How to block pesticides from a farmer?

jtishhouse · #1 04/17/14, 12:28 PM

My wife and I have a six acre property, and the whole west side of our property is neighbored by a huge acreage of wine grapes. The 70+ year old grape farmer is a very nice guy, but he very liberally uses pesticides on his grapes. My hope is that he will retire soon and that he won't do grapes anymore (his house is nearby, and he does pretty much the whole thing by himself, but he's starting to get too old for it). But my fear is that he will sell it in the future and it will continue to be used and abused with pesticides.

The main issue is that the wind comes from the west off of Lake Michigan through our property most of the time, so those pesticides are probably easily blowing onto our land. I don't want to interrupt his way of life, but I don't want his way of life to interrupt mine either. What I want to do is plant some sort of fast-growing tree or hedge all along that side of my property to serve as a wind break and hopefully catch most of the pesticides from blowing further onto my land.

Does anyone have any suggestions on what would be the best thing to plant along that side that will both grow FAST and serve as a good windbreak?

Thanks,

Jarrod

Paquebot · #2 04/17/14, 04:44 PM

Are you certain that it's pesticides and not fungicides? I'd find out what they are first, especially since there are also organic pesticides for grapes.

Martin

jtishhouse · #3 04/17/14, 04:58 PM

All I know is it's fully conventional, not organic, so whatever he's using is NOT good for me and my family and our land. When I get a chance, I will ask him exactly what he uses to better understand it, but in the mean time I still need to put something in to help prevent it from coming onto my land.

Paquebot · #4 04/17/14, 05:16 PM

There is nothing organic which will stop the flow of air and whatever it contains. The only 100% sure method would to completely inclose your property in a glass or plastic bubble. I'm not joking, that is the only way. No shrubs, vines, or trees will totally stop air movement. But I do suggest that you find out what is chasing you before you run too far to find your way back.

Martin

jtishhouse · #5 04/17/14, 05:24 PM

I am well aware that I cannot fully stop them from blowing over onto my land - that's not what I'm asking for in this thread. What I want to know is what will serve as a good windbreak to help keep what I can at bay. Some sort of fast-growing tree, or shrub, that will "catch" some of the pesticides/herbicides/whatever from coming onto my land. If anyone has any experience in this, or has a good recommendation, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Jarrod

Paquebot · #6 04/17/14, 05:51 PM

You'll find a selection of fast-growing trees at: www.alistaday.com/fastest-growing-trees/
Look it over and decide what you want your tree wall to look when it is finally somewhat effective as a windbreak.

Martin

geo in mi · #7 04/18/14, 06:58 AM

I would consider Armur privet, the usual privet you see in formal, trimmed hedges. http://www.directgardening.com/detai...ProductID=6816 It may take a while to establish, so that there will be lower leaves and branches, but it should present enough leaf surface to do the job for you. Privet doesn't have to be trimmed as a formal hedge... Keep in mind that privet, at least in Michigan, will lose its leaves in wintertime and won't provide much protection for the early sprays.

A farmer in Michigan is required to be a licensed applicator and follow the rules as indicated on the container of each spray material. This includes buffer zones and wind drift. The Michigan Right to Farm Act will protect him, only if he has a spray drift plan on file and follows it. Of course, reality and the farmer's concern for the law(and his license) may sometimes overcome the law, and you may have to brick him once in awhile to bring him back. Maybe planting a hedge would serve as a signal that he may continue without any objection from you, so you should consider that before you plant. http://www.michigan.gov/documents/MD...P_129701_7.pdf

geo

idigbeets · #8 04/18/14, 07:04 AM

Is he overspraying? If not the drift won't be much... we have a 50 foot buffer along our organic farm... no problems with drift and overspray from the 2 neighbors.....

jtishhouse · #9 04/18/14, 08:05 AM

Thanks for the help everyone! I talked with him last night after I got home. He said he usually only sprays, at most, four times a year. He couldn't pinpoint for me which exact sprays he uses, because he said it varies with the season. He did say that he tries to be careful to do it when there is little to no wind, but on very rare occasions it's critical for him to do it regardless of weather conditions. It felt good talking to him at least, and that he will be careful. We may wait a year since this is our first season here, to see how much it will affect us, if at all, before doing anything. I do appreciate all of your help!

Savrens · #10 04/18/14, 12:24 PM

Martin;

" But I do suggest that you find out what is chasing you before you run too far to find your way back."

I had a good belly laugh at that quote. That would be a good signature line.

MNBobcat · #11 04/18/14, 12:35 PM

The pesticides sprayed on grapes usually have a "CAUTION" label which means they are considered to have low toxicity. A "WARNING" label is considered to have a medium toxicity.

