I would like to go no till on our 2 acres of vegetable garden to keep all the microorganisms in place and help build soil using cover crops and compost but, not sure how to go about it.
I have seen where some people are putting down newspaper and covering that with compost then planting in the compost. I think that would work on a few hundred square feet but, on two acres?
I use cover crops and usually plow them under Along with composted manure then run the tiller over the turned soil. Then we mulch with plastic, laying it down with a mulch layer. Would a plastic mulcher be able to lay down plastic mulch if I was not tilling, or would the ground get to be too hard? Would the plastic mulch defeat the purpose of not tilling?
Is it even possible to do this size garden using no till or does it become too labor intensive at some point? I know what I want to achieve but, do not know how to make it happen. Is there any information anyone is aware of out there I can look into? Thank you all.
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If it was easy, anyone could do it.
Always try to be the best but never think you are the best.
The plastic layer that was used to lay my plastic needs 8 inches of finely tilled soil to mound the beds. I have 6ft between each row & I am struggling on what to do between the rows. I am leaning towards cow peas, just not sure how well they will compete with my fescue. I know the cowpeas should thrive in my hot sandy soil, but can they grow faster than fescue. And will i be able to see the snakes & such as i walk between my rows? On the up side fescue goes dormant at 90 degrees & our first 90 degree day is suppose to be tomorrow--- good for slowing the fescue but bad sign of what is to come again this yr.
No till farming is usually a term used by people who use round up and other chemicals. The type of organic no till that you are talking about would require massive amounts of mulch and cover. i dont think it is practical for large application.
I can't find how big Helen and Scott Nearing's garden was. I know they used a deep mulch method but don't have the book to find out how they did it.
I don't use mulched beds in anything near that big. My mulch gardens are small, 30 x 30 feet and about 10 x 16 feet. The big 1/4 acre garden gets tilled then beds are laid out. Not saying it's not possible to do it on 2 acres but it would be labor intensive until you get enough mulch down to smother all the weeds. The mulch would have to be replaced each year.
You might want to check out French Intensive Gardening and square foot gardening.
I think forerunner adds compost to that much acreage if not more. you might want to check out the extreme composting thread in the survival forum. You definitely might want to check out intensive gardening practices. I increased my production with little increase in acreage. I don't till, I use deep beds, companion planting, intercropping, and mulch. I put up enough for our family from season to season and feed 4-5 more families in the same amount of space that I used to be able to only provide for us when I was row cropping. My soil is much healthier and has a whole lot more tilth even in the pathways vs. when I tilled. Blessings, Kat
I don't till but I use pigs. They root up the top few inches. I don't know if that counts as tilling though. I love my pigs because I dont have to do any work, they fertilize as they work and they taste great.
You might experiment with some ground covers. I had good success by planting clover. When it was up and going, I made some small furrows and planted corn. The clover and corn grew well together. I can't say it kept the corn totally weedfree, but it was better than the rest of the garden. I might try it with the potatoes this year...except they are already planted. Clover isn't cheap.
If the main concern is not to disturb the micro-organisms, you might want to learn how they came to be so important when most were not there originally. If there's a single earthworm in the entire garden, it's no longer natural.
Using compost alone, it would need to be at least 6" deep to smother or prevent germination of annuals. Most perennials would still come up through it and you'd need to open up furrows in the original soil for the planting. For two acres, you'd need 43,560 cubic feet. Not practical.
Laying down plastic would mean leaving spaces between for planting and nothing to prevent weeds from coming up in between. If no space left between, entire two acres would have to be covered by overlapping each roll and cutting holes later for planting. Not practical.
Anything is possible, and some things are, well, rather worth the trouble, even.
Personally, I'm using the technology that is available today, to build soil that can be managed by hand, tomorrow, so to speak.
There is some quantity of energy required to accomplish this, and some hours spent, but fertile soil is the ultimate wealth, and there will come a day when real wealth once again commands the respect that it held before the notion of leisure time was ever introduced to the masses.
