare up a nice old 3 pt. cultivator and move the points around to make your own sort of chisel plow for next year. Hard to find a real one small enough for smaller tractors.

A lot of the older tractors had fairly steep 1st gears that make them not really suitable for running a tiller.

Bottleneck · #14 12/17/14, 10:05 PM

huh, the app has been refusing to post...

I think that the plan will be to look for a 2x14 plow and a disc, but rent if i don't find one before its time to do ground work. tiller will be last resort, but how slow do you need to go? its not supposed to be able to top 3mph in first.

on another note, I was recently down at my grandparents where the tractors are waiting for me to finish there and bring them up north, but i came across a homebuilt 3pt frame that my dad built forever ago that has three middle buster plows on it. (and yes I had to do research on the middle busters) It was so far out of the way i had forgotten about it! I think that I could use it for chisel plows and to mount some cultivator points onto it.

bigjon · #15 12/30/14, 05:17 PM

bottleneck?where u located?might loan u 2bttm 12's.

Bottleneck · #16 12/30/14, 06:39 PM

Western Nebraska, close to the Wyoming border.

Allen W · #17 12/30/14, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyd

what you have there is a disc plow which is totally different than a disc in the sense I was talking about and will require considerably more HP than your Z. Both those implements do the same thing and are for initial tillage. You may find some interest for the disc plow on certain collector sites such as yesterdays tractors. Been in and around farms for over 40 years and never seen one of those in use other than at the antique shows.

Correct, mounting the implement on the 3 point and having the draft adjustment allows the tractor to pull the implement more efficiently by basically shifting the weight according to the books.

"what you have there is a disc plow"

That would be called a one way here, a disc plow has bigger discs and is set up and spaced like a molboard plow.