The farmer can change out the spray nozzles on his sprayer to have a low-drift nozzle which will cut down on possible drift. There is really no reason he couldn't do that to help alleviate your concerns. Its not expensive.

By law, anything he sprays has to stay on his property.

LoonyK · #12 04/18/14, 12:54 PM

Whatever you decide to plant, plant them close together so they fill in fast and help mitigate some of the drift.

mrs whodunit · #13 04/18/14, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNBobcat

By law, anything he sprays has to stay on his property.

LOL Yeah right.

MNBobcat · #14 04/19/14, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrs whodunit

LOL Yeah right.

Please stop being patronizing. I'm a licensed pesticide applicator and know something of which I speak.

The following is some general info for anyone reading the topic.

Laws vary by state but in general it is the law which means you have legal recourse. That doesn't mean going to court, it means contacting the State and having someone come out to your property. Obviously the law doesn't stop drift from happening, but it does place requirements on the applicator and if you can show pesticide damage on anything you're growing you can generally demand reimbursement for the crop loss/damage.

You can also go to driftwatch.org and register your property as a no spray zone and obtain signs for putting around your property.

Nothing anyone can plant is guaranteed to keep pesticides that are drifting from coming onto your property. When wind hits a row of trees it causes rotors to come off the top of the trees -- which means it could very well push the pesticide to a higher elevation and it may continue its course on to your property. There are other factors such as wind speed, temperature, temperature inversions and humidity that can effect the drift. Drift can travel long distances. A half mile or more. Plus your county may spray ditches for weeds which can be another source of drift.

Its pretty tough to solve it by trying to plant wind blocks when drift can come from so many different locations. But there may be some benefit and its better than not doing anything. I think the best solution is to ask the farmer to only spray when the wind is the opposite direction of the property or no wind. If the weather doesn't cooperate and he has to spray then perhaps he could call ahead of time so that you (the OP) can keep your house closed up.

As I mentioned earlier, everything I spray on my grapes is considered low toxicity and requires very little personal protection be worn by the applicator (though I choose to wear a full tyvek suit and respirator) The most toxic thing I spray can damage a person's eyes so eye protection needs to be worn. Most have a reentry period of not more than a day.

The thing about wind is it can be totally calm at 0 to 20 or 30 feet off the ground and then have a fairly strong breeze above that. Its easy to check by going to Walmart and get a kit for kid's party balloons with a helium tank. Release a balloon and see what it does. The farmer could do that before spraying, too.

farmerDale · #15 04/19/14, 10:47 PM

When non farmers see people out spraying, they often panic, making assumptions based on some bloggers site, or what have you.

We farmers have crops that are inches away from crops of a different type. When spraying for weeds as an example, and the crop beside yours is susceptible to what it is you are using, you are mindful of wind direction, and if done correctly, you will not see the herbicide drift into the neighbors crop, even when it is literally touching yours. Even when you make a slight mistake, and the boom is a bit into the neighboring crop for whatever reason, the line is distinct, it is not like whole fields and long distances get affected.

But if you don't spray, and you see sprayers as the devil, you wouldn't know that.

Surely if you asked your neighbor what he uses, he would tell you a short list of what chemicals he sprays? Because assuming what he is spraying is harmful before knowing what it even is, is kinda silly really. And saying he is abusing his land is rich. Depending on what he is spraying, you may actually be reaping benefits of his good long term stewardship.

I am always surprised that folks seem to have trouble simply asking farmers what it is they are spraying when and why. We don't bite! lol. And we would be happy to share the why, the when, and the reasons we do what we do.

Good luck, I hope you all continue to have seemingly positive relations, and an open and understanding line of communication... And I hope you both learn from each other.

Paquebot · #16 04/19/14, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savrens

Martin;

" But I do suggest that you find out what is chasing you before you run too far to find your way back."

I had a good belly laugh at that quote. That would be a good signature line.

One can quote me on that any day without credit. It would be similar to one of Will Rogers' quotes: "If you're riding ahead of the herd, take a look back now and then to make sure that it's still there." He had another good one, "Lettin' the cat out of the bag is a whole lot easier than puttin' it back in."

As for Dale's reply on this thread, it's very close to being granted my first "Like" but can't when it's the same thoughts that I might write and I can't "Like" myself! The author of my current signature line, who was a personal friend and thus need not be referenced, also said, "There is nothing more uncommon than common sense." How apropos!

Martin

Vosey · #17 04/19/14, 11:40 PM

I've seen many wind breaks made of cyprus around the orchards, vineyards and other agricultural areas between them and I-5 in Oregon. I've heard the vineyards use them to filter the pollution from the highway they don't want on their grapes.

Sounds like you made a great start talking with the farmer, hope it all goes well and you have nothing to worry about.