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“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III
Contact your local department of Urban Forestry and ask if they can deliver their loads to your house. Plastic Sheeting can be purchased for around $250-$900/acre depending on the thickness.
I have 4 mil blast plastic under my 4000sq ft garden with 6 inches of wood chip/leaf mulch on top it is doing a fantastic job of killing the weeds that were 3 feet tall before I laid it down. I didn't bother to mow, weed whack or till the area.
Before I plant I will probably pull up the plastic sheeting and just use the mulch to suppress future weed growth.
Although I will admit in some of the area's that I mulched but didn't use the sheeting the weeds are poking through finally. Then again I didn't mow or anything so I'm not surprised.
Maybe you can explain how 1613.3 cubic yards, or 161 10-yard truckloads, of compost would be practical if one doesn't have it.
Martin
Maybe you would have told me, when I first began my own composting endeavors, that my ambitions weren't practical........
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“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III
I use cover crops and usually plow them under Along with composted manure then run the tiller over the turned soil. Then we mulch with plastic, laying it down with a mulch layer. Would a plastic mulcher be able to lay down plastic mulch if I was not tilling, or would the ground get to be too hard? Would the plastic mulch defeat the purpose of not tilling?
I believe you could just chop the green manure and leave it on top as the mulch. I love to hear about folks considering these techniques. My advice would be to start small, do what you know works for you, and experiment in small patches to develop what will work for you in the future.
Problem with planting a cover crop is that it does not go hand-in-hand with no-till and an established field or pasture. Seed can't be merely spread and expect it to grow and crowd out everything else. In PA, the thistles, dandelions, dock, quack, and other perennials will not be affected in the least. You can either kill them chemically or manually. You will never be able to find a cover crop which will do it for you. If you want to use it this year, do not roto-till as that would multiply the number of weeds. Plow everything under with a moldboard plow. Plant in rows wide enough for your tractor to cultivate and then use a hoe to take care of anything that comes up in the rows. Failing those suggestions, there is not much that you can do to turn 2 acres of fallow field into a weedless garden while doing nothing to disrupt the life cycles of the existing vegetation.
I believe you could just chop the green manure and leave it on top as the mulch. I love to hear about folks considering these techniques. My advice would be to start small, do what you know works for you, and experiment in small patches to develop what will work for you in the future.
The one straw revolution is interesting and I have seen it before. I am not arguing with his methods but, I would have a problem finding my cucumbers in a maze of other vegetation and probably step on more then I harvested. I would like to get my soil to what they are showing here:
If you watch the video and see how the no till soil holds together compared to the conventional tilled soil it is amazing. Also how much more water the no till can absorb then the conventional.
This fellow is also using no till and is chemical free and as great soil that is building more organic matter each year. Also look at what he is saying about his Nitrogen level as per soil tests and just how much corn he is growing on that land.
Couldn't find the video I wanted but, he is saying his nitrogen level is at 10 in the soil tests which should only allow him to grow ten bushel to the acre or something like that while he is actually getting 150 plus bu/ acre yield.
Now I do not have the land they have and I am not looking to farm exactly as they do but, I do want to adopt some of those principles if possible.
__________________
If it was easy, anyone could do it.
Always try to be the best but never think you are the best.
Organic no till is being done on various farms, Rodale Institute has a good book about it, although it's for larger scale.
I assume you're familiar w/ the basic principles of no till. The problem arises on how to kill the cover crop easily without tillage or herbicide. Right now it's rolling or cutting it at the right time. You can cut by hand, but will still be left w/ a lot of residue that will be difficult to plant (direct sow) into. Transplants can be done, you'll be disturbing the soil anyhow to do it.. (so why not till the cover crop down then).
Honestly w/out the proper roller/crimper, seed drill and very careful selection of cover cropping I do not see how practical it is to do a no till on 2 acres. I think you're just as well served by doing good crop rotations, cover cropping, and amending w/ compost/manure/leaves etc etc.
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